Solved Unexpected HARM behaviour
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@Mav-jp said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
@kyros said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
After multiple tests it seems the behaviour of the HARM is different than expected:
Setup:
- SA-2, SA-3 and SA-6 near the target steer point
- POS PB launch with in the active table only AAA (692) entered and in the tertiary table only the FCRs of the SAMS (202, 203 & 206)
Multiple times the launched HARM kills a FLAT FACE acquisition radar. This should not be possible since it is not mentioned in any of the tables.
When I select TBL 0 as tertiary table then I do get misses as expected.Oops sorry yes this is absolutly expected behavior
When you specify a FCR and when it is not found. The system automatically searches for the corresponding EWR of the same system
This is to avoid to waste a agm88
Congrats you are the first one to see that feature by himself , only 2 people in BMS team were informed about that before and you won’t find it in any manual
Use TI to avoid that behavior
So even if you only put the codes for the FCR’s in the threat tables, the HARM will still go for the accompanying acquisition radars?
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@kyros I am with you, it shouldn’t go to Flat Face since it is SA3 or SA6 EWR and it is not in the active table neither tertiary table.
Maybe SA2 has some kind of workaround to have an EWR since their Spoon Rest is VHF radar not detected by RWR. Also… there is also a hint about something related to flat face in the vault:
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@kyros said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
o even if you only put the codes for the FCR’s in the threat tables, the HARM will still go for the accompanying acquisition radars?
With Flex enabled? Of course.
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@kyros said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
@Mav-jp said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
@kyros said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
After multiple tests it seems the behaviour of the HARM is different than expected:
Setup:
- SA-2, SA-3 and SA-6 near the target steer point
- POS PB launch with in the active table only AAA (692) entered and in the tertiary table only the FCRs of the SAMS (202, 203 & 206)
Multiple times the launched HARM kills a FLAT FACE acquisition radar. This should not be possible since it is not mentioned in any of the tables.
When I select TBL 0 as tertiary table then I do get misses as expected.Oops sorry yes this is absolutly expected behavior
When you specify a FCR and when it is not found. The system automatically searches for the corresponding EWR of the same system
This is to avoid to waste a agm88
Congrats you are the first one to see that feature by himself , only 2 people in BMS team were informed about that before and you won’t find it in any manual
Use TI to avoid that behavior
So even if you only put the codes for the FCR’s in the threat tables, the HARM will still go for the accompanying acquisition radars?
Yes if it does not find the FCR first it will go for the Ewr of the same system
You need to use target isolate to prevent flex of you need it
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Guess we can set this one to solved.
In POS mode, the ALIC will load the whole SAM system regardless if you are handing off the acquisition radar or track radar. Target Isolate will be needed . -
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@Mav-jp said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
@kyros said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
@Mav-jp said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
@kyros said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
After multiple tests it seems the behaviour of the HARM is different than expected:
Setup:
- SA-2, SA-3 and SA-6 near the target steer point
- POS PB launch with in the active table only AAA (692) entered and in the tertiary table only the FCRs of the SAMS (202, 203 & 206)
Multiple times the launched HARM kills a FLAT FACE acquisition radar. This should not be possible since it is not mentioned in any of the tables.
When I select TBL 0 as tertiary table then I do get misses as expected.Oops sorry yes this is absolutly expected behavior
When you specify a FCR and when it is not found. The system automatically searches for the corresponding EWR of the same system
This is to avoid to waste a agm88
Congrats you are the first one to see that feature by himself , only 2 people in BMS team were informed about that before and you won’t find it in any manual
Use TI to avoid that behavior
So even if you only put the codes for the FCR’s in the threat tables, the HARM will still go for the accompanying acquisition radars?
Yes if it does not find the FCR first it will go for the Ewr of the same system
You need to use target isolate to prevent flex of you need it
Then what is the purpose of being able to seperately enter either the FCR or EWR? What happens now (in this case) is that there are 3 FCR’s active (from SA-2, 3 and 6) and that the HARM goes for an EWR of one of the systems. It doesn’t make any sense to me that the priority apparently goes to an EWR while there are other FCR’s active (before launch already and during the TOF of the HARM).
If the handed off threat is e.g. ‘6’ instead of ‘6T’ then it might make more sence to me but in this case the handed off threat is a AAA radar which has no related EWR and there are only FCR’s in the threat table. -
I really have to admit that at the current state the Harm chapter is less than optimal. But it is obvious that you haven’t read it.
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@Kolbe-49th said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
I really have to admit that at the current state the Harm chapter is less than optimal. But it is obvious that you haven’t read it.
Let’s please stay on topic instead of going to false accusations
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@kyros: …false accusations
SHE’S A WITCH…!!!
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@Aragorn
Says the expert on HARMS…(where did I put that video??) -
@PumpyHead said: Says the expert on HARMS…
/rimshot upon my fragile ego.
All you are doing here is showing how old you (we) are…!
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Ok a little bit of explanation here
in POS
Primary Targets :
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- If a FCR is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
- if a EWR is loaded : Load the EWT and the FCR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
- load the threat directly and alone if not part of a SAM system
Secondary Target
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- If a FCR is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
- if a EWR is loaded : Load the EWR and the FCR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
- load the threat directly and alone if not part of a SAM system
in HAS
Primary Targets :
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- Load The single threat alone
Secondary Target
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- Load the single threat alone
in HAD
Primary Targets :
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- Load single threat
Secondary Target
- Load Priority Targets
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@Mav-jp said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
Ok a little bit of explanation here
in POS
Primary Targets :
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- If a FCR is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
- if a EWR is loaded : Load the EWT and the FCR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
- load the threat directly and alone if not part of a SAM system
Secondary Target
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- If a FCR is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
- if a EWR is loaded : Load the EWR and the FCR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
- load the threat directly and alone if not part of a SAM system
in HAS
Primary Targets :
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- Load The single threat alone
Secondary Target
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- Load the single threat alone
in HAD
Primary Targets :
- if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
- Load single threat
Secondary Target
- Load Priority Targets
@Mav-jp just for clarification, in POS, you write “… if FCR belongs to a SAM system” , does it involve Sam System is defined in the table?
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@Mav-jp said in Unexpected HARM behaviour:
Primary Targets :
if Sam system is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next
If a FCR is loaded : Load the FCR and the EWR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
if a EWR is loaded : Load the EWT and the FCR next if FCR belongs to a SAM system
load the threat directly and alone if not part of a SAM systemIf this is how the real thing works OK, but the second line does not make sense to me. For example, I’m on a SEAD mission and spot a SAM launch in the distance. I’m not illuminated myself and I don’t have any further info as to determine the type but I do want to suppress/destroy it. From intel I know the enemy has SA-6 and SA-3, so it has to be either one of them. In this case I’d like to have my HARMs set up to only look for the FCRs of both systems and not any possibly accompanying EWRs. Or at least have the priority like: SA-6 FCR as primary, SA-3 FCR as secondary, SA-6/3 EWR as tertiary.