Do I need aribrakes in normal missions
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Airbrakes are supposed to be open when you are on final approach, so the engine maintains high enough revs to better execute missed approaches, also to slow you down and not get hot brakes as easy.
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Speed brakes are not strictly necessary. It’s handy of course during flight. On approach it allows a higher power setting and landing roll is shortened. Every real F-16 flight will use the speed brakes at least once, but it’s not an emergency if they were to fail closed. If you can you should have speed brakes available to you and use them as naturally and freely as the throttle lever. They are an extension and improvement on the performance envelope of the airplane.
The real SB switch is a three-position left thumb-operated switch on the throttle. There is open, hold, and close. The open direction is spring loaded back to center (hold) but the close direction will stay hands off. There is a minimum and maximum position to hold position, a very small amount open will auto close and there is a maximum in flight hold position (forty-something degrees instead of the full sixty). On the ground (nose wheel weight) it will hold at more open positions. In flight if open is held against the spring the SB will open fully.
I use SB to arrest forward speed during rejoins, to do penetration descents, on approach and landing, and even in combat to shed extra knots above corner if it’s necessary.
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Pretty sure in flight it will hold to the full 60 degrees without being in the held open position.
Pop the gear out however, and it will retract to 43 degrees unless you are holding them open.
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Look for speed brakes. Not normally called air brakes.
If you didn’t need them, they would not be on the aircraft.
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Pretty sure in flight it will hold to the full 60 degrees without being in the held open position.
Pop the gear out however, and it will retract to 43 degrees unless you are holding them open.
Forgot it was tied to the gear (right MLG down and locked to be exact). Yeah, the retract to 43 degree is only in with the gear down. Good catch.
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Reason being, IRL 60 degrees extended speedbrakes plus 13.5 degrees 2 point aerobraking can cause the boards to contact the runway. 43 degrees boards with 2 point aerobraking is fine. 60 degrees with 3 point aerobraking is also fine.
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ok. Thanks for your answers. I’m a bit confused:
How can I apply airbrakes?
Are they equal to Speedbrake on the throttle?
And how do i see if Airbrake is applied? -
there is a candidate for some more dash 1 reading
check your doc folder and do some readingairbrake and speedbrake are the same
they are controlled from the throttle, the indicator is on the left aux console, outboard the gear panel -
Thanks Red Dog…
I even read most of the Dash and searched for Airbrake and Air Brake but got no hit -
@oho:
Thanks Red Dog…
I even read most of the Dash and searched for Airbrake and Air Brake but got no hitProbably because most people would equate airbrake with either Aerobraking or a jacobs brake… I think the two on the F-16 are speedbrakes and wheelbrakes in nomenclature.
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@oho:
ok. Thanks for your answers. I’m a bit confused:
How can I apply airbrakes?
Are they equal to Speedbrake on the throttle?
And how do i see if Airbrake is applied?1. Use the keys/buttons tied to callbacks AFBrakesIn and AFBrakesOut. There is also AFBrakesToggle. I can’t say what key or button unless I see your .key file.
2. Yes.
3. There is an indicator on the left aux. console between the landing gear panel, CMDS panel, and RWR panel. (BMS-1 page 28). -
I find that using the hotas AFBrakesIn and AFBrakesout commands for the speed brakes are much more useful than the toggle command. You can find more information on the speed brakes in BMS 4.32 Dash-1 page 25, 26, 31 and 133.
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How do you guys rejoin without using the airbrake…?
If you don’t want to map it on the HOTAS for some reason, you might just try shift + b.
And no, putting the gear down will not apply the speedbrake/ airbrake/ boards. It will lower the flaps though on the F-16.
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by flying a set speed for rejoin. That way you always know what speed the guy you’re rejoining with flies
that’s why SOPs are so important -
How do you guys rejoin without using the airbrake…?
Thats simply training
The best example for that is the AAR Vid of Dejaay. Sorry I don’t have the Link now, but the basic message is following:Always hold enough offset to your Lead/Tanker/etc., will get you a lot better feeling of the relative Speed to the ac in front of you. And try to fly a bit below the ac in front of you, will give you the possiblity to pull up a bit if youre coming in a bit to fast and you get to close.
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Who needs airbrakes when you can ……
->
… Do a barrel Roll !
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Who needs airbrakes when you can ……
->
… Do a barrel Roll !
Best way to slowdown to avoid an overshoot.
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You hotdog
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Well, while SOP’s are great, I have made the experience that you have two big problems with those:
- There are pilots that just plain ignore them and
- there are pilots that do know them, but can’t fly what’s written in them or do not remember in that exact moment or do not have the SA to execute that.
Many of the guys I have flown with do give a sh*t about a fixed rejoin speed, most of them even don’t give their speed readout until asked. That doesn’t bother me however if they are a good lead when it comes to the fight. I can fly for myself. We are virtual pilots and many of them are just here for the fun of flying, so I won’t critize that. I’m not perfect either.
Therefore, it got second nature to me to close up in buster with a lateral offset of a few hundred feet to be able to guess the closure speed better, close up as fast as I can and then pop the speedbrake when I’m there until I’m down to maybe 10kts closure, which will give me a good speed match given the time they need to retract.
It works most of the time, but fails when for example i’m #4 and #3 has the wrong speed in relation to #1. In this case, I’m using a horizontal or vertical weave (vertical up is preferred if visual can be maintained and my wingman, if any, doesn’t get confused by that).
Barrel roll does look cool though.
But really, I can’t imagine a life without airbrakes. Even with that external airbrake called ECM, it became so much second nature I really do rely on it.
However, we fly clean birds in training with our students. The clean bird will not bleed that much speed as a combat loadout with ECM, 2x370, 6x AAM for example when reducing power. I am using that way more frequently on the clean birds.
But even with the combat loadout- that’s something that definitely belongs on the HOTAS.
In high altitudes, the engine won’t response that fast- so I’m using that a lot there too. For me, the airbrake is somehow essential.After the other postings, I think you are using similar tactics than I do- lateral offset, fixed or known speeds and weaving in any direction if you’re way too fast