Bullseye
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After just reading this its made me think. When i get a vector to threat reading from AWACS, it looks easier to find that threat using the HSD rather than the FCR. I dunno, what do you guys do when finding a threat in relation to bullseye? do you just use your FCR cursor?
Besides setting the Sim to have AWACS call bearing in place of bullseye, there is a method to use the HSI to develop a heading/intercept from your current location. It’s fairly easy to use, but does take practice. I’m not very good at it, and am not certain I remember the steps (I too rely on AWACS calling bearing), but perhaps someone will elaborate on how the bullseye/HSI intercept works.
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I am not ready yet to use bullseye, so my settings are for Bearing and distance……
I used to identify quickly the bearing with HMCS, and not the HSI. Well, I am maybe saying BS here… Most part of the time my SA is very low related to “where the threats are” -
For easier understanding. Imagine a N/S line which always crosses the Bullseye. Comparing to that you get bearing and distance. 271 07 is BE position of your radar cursor. If compare with N/S line you can see it is almos perfectly west to BE about 07 with is half of distance between you and BE.
http://kepkezelo.com/images/q8ksrzpv9l5262i395vu.pngThis helps me out. Can you draw the 271° angle, just like you drew the 158° angle? And how did you know in which direction to draw the N/S lines?
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@jc1:
This helps me out. Can you draw the 271° angle, just like you drew the 158° angle? And how did you know in which direction to draw the N/S lines?
He already did …. it’s the green line. E/W = 270 = ~271.
Edit,
Well, more or less. The line wasn’t drawn. See below.
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He already did …. it’s the green line. E/W = 270 = ~271.
Edit,
Well, more or less. The line wasn’t drawn. See below.
OK, one more thing. How do you determine which direction to draw the N/S lines?
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Look at the HSD. Flag on the inner ring is N, long line is S, short lines are E & W.
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Look at the HSD. Flag on the inner ring is N, long line is S, short lines are E & W.
Finally got the whole picture. Thanks to all the guys who helped me out on this.
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If you ever do VOR/TACAN navigation or polar graphs in geometry class bullseye reference makes much more sense. Despite the direction sounding words it’s all location. Maybe you can think of the bullseye grid like a circular spider web. Some fibers originate from the center and extend in radial directions and others go in concentric rings. Position on the spiderweb is the closest intersection of a radial fiber and circular fiber. The intersection of the northeast fiber (the fiber that extends from the center outward northeast) and the 20 centimeter ring fiber is an understandable position.
Bullseye is such a system stated in the order radial, distance. North, 30 miles. South-east, 15 miles. West by north-west, 116 miles. In plain English: “The indicated point is 30 miles north of bullseye.” Of course this is military communication and not plain English so north becomes 3-6-0 and 30 miles becomes thirty. “Bandit Bullseye 360 thirty (or three-zero).”
But you aren’t Bullseye, you’re Cowboy 1-1 who has his own arbitrary position as well. What is the relative displacement of a point 035 110 from 172 069? Good luck sister! Seriously it’s hard so don’t feel bad. What works for me is realizing I don’t need a supreme level of precision in most situations (notice AWACS does some healthy rounding as it is). Step one is to get the FCR cursors in the general area so fine matching can begin.
First I convert the BZ call into a more reasonable English format (while still retaining the precise one for later). “070 35” becomes “east of BZ pretty close.” Hopefully on HSD both the north arrow (you can see it at the 2 oclock position on the innermost ring in the above picture) and the bullseye blue symbol are both displayed. Then I imagine the “spiderweb” mental overlay on the BZ and aligned with north. My mind picks a spot a short distance when I think is roughly east of the symbol on the HSD image. I then slew the FCR (and turn the plane if necessary) to try to place the cursor over my mental HSD spot. Then I try to match radial numbers as it gets closer to my imaginary spot (and I revert back to the more precise value AWACs said). It should be pretty easy to find this “radial road” presuming I can see the BZ symbol and estimate which direction north and therefore 070 are from it.
The next step is to slide the cursor along this “radial road” toward or away until the range number matches.
