Some questions about Mavericks
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No.
On LAU-117s, boresight each launcher/missile.
On a LAU-88A/A, boresight only the priority missile on each launcher -
could you elaborate on that please? is there a min/max range that should be use to borsight?
also, is there a way in the campaign that the default loudout of 6 mavs(3/stations) is replaced by 1/station?
As best as I have been able to determine, a boresight will only complete fully once the ranging scale is visible on the WPN page.
See here for example:
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Why reset the point track on the TGP to bore sight the second MAV?
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Why reset the point track on the TGP to bore sight the second MAV?
If I don’t TMS up after switching to the second missile, I don’t get the “Handoff in Progress Station X” message on the WPN page, see the above video at 1:59 minutes. It may well be I don’t need to, but I prefer to see the message to be sure.
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Usually Initial boresighting is performed on the ground in order to make it much easier to boresight in the air, but boresight in the air is necessary anyway, as the ground boresight is range limited.
Just wondering if the boresighting procedure in real life is so clustermonkey? It seems to me if I was a weapon designer or customer I would not accept what we see in BMS 4.33. I can understand the requirement to 1st lock the target with the aircraft systems, then select ONE OSB button on the WPN page, label it ALIGN. Slew and lock with the weapon, then OSB “NEXT” to the next station until all unaligned stations are done without ever having to unlock the TGP. Thoughts?
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You can already do it in BMS, kinda : start with the TGP page on one MFD and anything you want on the other MFD, except the WPN page.
Lock a target with the TGP, then select the WPN page on the left MFD. Slew the Maverick seeker, lock, depress BSGT. Switch to the 2nd Maverick station, lock, depress BSGT. Done. It’s pretty quick and you don’t have to go through the clumsy hand-off caution clearing process. -
Just wondering if the boresighting procedure in real life is so clustermonkey? It seems to me if I was a weapon designer or customer I would not accept what we see in BMS 4.33. I can understand the requirement to 1st lock the target with the aircraft systems, then select ONE OSB button on the WPN page, label it ALIGN. Slew and lock with the weapon, then OSB “NEXT” to the next station until all unaligned stations are done without ever having to unlock the TGP. Thoughts?
BMS has it done pretty much like RL…though I seriously question boresighting a whole triple-rack’s worth of missiles using just one of them per rack.
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In my limited experience:
- covers are never on at takeoff for any variety of AGM-65 because blowing them in the air presents a hazard to wingmen.
Interesting, Stevie. Wouldn’t doing it on the ground be more hazardous( to ground crew), not to mention FOD’ing the jet?
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Interesting, Stevie. Wouldn’t doing it on the ground be more hazardous( to ground crew), not to mention FOD’ing the jet?
Not as I’ve seen it done, because the covers aren’t in place and don’t need to be blown off. Which is why I question having them there in BMS, and why we seem to default to triple mounts.
Most (not all) of my RL MAV experience is with Harrier operations, and single rail mounting (USN/USMC platforms). What we did was to use something like a runway distance marker, and before incorporation of Litening (yeah, 'm that old…) we boresighted to the HUD; so it did have to be something prominent. The reason to do it on deck is because it’s more stable, but it’s not hard and fast that one must do it that way.
As an aside, I myself have spent a goodly amount of time standing in front of fully armed jets…guns, rockets, MAVs…all pointing at me in the dark, with engines running. One gets used to it and just does the job they are there to do. That’s what MASTER ARM and all the safety pins are for - that all gets pulled at final checkers where nobody is in the hazard zone.
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The reason to do it on deck is because it’s more stable, but it’s not hard and fast that one must do it that way.
This, too, is interesting. When I first starting dealing with Boresighting, my thought was to do it on the ground(for the reason you mention),using the screen ships as “targets”. The problem was I could never get the TGP to “time in” in the 20 minute window we have. The best result I remember was when it would time in on the Cat, too late for on deck alignment.
Your post is making me wonder if I was missing something back then, and/or if RL is a bit different in this case.
The best result I’ve found is to get the TGP warming up on deck,autopowering the Mavs at WP 2, and Boresighting at Fence In. -
do you have GRD JETT Enabled ? if you do they should time out in plenty of “time in” from full RAMP start.
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do you have GRD JETT Enabled ? if you do they should time out in plenty of “time in” from full RAMP start.
I thought I did, but it’s been quite a while since I tried. I’ll check it out to confirm
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This, too, is interesting. When I first starting dealing with Boresighting, my thought was to do it on the ground(for the reason you mention),using the screen ships as “targets”. The problem was I could never get the TGP to “time in” in the 20 minute window we have. The best result I remember was when it would time in on the Cat, too late for on deck alignment.
Your post is making me wonder if I was missing something back then, and/or if RL is a bit different in this case.
The best result I’ve found is to get the TGP warming up on deck,autopowering the Mavs at WP 2, and Boresighting at Fence In.No, actually you bring up a good/valid point about launch timeline. Not only might it take time for a TGP to time in, it also takes time for the MAV itself to time in. Therefore, that time needs to be factored into the crew walk, aircraft, and launch timeline. This is RL. For boresighting on deck it really doesn’t matter what you use as a target - but the farther away that target is, the better the boresight. It just has to be something you can both see and lock. In the case of BMS where we are moslty using/modeling SNIPER it may have a longer time in than Litening or ATFLIR…I haven’t done much playing with SNIPER. Yet…but this is one more reason why I stick to just the Viper and Viper ops in BMS - it’s the only “valid” set of models currently.
