Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility
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@Atze-0
You see. Modern psychology does wonders today -
@Atze-0 that ecosystem (DCS) is best for scripted missions and trying out/learning new things. The ability to test and repeat makes it the ideal platform for testing and learning. However, I think once the pilot is ready to remove the training wheels, that ecosystem quickly shows its shortcomings. Unfortunately, with it being a business, it needs funding to continue (longevity) which means it needs public visibility (Steam?) to get a wider audience.
Thankfully, the same does not apply here.
Welcome back!
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For all those who are talking about the nameless āsimulatorā I dedicate this sticker.
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@VIPER-0 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
For all those who are talking about the nameless āsimulatorā I dedicate this sticker.
I always hoped they could build an experience around the aircraft modules to give the whole thing a meaning like fighting on a huge battlefield. But they never did since the Flanker days, then to Lock On (although there they had at least a bit motivating story missions). I would even appreciate a somewhat more simple system like in Tornado campaign level2 or Falcon 3.0, but nada. Fly pre-built missions or build some for yourself. The menu button āCampaignā is a big joke (connect some single missions and call it that). Those third party mods āsimulating a dynamic campaignā like Liberation are a laugh (if I want to play Monopoly I will do exactly this).OK, for a campaign it needs some sort of a bubble system we have (from their latest official posts they are trying that), not to have all units on the map loaded in a mission all at once. But why try that if even the maps are not fully fleshed outā¦ (no offence @SpbGoro, Middle East is my favorite).
The mission editor is more a developerās tool than a sim UI - and exactly as sensitive if not used in very narrow parameters, producing bullsh*t when entering 3D.
If they are as succesfull with their dynamic campaign as they are with AI behaviourā¦
@VIPER-0 : You are wrong. Itās more like Anakin would be saved in Episode III (we are the light side). And I would say I have absolutely the right to have a humorous comedy-afternoon from time to timeā¦
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@Atze-0 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@VIPER-0 : You are wrong. Itās more like Anakin would be saved in Episode III (we are the light side). And I would say I have absolutely the right to have a humorous comedy-afternoon from time to timeā¦
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@VIPER-0 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@Atze-0 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@VIPER-0 : You are wrong. Itās more like Anakin would be saved in Episode III (we are the light side). And I would say I have absolutely the right to have a humorous comedy-afternoon from time to timeā¦
No, here you can see me helping a DCS developer out of the door. You also may recognise an āAlmost-DCS-enthusiastā towards the end of the clip beeing saved from the dark side. Thats the only one truth
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@Atze-0 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@VIPER-0 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@Atze-0 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@VIPER-0 : You are wrong. Itās more like Anakin would be saved in Episode III (we are the light side). And I would say I have absolutely the right to have a humorous comedy-afternoon from time to timeā¦
No, here you can see me helping a DCS developer out of the door. You also may recognise an āAlmost-DCS-enthusiastā towards the end of the clip beeing saved from the dark side. Thats the only one truth
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@Atze-0 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@Atlas
You are right, BMS will be discussed more by the existence of the F-16 module.I did a short side step to DCS this afternoon, building an OCA package mission and flying it. I almost forgot what a pain in the a** it is. The HAD is a bit funny (at best). Then trying to get the other planes to drop bombs is a problem that was never really solved. Me beeing lead of the SEAD flight having taken out the SA-10 and Tunguska I placed was not enough. The AI flew so stupid that the remaining 2 Shilkas and a SA-13 got the F-18 runway bombing flight (although all the waypoints were set at Angels 20).
So, Iām cured now, buying some roses and coming back
Creating a (good) COMAO on DCS is a nightmare and an unsolvable dilemma.
AIs are unable to depart correctly, unable to manage timings ā¦ unable to manage formation changes and be back track/trimming, unable to deliver weapons properly, unable to manage fuel, unable to recovery correctly.
It is literally impossible to sync several flights without spending few days adjusting each tests after tests ā¦It is just something (I donāt have the words).
If they want to have a dyn camp, they have A LOT of work fixing and enhancing this first, otherwise, they dyn camp will never work.
This is what AIs does after one week of fine tuning and syncing three flights at push (without success) ā¦
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@Atze-0 yeah definitely needs to be done especially to contiue competing with DCS
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@bjjman94 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@Atze-0 yeah definitely needs to be done especially to contiue competing with DCS
It is that BMS has never competed with DCS, they are 2 different worlds. DCS is a company, a business, and is only looking for (and there is nothing wrong with) money. BMS is a community that has put effort and heart to carry out this project.
Itās like in boxing, they are in the same competition but at different weights.
