Regarding the defense capabilities of helicopters against aircrafts
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Is the type identified by AWACS? … How? …
but awacs announce the print of other hostile ac in bogey dope. e.g. mig29 or su30 etc
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In addition to my thought, I would like to bring this video where a player on a Ka-50 has the ability to shoot down an enemy helicopter or even an aircraft with an ATGM if he does not conduct the correct tactics, also in DCS on a Ka-50 I managed to shoot down an aircraft from a cannon on the meeting course (nose to nose) when hover
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In addition to my thought, I would like to bring this video where a player on a Ka-50 has the ability to shoot down an enemy helicopter or even an aircraft with an ATGM if he does not conduct the correct tactics, also in DCS on a Ka-50 I managed to shoot down an aircraft from a cannon on the meeting course (nose to nose) when hover
BMS is not a helo sim, they don’t play a big part and most of us like it just fine like that.
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This isn’t DCS, BMS is not a helo sim, and we like it just fine like that. Leave the myriad of unrealistic, unfinished half-baked crap on DCS…
So you do not admit that in real life a combat helicopter has the ability to shoot down an aircraft if it sees it?) DCS has nothing to do with it, DCS is as an example, in the same ATGM a Vortex in the Ka-50 is allowed to be used against air targets, a gun on an oncoming course also can hit an air target with a quick burst
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In rl life, and from rl local experience, an armed choppa is a deadly piece of hardware even for the best fighter, if the fighter pilot decides to engage it close (IR missiles or cannon) and this pilot is not specially trained. We had dozens cases of AH-64A/D successfully validated cannon shots during trainings on approaching or egressing Vipers after their (unsuccessful) close attack runs. So we now have special training schools and tactics in HAF, for both an attacking fighter and an defensive armed chopper, each one has its secrets and opportunities. But in general no aircraft would like to go towards a 30mm Apache cannon.
So, BMS -wise, maybe one day this would be a reality, I guess there are much higher items in priority…
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I may be wrong, as we’ve got many versions since, but I remember that Mi-24s did use to shoot at fighters in pre-BMS Falcon 4.0 versions, so you had to be cautious.
Do others remember it or is it a mild case of false memory ? -
I may be wrong, as we’ve got many versions since, but I remember that Mi-24s did use to shoot at fighters in pre-BMS Falcon 4.0 versions, so you had to be cautious.
Do others remember it or is it a mild case of false memory ?In BMS 4.35.2 i recently tried to put them on patrol on the map and tried to attack in close combat, they were inactive), armed with ATGM and unguided missiles. They didn’t even turn in the direction from which I flew, they just hovering in place and not trying to defend themselves
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Helicopters were lethal with one version……there was even a mission with a load of choppers that would shoot at you if you just took them for granted…dont remember what was doing the shooting though.
Last thing you need is something where all the choppers have magical EODAS type sensors and always detect and fire regardless and your AIM-9X only locks on from 2 ft away!
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This isn’t DCS, BMS is not a helo sim, and we like it just fine like that. Leave the myriad of unrealistic, unfinished half-baked crap on DCS…
During J-Catch conducted by US Air Force and US Army in 1979
The essence of the exercise was
To the surprise of many involved in the program, the helicopters proved extremely dangerous to the fighters when they were properly employed, racking up a 5-to-1 kill ratio over the fighters when fighting at close ranges with guns.
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but awacs announce the print of other hostile ac in bogey dope. e.g. mig29 or su30 etc
PRINT is an NCTR indication. PRINT FLANKER - means we think its a Phazotron N001 Myech pulse-doppler radar we can see, so its probably a Su-27.
So how is a Ka-50 (with no radar) or a Mi-24 (also with no radar) going to be ‘printed’ by AWACS?
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Some of us mjght remember the case of mistaken identity where an f15c driver took out a blackhawk with a spear.
This shows us that jets will certainly engage helos but from a distance.
irl going in for a visual id means they wud have 2 use heaters to take it out and expose their six on the pass.
If the heaters miss then the chopper wud have a good chance to shoot couple of heaters back and take out the jet.
Also choppers are sneaky and like to hide.
Exposing themselves to a fast moving jet wud be last thing they want.
For these reasons i dont think it wud be worth the hassle of coding it in.
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Some of us mjght remember the case of mistaken identity where an f15c driver took out a blackhawk with a spear.
This shows us that jets will certainly engage helos but from a distance.
irl going in for a visual id means they wud have 2 use heaters to take it out and expose their six on the pass.
If the heaters miss then the chopper wud have a good chance to shoot couple of heaters back and take out the jet.
Also choppers are sneaky and like to hide.
Exposing themselves to a fast moving jet wud be last thing they want.
For these reasons i dont think it wud be worth the hassle of coding it in.
14 April 1994 a very weird and tragic event where the AWACS was getting IFF responses from the 2 UH-60s but the F-15Cs were not. Lead F-15 pilot Eric Wickson flew past the lead UH-60 at 500ft and 1000ft to the left according to the account (pulling off high and over the top to avoid any forward firing ordinance) but he still VID’d it as a Hip and couldn’t make out markings and the AWACs seems to have confirmed them as Hinds despite the previous friendly IFF!
His wingman Randy May also went in close to VID them and despite multiple attempts ant IFF and communication with AWACs in the area they still somehow ended up with this catastrophe.
Both UH-60s were shot down and one was killed by an AIM-9M from ~2 miles.
Helicopters out of exercises have always been strafe rags……usually concentrating on their mission and their many threats on the ground I suspect. But the threat was there especially for A-10s that would have been near the ground…they essentially become the energy fighter in this contest.
Chopper A-A kills on fixed wing…can only think of the CIA Huey that brought down a VPAF AN-2 Colt during Vietnam with an AK.
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1. Do not use as reference to anything the DCS World.
2. In BMS sadly the helos are literally defenseless. They can’t use dispensers and the terrain is not suitable to be stealthy.
Considering how advanced planes are in BMS some helos should have in XXI. centry. MAWS which is also not modeled. -
1. Do not use as reference to anything the DCS World.
2. In BMS sadly the helos are literally defenseless. They can use dispensers and the terrain is not suitable to be stealthy. Considering how advanced planes are in BMS some helos should have in XXI. centry. MAWS which is also not modeled.
Very true…
In all versions of falcon we see choppers from both sides flying a “straight line” to their target.
IRL they sprint from cover to cover and wud be much harder to spot.
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I will seldom (if ever) go after helos unless i’m already low and it’s an area I know to be clear. Just too many manpads and low-alt weapons to chew you up for it to be worth it…
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1. Do not use as reference to anything the DCS World.
DCS it was just for an illustrative example that an attack helicopter is capable of protection from an aircraft, that’s all, I do not put DCS in a certain standard that what happens there should be in the BMS)
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I will seldom (if ever) go after helos unless i’m already low and it’s an area I know to be clear. Just too many manpads and low-alt weapons to chew you up for it to be worth it…
Yeah most of the time choppers wud keep in the defensive umbrella of ground forces they are protecting. SA19,SA7 squads ect ect.
Pretty risky ground for any jet to fly at low angels.