Downed by AA10A after destroying the launching aircraft again
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I this a labelling issue with the logs?
e.g. I get this for the AA-7 - so worth setting up a TE to see what they are being labelled as.
AA-7 = R-24T
AA-7R = R-24R -
the cause i think is (and maybe has always been) that when the mig-29 (and others possibly) fire/smoke balls (IE, dead but waiting to die, falling out of the sky) their radar remains active, if they are nose on, cranked (IE, not defensive) the missile can still guide up until the point where they actually blow up.
oh and, the missile’s actually do kill you if they collide with you, regardless if they are being guided or not. you can get hit by ballistic SA-2s for instance, if you don’t change course.
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Happens quite often which is impossible for a AA10A SARH
….I just want to report this happens.
I think I’ve seen this too. Also, it seems (no hard proof), that after SARH launch, lock from firing AC can be broken, then reacquired and the SARH will also reacquire the target. I thought that if guiding AC lock was broken the missile went ballistic and could not be ‘re-guided’.
Pretty sure this was happening in 4.32 and believe it is still happening in 4.33 U1.
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@Cik:
the cause i think is (and maybe has always been) that when the mig-29 (and others possibly) fire/smoke balls (IE, dead but waiting to die, falling out of the sky) their radar remains active, if they are nose on, cranked (IE, not defensive) the missile can still guide up until the point where they actually blow up.
oh and, the missile’s actually do kill you if they collide with you, regardless if they are being guided or not. you can get hit by ballistic SA-2s for instance, if you don’t change course.
This. This would be my guess. Just because your missile explodes and damages his aircraft, he could still have time that his radar is running and tracking you.
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I think I’ve seen this too. Also, it seems (no hard proof), that after SARH launch, lock from firing AC can be broken, then reacquired and the SARH will also reacquire the target. I thought that if guiding AC lock was broken the missile went ballistic and could not be ‘re-guided’.
Pretty sure this was happening in 4.32 and believe it is still happening in 4.33 U1.
It depends on the missile and how the datalink works.
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It depends on the missile and how the datalink works.
‘Depends on the missile’ …. do you mean in real life or in BMS?
I’m looking for how it’s currently modeled in BMS, right, wrong or otherwise.
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It happens randomly and I don’t ACMI every time as usually the AA10A works correctly. I normally see them launch at me and I also launch on them and they turn and beam me sometimes maintaining lock though usually they turn and run breaking lock and the AA10A flies by as I turn to beam them opposite direction. I never fly straight and level nor into a missile. The launching aircraft had actually exploded hence no way its radar was still emitting and the wingie was nose down on fire at 1k altitude. Next time I will try and get a tape. When I am engaged by Mig29A I turn labels on to watch the incoming missile. Thank you for comments and support.
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Pro tip: turn on your ACMI when you “fence in” - this way you can do more than speculate
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Why i don’t see something strange here? Unless I’m wrong in the way that the missile ain’t autonomous?
Sent from TapaTalk
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AA10A (and C) are semi-guided radar, so they should go dead immediately after the launching aircraft exits his radar gimbal ability.
being hit by an AA10A after the attacking aircraft has gone defensive should be impossible, but not always. occasionally it gets bugged, or the missile was so close when the target dropped the lock it can hit anyway.
it goes without saying that the best way to avoid being hit by missiles is to never enter the envelope, but that’s not always possible in the case you get bounced or have to close range for whatever reason.
the AA10A is quite deadly.
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They shouldn’t go dead. The fuze is still active and will explode if it passes next to an appropriate object. They shouldn’t guide however.
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They shouldn’t go dead. The fuze is still active and will explode if it passes next to an appropriate object. They shouldn’t guide however.
Just a quick question and the answer may be unknown, probably even classified in some way, but does a SARH missile like the AA-10A/C have a proximity fuse on its own, or is it the guiding aircraft that dictates when it best explodes?
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I thought that if guiding AC lock was broken the missile went ballistic and could not be ‘re-guided’.
Pretty sure this was happening in 4.32 and believe it is still happening in 4.33 U1.
IIRC, though haven’t scientifically tested or heard otherwise confirmed; Doesn’t the rwr(bms implementation) have “blind spots”? Particularly i’ll notice when I hard bank to start aggressively evading, I stop hearing the rwr chirping and then it comes back. Are you mis-interpreting that as breaking lock?
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Just a quick question and the answer may be unknown, probably even classified in some way, but does a SARH missile like the AA-10A/C have a proximity fuse on its own, or is it the guiding aircraft that dictates when it best explodes?
I don’t know for 100% sure but almost assuredly the fuze is on the missile and doesn’t rely on the platform for a command detonate.
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IIRC, though haven’t scientifically tested or heard otherwise confirmed; Doesn’t the rwr(bms implementation) have “blind spots”? Particularly i’ll notice when I hard bank to start aggressively evading, I stop hearing the rwr chirping and then it comes back. Are you mis-interpreting that as breaking lock?
It’s possible.
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They shouldn’t go dead. The fuze is still active and will explode if it passes next to an appropriate object. They shouldn’t guide however.
I guess HOJ capable SARH missiles can remain guided (if your is ECM on)…otherwise ballistic
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I am not speculating. I have also never seen an Aim7 continue to track after breaking lock.@Krause:
Pro tip: turn on your ACMI when you “fence in” - this way you can do more than speculate
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i don’t think so, and certainly not AA10A.
AFAIK the only HOJ capable in vanilla are the AMRAAM and AA12 adder(?)
AMRAAM i know for sure and AA12 i’d guess at (i was always told to shut off jammer going into burnthrough on SU27S, because of AA12 HOJ, anyway)
AFAIK nothing else is.
as far as i can tell here’s the possibilities
1. it’s bugged. personally i’ve seen stuff that makes me think it’s possible that occasionally SARH missiles behave strangely
2. you rotated into a blind spot on the RWR and thought it was dead when it actually wasn’t. personally i don’t rely on the RWR in 4.33 as it’s far from reliable (some of which is intentional, though how much i couldn’t say exactly)
3. the missile went dead as the mig rotated defensive, but it was so close it ran into you anyway after losing track
4. the mig rotated defensive and then turned offensive again to continue guidance (i don’t think there’s anything theoretically impossible about re-guiding an off-course missile… at least)
5. perhaps the most likely is what i mentioned in my first post, that the fireballing MIG was still in his radar parameters, and he managed to guide it to terminal before he exploded. i know for a fact that this does happen. whether it’s a bug or not, how common it is it’s hard to say.
in general, ^29s in 4.33 seem far more dangerous than they used to be. before the only real threat they presented was the AA11 being a good missile and a moderately high ACM ability, now however their behavior at least seems different:
-more likely to fly higher (ATO change?)
-fire far earlier than they used to against ALQ-184. whether this a radar or missile change, hard to say
-far more willing to shotgun whole missile loadfor the most part i actually avoid the NEZ shots and just go for WEZ instead. in 4.32 it was almost trivial to fly into 13nm~ range, TWS a whole formation of ^29s, cheap shot and then leave, but now it seems like that’s a very short road to death, either because they’re smarter, the weapons were upgraded, or maybe the radar.
like krause says, without ACMI this is just all speculation though
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IIRC AA-10(R-27R,ER) was HOJable in AF…you can check BMS state in falcon editor or F4browse…