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Besides setting the Sim to have AWACS call bearing in place of bullseye, there is a method to use the HSI to develop a heading/intercept from your current location. It’s fairly easy to use, but does take practice. I’m not very good at it, and am not certain I remember the steps (I too rely on AWACS calling bearing), but perhaps someone will elaborate on how the bullseye/HSI intercept works.
You guys help me a lot to finally understand how to read bullseye ownship bearings and bullseye radar cursor bearings. Thanks again. During all that, I came across this website, which explains a method on how the bullseye/HSI intercept works. Maybe some of you have seen it already, but anyway, here it is: www.combatsim.com/htm/aug99/bullseye.htm
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Doesn’t AWACS switch from bull to BRA calls inside SRM ranges?..it should.
The way I think of bullseye is same as a TACAN - except that the bearing to ownship is always bearing FROM the station/bull…what would really be helpful and is missing from the display is a North arrow, like in the TFLIR display - hope there’s one in the real jet. When running intercept on a bullseye call remember you actually want to steer your radar cursors - not your ownship position; use ownship for reporting only. Remembering this alone will make the intercept go much smoother and quicker because you will build your radar picture sooner. You can jink left/right and watch your cursor bearing head toward the direction of the bogey bearing - at least this is a fair way to get the hang of it until the geometry becomes more instinctive from the call alone.
I’m still getting the hang of using bullseye myself, but I’m coming along. You just have to use it. A lot.
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Doesn’t AWACS switch from bull to BRA calls inside SRM ranges?..it should.
The way I think of bullseye is same as a TACAN - except that the bearing to ownship is always bearing FROM the station/bull…what would really be helpful and is missing from the display is a North arrow, like in the TFLIR display - hope there’s one in the real jet. When running intercept on a bullseye call remember you actually want to steer your radar cursors - not your ownship position; use ownship for reporting only. Remembering this alone will make the intercept go much smoother and quicker because you will build your radar picture sooner. You can jink left/right and watch your cursor bearing head toward the direction of the bogey bearing - at least this is a fair way to get the hang of it until the geometry becomes more instinctive from the call alone.
I’m still getting the hang of using bullseye myself, but I’m coming along. You just have to use it. A lot.
Last time I set use AWACS bullseye about 20-30 nm to you switched AWACS (in FF) to bearing and distance to you but in comms many times you could hear bullseye comms to other AC even you did not set it.
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Doesn’t AWACS switch from bull to BRA calls inside SRM ranges?..it should.
The way I think of bullseye is same as a TACAN - except that the bearing to ownship is always bearing FROM the station/bull…what would really be helpful and is missing from the display is a North arrow, like in the TFLIR display - hope there’s one in the real jet. When running intercept on a bullseye call remember you actually want to steer your radar cursors - not your ownship position; use ownship for reporting only. Remembering this alone will make the intercept go much smoother and quicker because you will build your radar picture sooner. You can jink left/right and watch your cursor bearing head toward the direction of the bogey bearing - at least this is a fair way to get the hang of it until the geometry becomes more instinctive from the call alone.
I’m still getting the hang of using bullseye myself, but I’m coming along. You just have to use it. A lot.
Just like in the real jet, there is a north marker on the inner range ring of the HSD.
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Doesn’t AWACS switch from bull to BRA calls inside SRM ranges?..it should.
It does. But there is a huge “bug” (or hack) from day1 about radio BRAA calls in MP.
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Doesn’t AWACS switch from bull to BRA calls inside SRM ranges?..it should.
The way I think of bullseye is same as a TACAN - except that the bearing to ownship is always bearing FROM the station/bull…what would really be helpful and is missing from the display is a North arrow, like in the TFLIR display - hope there’s one in the real jet. When running intercept on a bullseye call remember you actually want to steer your radar cursors - not your ownship position; use ownship for reporting only. Remembering this alone will make the intercept go much smoother and quicker because you will build your radar picture sooner. You can jink left/right and watch your cursor bearing head toward the direction of the bogey bearing - at least this is a fair way to get the hang of it until the geometry becomes more instinctive from the call alone.