I always make the comparison to my boys that DCS is that pretty, good-looking girl but if you are looking to start a good conversation you realize that she is an empty shell.
BMS however is that girl who is not a magazine model but you can spend hours talking and there is always something interesting in her. -
@VIPER-0 lol nah bro theyāre definitely compatible especially as of the past year or so. Bms shines more in the dynamic campaign but thatās about it dcs is really catching up fixing the odds and ends that werenāt as realistic. I still like bms better tho and i think I always will unless dcs gets a crazy interactive campaign.
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@VIPER-0
Kinda like Apple and Android. -
@bjjman94 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@VIPER-0 lol nah bro theyāre definitely compatible especially as of the past year or so. Bms shines more in the dynamic campaign but thatās about it dcs is really catching up fixing the odds and ends that werenāt as realistic. I still like bms better tho and i think I always will unless dcs gets a crazy interactive campaign.
Youāre comparing apples to oranges. DCS is a commercial product of an aircraft module focused combat flight engagement simulation model, BMS is a freeware product full modification of an F-16 focused combat flight war simulation model.
Each have their own goals, drawbacks, and perks - with DCS being a visually modern sim with a goal to make money by releasing new aircraft simulation models to work off their base World platform, with less emphasis on accuracy or functional realism than consistent new releases, and content to leave modules in a āWIPā state in order to move onto or release other aircraft modules. And BMS, of course, being a freeware project with a goal of IRL accuracy and functionality (as much as able given declassified information) while addressing any issues as they are reported and as able in perpetuity for the current or next version, and while lacking (for now, anyway!) some of the more modern graphics weād expect in modern combat flight sims, features an unrivaled full campaign simulator that can run for weeks in real-time.
The only thing they both have in common is the base genre of ācombat flight simulatorā - beyond that, they are each such unique individual groups and sims that there is no comparison even between matching aircraft in each sim.
One isnāt better (or worse) than the other in general, only in individual aspects of the sim and the development of it, and team goals for those aspects.
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@SemlerPDX said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@bjjman94 said in Suggestion: Putting BMS on Steam as a Mod to improve its longevity and public visibility:
@VIPER-0 lol nah bro theyāre definitely compatible especially as of the past year or so. Bms shines more in the dynamic campaign but thatās about it dcs is really catching up fixing the odds and ends that werenāt as realistic. I still like bms better tho and i think I always will unless dcs gets a crazy interactive campaign.
Youāre comparing apples to oranges. DCS is a commercial product of an aircraft module focused combat flight engagement simulation model, BMS is a freeware product full modification of an F-16 focused combat flight war simulation model.
Each have their own goals, drawbacks, and perks - with DCS being a visually modern sim with a goal to make money by releasing new aircraft simulation models to work off their base World platform, with less emphasis on accuracy or functional realism than consistent new releases, and content to leave modules in a āWIPā state in order to move onto or release other aircraft modules. And BMS, of course, being a freeware project with a goal of IRL accuracy and functionality (as much as able given declassified information) while addressing any issues as they are reported and as able in perpetuity for the current or next version, and while lacking (for now, anyway!) some of the more modern graphics weād expect in modern combat flight sims, features an unrivaled full campaign simulator that can run for weeks in real-time.
The only thing they both have in common is the base genre of ācombat flight simulatorā - beyond that, they are each such unique individual groups and sims that there is no comparison even between matching aircraft in each sim.
One isnāt better (or worse) than the other in general, only in individual aspects of the sim and the development of it, and team goals for those aspects.
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@SemlerPDX ik what you mean but Iām telling you dcs has really come a long way in the past year or so. I used to play it years ago and I would get annoyed at some unrealistic things and go play bms instead lol but the last time I played it I was seriously considering buying a new more powerful rig so I can play dcs as well. Theyāre catching up unfortunately bro.
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@bjjman94 I fly both, and have for a few years. For me, the difference is not in the graphics or the flight models or whatever (honestly, for a lay person, itās hard to tell the difference in FM).
Instead itās in āwhat do you do now youāve loaded the game/sim?ā aspect, especially in single player.
DCS is a decent (and pretty) sim.
BMS is a decent (and maybe not quite so pretty but I still like it) / excellent sim.
DCS has nothing aside from being a sim. Itās a sandbox, with limited scope for missions due to being cpu bound whenever you want more than a handful of units. The AI that you fly with is poor. Flying against, itās pretty good.
But BMS has a massively rich environment with a full scale war, and cooperative AI that mostly do the right thing.
I enjoy DCS for air quake and flying other things, or ātrainingā, or quick flights.
I enjoy BMS for being part of a war.