Also - I should think you need to be boresighted and ready to employ weapons prior to actual “fence in”…unless I’m misunderstanding what it means to be validly “fenced”. One more reason I’m not a fan of triple racks for MAV. The Harriers employ a different TER, but only for bombs.
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do you have GRD JETT Enabled ? if you do they should time out in plenty of “time in” from full RAMP start.
…now this makes me understand the previous “safety” question…and doesn’t sound RL to me. For a couple reasons - 1) safety. 2) weapons don’t power up for JETT.
Devs should research and fix…
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In the case of BMS where we are moslty using/modeling SNIPER it may have a longer time in than Litening or ATFLIR…I haven’t done much playing with SNIPER. Yet…but this is one more reason why I stick to just the Viper and Viper ops in BMS - it’s the only “valid” set of models currently.
Also - I should think you need to be boresighted and ready to employ weapons prior to actual “fence in”…unless I’m misunderstanding what it means to be validly “fenced”.
On your first point, in the Hornet in BMS it’s the ATFLIR, and I too have assumed it’s modeled on the Sniper. The displays sure look the same as in the Dash-34. How the ATFLIR warm up time is modeled would be good to know.
As to your second point… In the Hornet in the campaign(s) you get WP2 at approx. 30 miles from the Boat. WP 3 is usually 10-15 miles off the coast, and WP4 is usually Feet Dry .I have been calling Fence In at WP3. I find with everything powered up by WP3 I can be boresighted by WP4.
I take “fenced” to mean ready to engage/attack,except for Master Arm. Whether it’s smart to wait until 15 miles off the enemy coast to fence is a question that does occur from time to time. I just haven’t found a better balance of time/distance/what needs to get done. I’ve tried boresighting at WP2, but I’m over water at that point and too far away to get a TGP visual of anything on land. I’ve also experimented with orbiting the Boat until I can boresight but that somewhat messes up mission timing. -
One of the functions of the GND JETT switch is to overcome a faulty WOW condition and deliver all weapons in the conventional manner if needed. Certainly Master SIM is sufficient as a safety factor. And as you say there are pins still in at that point.
The TGP shouldn’t take as long as it does to produce video. It’s time to function is mixed up with another LANTIRN pod delay and is excessive.
I wouldn’t be surprised that given enough time the ground crew would do a ground boresight before the pilot was even handed the jet. It’s a shame that the ground boresighting is as weird and difficult as it is in BMS.
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You can already do it in BMS, kinda : start with the TGP page on one MFD and anything you want on the other MFD, except the WPN page.
Lock a target with the TGP, then select the WPN page on the left MFD. Slew the Maverick seeker, lock, depress BSGT. Switch to the 2nd Maverick station, lock, depress BSGT. Done. It’s pretty quick and you don’t have to go through the clumsy hand-off caution clearing process.Woot Thanks Ewildcat I’ll give this a try!
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One of the functions of the GND JETT switch is to overcome a faulty WOW condition and deliver all weapons in the conventional manner if needed. Certainly Master SIM is sufficient as a safety factor. And as you say there are pins still in at that point.
The TGP shouldn’t take as long as it does to produce video. It’s time to function is mixed up with another LANTIRN pod delay and is excessive.
I wouldn’t be surprised that given enough time the ground crew would do a ground boresight before the pilot was even handed the jet. It’s a shame that the ground boresighting is as weird and difficult as it is in BMS.
When JETT is enabled (at any time) what it does is override interlocks to blow the station CADs…and station CADs only - it does not power or arm stores in any manner. Which for an F-16 means blowing the whole pylon…hadn’t thought about that before; that’s a USAF thing. Having to use GND JETT would be a serious emergency, I’m sure. But even in that case all you’d get is the voltage to the station CADs. If BMS is actually powering weapons…this sound wrong.
In order for ground crew to perform boresights the jet would have to be run up (and I mean engines running; i.e. - full internal power), and left running at/until crew man-up…so…no. Not even a chance.
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On your first point, in the Hornet in BMS it’s the ATFLIR, and I too have assumed it’s modeled on the Sniper. The displays sure look the same as in the Dash-34. How the ATFLIR warm up time is modeled would be good to know.
As to your second point… In the Hornet in the campaign(s) you get WP2 at approx. 30 miles from the Boat. WP 3 is usually 10-15 miles off the coast, and WP4 is usually Feet Dry .I have been calling Fence In at WP3. I find with everything powered up by WP3 I can be boresighted by WP4.
I take “fenced” to mean ready to engage/attack,except for Master Arm. Whether it’s smart to wait until 15 miles off the enemy coast to fence is a question that does occur from time to time. I just haven’t found a better balance of time/distance/what needs to get done. I’ve tried boresighting at WP2, but I’m over water at that point and too far away to get a TGP visual of anything on land. I’ve also experimented with orbiting the Boat until I can boresight but that somewhat messes up mission timing.Yeah…it may be called “ATFLIR”, but it’s a SNIPER model…that would drive me NUTZ!!!
Sounds like we’re on the same page…and the air timeline sounds sufficient for your scenario. I should think that “fenced” would mean all players weapons ready to employ (and/or alibis for weapons fails which may alter mission objectives) and ARMSTRONG at whatever point was briefed? Except for CAS ops…but that’s another scenario. I’m assuming you’re SEAD/DEAD or SES off the CV?