I’m still getting the hang of using bullseye myself, but I’m coming along. You just have to use it. A lot.
Yeah, it does switch to BRAA at some close range. It really is just like TACAN. ATC says “proceed direct to Kunsan TACAN 075 radial, 40 DME and hold” this is the same as Bullseye 075 40 if Bullseye was on the TACAN station.
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Just like in the real jet, there is a north marker on the inner range ring of the HSD.
….aaahhhhh…now I know what to look at - thanks!
Any such I’m missing on the radar display?
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Yeah, it does switch to BRAA at some close range. It really is just like TACAN. ATC says “proceed direct to Kunsan TACAN 075 radial, 40 DME and hold” this is the same as Bullseye 075 40 if Bullseye was on the TACAN station.
You still have to mind the sensing…usually with a TACAN you’re working with a bearing TO the station on the front side. With bullseye the bearing is always FROM the station. Which can confuse one…
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….aaahhhhh…now I know what to look at - thanks!
Any such I’m missing on the radar display?
Not directly. What you can use that may be helpful, is the B/E marker. There is a pointer on the B/E marker, which points in the direction of B/E. So if you are B/E 180/20 miles, and the marker is pointing down on the display (behind you) then you are facing south.
Once you get used to using bullseye, I find that you just keep track of which way you are going (there is a heading tape in the HUD which helps a lot) and what your current B/E is. In particular for air ops, I tend to take note of the fight axis, so that I know which way to head out (180 degrees from the fight axis) and which way to recommit after an out maneuver. I also tend to spend a lot of time checking back and forth between the FCR and HSD, so the FCR not having a north marker doesnt hurt too badly.
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usually with a TACAN you’re working with a bearing TO the station on the front side.
Only when you are using it fly directly to this TACAN aiming an overfly (which should be relatively rare, because usually you should aim a given radial and distance to join a point given in approach plate). But when you use it to know your location you are working FROM and read the tail of the needle.
So it is only confusing for ppl how are not used to use the TACAN for its 2nd primary function which it “localization” of own ship.
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Only when you are using it fly directly to this TACAN aiming an overfly (which should be relatively rare, because usually you should aim a given radial and distance to join a point given in approach plate). But when you use it to know your location you are working FROM and read the tail of the needle.
So it is only confusing for ppl how are not used to use the TACAN for its 2nd primary function which it “localization” of own ship.
Yes - if you’re on a missed approach back-course then you might find yourself using “FROM” sensing…or if ATC tells you to fly “outbound, 250 from Kxyz TACAN” then you might dial up a “FROM”. Or handing off between stations…I’ve found myself in such situations in RL - I used to overfly VORTACS and fly outbound quite a bit between stations. As I’ve flown about the USA I’ve found that depending on where you are in the country (west vs farther east) one navigation technique may be preferred over another - I learned out west…where signals are much stronger, for some reason. So I was spoiled when I moved east…
What I really like using to fix position is RNAV…“move” the station, and then use you secondary radio to tune a crossing radial - if you’re on course you always have a fix…using just one station. If you work the geometry right in selecting stations.
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Not directly. What you can use that may be helpful, is the B/E marker. There is a pointer on the B/E marker, which points in the direction of B/E. So if you are B/E 180/20 miles, and the marker is pointing down on the display (behind you) then you are facing south.
Once you get used to using bullseye, I find that you just keep track of which way you are going (there is a heading tape in the HUD which helps a lot) and what your current B/E is. In particular for air ops, I tend to take note of the fight axis, so that I know which way to head out (180 degrees from the fight axis) and which way to recommit after an out maneuver. I also tend to spend a lot of time checking back and forth between the FCR and HSD, so the FCR not having a north marker doesnt hurt too badly.
What I’m mainly looking for is a faster intuitive way to know which way to turn to a bogey call at “bull xxx at yy” without having to do math in my head…right now I tend to level-s to figure it…but now that I think, I should/could probably just slew my cursors left/right and observe the heading closure in the same manner…then execute my turn.
Once I have my pit built I’ll also have my EHSI to glance at…that will really help.