Cluster bombs
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First hand empirical evidence tells me that burst altitude is modeled and makes a big difference in cluster effectiveness. Minimum 2000 feet BA IMHO.
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Yeah you know Mower I do think I have seen the actual burst yet recently watching weapons view per pic above the cbu merely impacts the ground weird I know must be my stuff wrong.
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Yeah you know Mower I do think I have seen the actual burst yet recently watching weapons view per pic above the cbu merely impacts the ground weird I know must be my stuff wrong.
Might be a texturing thing.
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Hey guys here’s a kicker here - how long does a tank battalion span? 50 vehicles in a battalion (the main element M1A2’s or whatever kind of MBT + a support group) in a line form and 20 m spacing is about 600-700 meters the whole circus. So a single JSOW should area-cover about 150-175 meters which is pretty doable idk it might not be so ‘overdone’ in BMS after all
(first part)
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Burst altitude certainly is modelled and greatly affects the ‘footprint’ of your CBU and therefore how many kills you can score per CBU. Settings such as 900ft will produce a very small footprint so you won’t get many kills. A burst altitude of anywhere between 2000-3000 ft in my experience gives an optimum effect.
For example, if you look at the length of a column on the recon screen, load up with 8 CBU 87 CEM’s, set BA to 2500ft and spacing to whatever the column length was divided by 8 you can pretty much wipe out the whole column in one pass.
Don’t worry about the CBU’s seemingly not exploding until they hit the ground. I beleive that is simply a graphic model issue and does not affect CBU performance. Enjoy
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Don’t worry about the CBU’s seemingly not exploding until they hit the ground. I beleive that is simply a graphic model issue and does not affect CBU performance. Enjoy
Exactly. Good post!
C9
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excellent responses all around gents and thank you much!
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yeah but in r/l they would never be in column formation if there was an air threat and would be spread out as much as the terrain allowed in wedge formation as I have served in 2 armored division’s mech infantry batallions. Now of course if they were caught on a hard ball bunched up in columns they would be devastated if the burst is aligned with the column.
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I don’t think burst altitude is actually modeled here as I have seen cbus of all types set at 900ft and jsows hit the ground and explode without any pre-set burst.
In terms of modelisation, as far as I know, a JSOW is a missile, and missiles dont have a “cluster bomb height” damage modification. In the same spirit, damage is made from a theoretical point of impact of the bomb/missile ; if you check the weapons view for a CBU, you will not see it part away and release submunition, only a small puff of smoke at burst alt. . More importantly, at impact, no submunition will explode until the bomb has hit the ground. The reason is : it acts as if it was a regular bomb with a huge damage radius for vehicules, and a different graphic animation.
Remember that Falcon is an old game with shortcomings in terms of modelization. Additions such as JSOW werent thought of at the beginning, its normal for them to behave oddly.
So :
Burst altitude is correctly modeled for cluster bombs. My empirical tests didnt show a lot of difference though. But you should kill 3 tanks per bombs without too much trouble. Pratice in Instant Action if needed, you’ll have all the ammo you need :mrgreen: -
First hand empirical evidence tells me that burst altitude is modeled and makes a big difference in cluster effectiveness. Minimum 2000 feet BA IMHO.
yes. column kills are possible with good BA, good seperation, RP # and good lineup. CBU87s are probably one of the most lethal things in the game. if you take full pylons of them you can readily achieve 20+ A-G kills, which is almost impossible with any other weapon system.
they require setup and are hard to use in the dark / against stationary targets because you’re unsure what you’re hitting exactly, but when used well are excellent weapons generally.
it took me about 200 flight hours to notice the CNTL panel on the SMS. i turned burst altitude up once. it was an epiphany.
A-G kills per mission probably tripled on average.
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cool dude; was your epiphany on the road to Damascus in the Israeli theater lol? I just dove into that theater and its getting better by the minute!!!
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here are my actual settings for a mk20D
BA 2000 Rip 6 spacing 450 feet.Do they seem correct ? I don’t have a lot of experience yet, btw which weapons would be more adequate ? mk20 cbu 97 or cbu87 ?
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72nd vfw had a ‘quicklist’ set up that had quick reference values for all the cbu’s, 52-97. Seems most burst altitudes about 2000-3000 ft. Not sure if it’s still available, but man that thing is handy!
anyone remember setting burst altitude for the cbu-97 to like 15,000ft in FalconAF, and slaying entire convoys with a single bomb?
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@Cik:
it took me about 200 flight hours to notice the CNTL panel on the SMS. i turned burst altitude up once. it was an epiphany.
A-G kills per mission probably tripled on average.
Same, except I was told by my squad mates how to change my BA when I was asking why their CBU’s did so much more damage than mine. It was a revelation to say the least!
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Just to remove any doubt, of course burst altitude is working and plays a role in CBU effectiveness, the GFX issue of the bomb gwtting down to the ground is indeed only GFX issue.
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Ran a test a while back. CBU-87; -97 and MK20. Against a Tank Btn and against and HQ Btn. All in column. Same release altitude (~18k), same burst altitude (2500 or 3000 ft, don’t recall now), same pickle spacing (650 ft, iirc).
In that one set of release parameters, the CBU-87 was the most effective, but only by a small margin. MK20 was least effective.
Here’s a vid on how to line up a column to inflict maximum damage (he uses a toss, which is damn good fun, but not necessary. A med level CCRP drop is just as good):
I’m a convert to this technique when the battalion is in column formation.
FWIW, in BMS, it’s worth noting that columns always line up on multiple of 45* (0/180, 45/225, 90/270, 135/315, etc.).
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setting burst altitude for the cbu-97 to like 15,000ft in FalconAF, and slaying entire convoys with a single bomb?
Convoys consisting of how many vehicles?
…toss…
…A med level CCRP…
That seems way too ‘inflexable’ I mean you have to calculate the moving speed and position of the tgt + line up perfectly, isn’t a plain old CCIP best for this task?
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I prefer CCIP drops for CBUs due to the flexibility and because you’re not forced to rely on the ground radar. But then again, I tend to use CBUs for Wild Weasel missions, whereas I stay away from CAS almost completely due to the immersion breaker of seeing large units line up in the open begging to be bombed. Sometimes I do CCRP if I have a TGP, but mostly I stick to CCIP drops.
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@mookar:
Convoys consisting of how many vehicles?
That seems way too ‘inflexable’ I mean you have to calculate the moving speed and position of the tgt + line up perfectly, isn’t a plain old CCIP best for this task?
nah. against stationary mud a RP 8 CBU-87 drop is pretty easy. if they are moving, you brought the wrong tool. you can CCIP, but assuming they are even barely equipped with SHORADs it’s death to drop below angels 15 anywhere near them.
hence CCRP. generally i find CCRP cluster pretty effective, they do probably at least 3-4X kills per bomb than a GBU, and you can carry the same number.
for pasting non-HQ/SP battalions CCIP works fine though. just need to watch out in case you have an intermixed target.