F-16 stick angled/offset?
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The F-16 stick is leant for ward slightly (hence the adapter from Realsimulator) but it is not rotated in any way, Its lined up with the longitudinal axis of the jet.
What IS rotated however are the load cells in the base. They are rotated 12degrees clockwise, so pitch up is back and slightly towards you. This is for ergonomic reasons, being that its easier to pull your hand directly towards your body than directly backwards if you need to really pull. All the rest of the cardinal directions (full forwards stick, full roll left and right) are similarly rotated. This does not need to be taken into account when mounting the FSSB, Just mount it pointing forward. The FSSB software has the ability to rotate the stick outputs by the 12 degrees required. It wants to be set to a rotation of -12 in the software.
Hope that helps. This is how I have my FSSB R3 set up and it feels gooooood.
Cheers
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@SOBO-87 said in F-16 stick angled/offset?:
This is how I have my FSSB R3 set up and it feels gooooood.
Same here. This setup is just perfect.
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@Stevie You are probably correct, it has been some time. But yes, I meant rotated, thanks!
@Badger and @SOBO-87 thanks very much for that input! I did look at the BMS cockpit to check and it did look straight, good to know about the load cell rotation! I’ll see how to do that in the software. @SOBO-87 have you got yours set up at 12 degrees too or slightly less?
@Razor161 Thanks!
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@Atlas I have mine set at 12 degrees (-12 in the Realsim Software) and it feel just perfect. My personal preference is to turn BFA for Roll and Pitch off in the realsim software as well and just use a very small deadzone in whatever sim I’m flying.
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@SOBO-87 Thanks for that! Still have to figure everything out! I don’t suppose you have to start the software everytime you fly right? Like TARGET before, where I had to start it and load up my TARGET profile before flying…
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@Atlas Correct, it alters the firmware on the stick. So you open it while you have the stick connected, make an changes you want etc, and then it uploads that in real time to the stick. Once that’s done then the stick remembers all the settings and the software doesn’t need to be opened.
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@SOBO-87 That is perfect, thanks!
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Be aware that the stick has a forward angle mounted on the stickbase indeed - BUT the base itself has a angle backwards, so the stick is pretty upright more or less.
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@Korbi IMHO even so Its still leant forward compared to the natural vertical position of the Warthog stick on the FSSB base. It certainly feels much more like IRL to me with the adapter as opposed to without it., specially when mounted in a realistic location. I’d imagine it would be less appropriate for desk mounting.
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@Korbi said in F-16 stick angled/offset?:
Be aware that the stick has a forward angle mounted on the stickbase indeed - BUT the base itself has a angle backwards, so the stick is pretty upright more or less.
Also the seat in the real cockpit is tilted backwards, the stickbase is tilted backwards (as you pointed out) and the stick is tilted forward. The reference for the stick angle should not be the ground but the seat.
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@SOBO-87 said in F-16 stick angled/offset?:
@Atlas I have mine set at 12 degrees (-12 in the Realsim Software) and it feel just perfect. My personal preference is to turn BFA for Roll and Pitch off in the realsim software as well and just use a very small deadzone in whatever sim I’m flying.
That’s interesting. Wasn’t the F-16 the first true fly-by-wire fighter jet with the FSSB style stick? I recall reading somewhere that they also added a deadzone (at least for pitching up) because it was too easy to scrape the tail section on takeoff in the first versions. Is that true? Just curious if you didn’t add your own deadzones, would behave similarly, or if the BMS simulator would be doing any part of that through coding already, perhaps?
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@SemlerPDX I do believe you’re correct that the F-16 was the first production jet with a pressure stick. I know that the early jets had no movement in the stick at all and very little breakout force, but most of the pilots found it very twitchy and difficult to fly smoothly. They added a small amount of stick movement, to add some more breakout force and make it a bit less twitchy around centre. I believe the clockwise rotation of the sensors was also added at some point in the early life as well as it would found there was a natural tendency to roll left when pulling.
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@Korbi The seat is angled backwards so the stick looks vertical. With our not-quite-30-degree simpit seats, the forward tilt of the stick still somewhat ends up more ergonomic than a truly vertical stick. At least that’s what I think
I can’t imagine how to mount a FSSB setup on a replica cockpit though. Has anyone tried this?
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@Atlas said in F-16 stick angled/offset?:
I can’t imagine how to mount a FSSB setup on a replica cockpit though. Has anyone tried this?
No, will not work. The FSSB is ways too fat for that. The only option is a real stick or FCC mod… but the FCC Mod needs a grip with adapter… The Realsimulatoir Grip would be with this angle, but does not work together with the FCC
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@Atlas said in F-16 stick angled/offset?:
@SOBO-87 Thanks for that! Still have to figure everything out! I don’t suppose you have to start the software everytime you fly right? Like TARGET before, where I had to start it and load up my TARGET profile before flying…
The only annoying thing is that if you want audible warnings when you pull too hard (that you have reached the end of the axis), you need to start the RS_HID_DEV_TOOL and click “Overlay Settings” and then minimize the tool.
You have to leave the app open for the audible alerts to work. I used pypi as a workaround but, it’s just as annoying.
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@Atlas - The grip in an F/A-18 is not angled…and I think the one in the Tomcat isn’t either. But they are much different grips, in a much different location.
Some of the folks on VP have been able to mount the RS base under the console and use a short extension through the SSC base. I’ve asked specifically if one would risk breaking the RS base this way, and it seems not to be so with such a short extension and limited travel. But you still have to use an adapter to angle the grip at the top of the extension - you may be able to make the RS one work, depends on the extension you use…and your SSC base.