Falcon BMS Forum
    • Register
    • Login
    • Search
    • Categories
    • Unread
    • Recent
    • Unsolved
    • Popular
    • Website
    • Wiki
    • Discord

    Left base.

    General Discussion
    20
    35
    901
    Loading More Posts
    • Oldest to Newest
    • Newest to Oldest
    • Most Votes
    Reply
    • Reply as topic
    Log in to reply
    This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
    • Bayonet
      Bayonet last edited by

      Hello Forum.

      As I understand it, when ATC tell me to land to left base, that means that I must keep the field to my left when I approach and all my turns will be to the left.

      Is that correct?

      When, however, I set up to approach appropriately the ATC may vector me to the “wrong side”. Having been told to expect a left base pattern, I end up with the field to my right.

      Am I expecting too much?

      Thanks,

      Bayonet.

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • Agave_Blue
        Agave_Blue last edited by

        I’m curious too. I thought it meant that your base turn to runway heading would be left hand turn.

        ??

        Mav-jp 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • Mav-jp
          Mav-jp @Agave_Blue last edited by

          Atc is fubar in 4.32

          cptmtge TommyGun 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • cptmtge
            cptmtge @Mav-jp last edited by

            Oh I thought it was a political statement whew!

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • TommyGun
              TommyGun @Mav-jp last edited by

              @Mav-jp:

              Atc is fubar in 4.32

              I have no reason whatsoever to doubt your words since I’m not familiar with the code. Most of the time I land by the visual rules anyway, but every time I make an attempt to call the tower and follow ATC’s instructions I get MORE OR LESS accurately led to a successful final. The only annoying thing is that they tell me to fly very slow (like “Maintain 230 knots”) when there’s no air traffic around… 😉

              Bayonet 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • Bayonet
                Bayonet @TommyGun last edited by

                Yes you’re correct Tommy Gun, ATC will get you down more or less correctly and into wind also.
                I just wondered how left or right base was modelled.

                Thank you all,

                Bayonet.

                Wayc00lio 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • Wayc00lio
                  Wayc00lio @Bayonet last edited by

                  I always put down on the LHS strip, following ATC. But if no ATC directions, follow a LH circuit.

                  Frederf 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • Frederf
                    Frederf @Wayc00lio last edited by

                    Vectors to a segment of the approach doesn’t mean that you’re going to fly that approach in total. So vectors to join “left base” doesn’t mean left turns, it means any and all turns in order to join that segment. It could easily be all right turns to join left base. And of course the approach and landing runway are independent so any approach can end in any runway.

                    Also it’s “expect” which can change if you don’t fly their directions exactly or something else upsets the order. And of course there can be oddities and errors in the ATC code as well.

                    I imagine the ATC is setup with a “T” structure to the approach and will vector you to one of three points in a free form manner. The three points might be labeled left base, right base, and final. There’s no overall structure to the approach environment outside of this T so I wouldn’t get too concerned with flying a full pattern.

                    Without exactly what ATC said and knowing exactly what airbase and exactly the path you flew… it’s hard to say.

                    Mower 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • Mower
                      Mower @Frederf last edited by

                      Falcon ATC is confused about base entry legs, always has been…just ignore the bitch…:p

                      FalconAF to FBMS Conversion Guide

                      lightswitch94 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • lightswitch94
                        lightswitch94 @Mower last edited by

                        Left base is setting you up for a left hand turn onto base leg of the circuit. So yes the airfield should be to your left and all turns should be to the left. IRL left hand patterns are standard unless otherwise stated.

                        Mav-jp 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • Mav-jp
                          Mav-jp @lightswitch94 last edited by

                          To be honest the Atc is so busted that it would take pages to describe all the problems here.

                          Just for the thread subject , the ATC always vectors to the same Base even if it says left or right.

                          Blu3wolf 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • Blu3wolf
                            Blu3wolf @Mav-jp last edited by

                            Do go on Mav…. You have at least one attentive audience member~!

                            jhook 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • jhook
                              jhook @Blu3wolf last edited by

                              If were talking about RL appraoch procedures, I dont think bms can do it. Just too much work too much work imo. But I have mentioned in another thread pertaining to AWAC call outs that would better picture development through brevity picture call outs for a better and closer to RL picter from AWACs. For ATC and ground control call backs, the same brevity call back structure would be needed. Proper marshal, stacking and approach information within a busy airspace would be needed. Also a proper ground contol call backs would be needed for all taxi instructions such as which taxi way to use for the right take off runway, to which taxi way to use to reach the refuel pad or pin pull/arm area.

                              A lot of work. Dont know if we will ever get that sorted but would reduce confusion and congestion during busy air operations. A feature I hope one daly makes it into bms.

                              Blu3wolf l3crusader 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • Blu3wolf
                                Blu3wolf @jhook last edited by

                                You shouldn’t need progressive taxi instructions at a fighter base. Progressive taxi is for visitors who can get lost.

                                It is atypical for fighter aircraft to get progressive taxi instructions.

                                Mower jhook 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • Mower
                                  Mower @Blu3wolf last edited by

                                  Well there’s always the classic 20 Mike Mike on the tower…

                                  FalconAF to FBMS Conversion Guide

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • jhook
                                    jhook @Blu3wolf last edited by

                                    @Blu3wolf:

                                    You shouldn’t need progressive taxi instructions at a fighter base. Progressive taxi is for visitors who can get lost.

                                    It is atypical for fighter aircraft to get progressive taxi instructions.

                                    Thats not true. With ground traffic and hot pit taxi to park, as well as taxi to arming zones, there are specific taxi instructions during these operations. You do not just taxi into a hot pit area, let alone an arming area. Ussually you are directed into a holding line before you can taxi to those areas.

                                    Blu3wolf 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • l3crusader
                                      l3crusader @jhook last edited by

                                      @jhook:

                                      But I have mentioned in another thread pertaining to AWAC call outs that would better picture development through brevity picture call outs for a better and closer to RL picter from AWACs.

                                      Having a few other contacts called out (instead of just the “nearest bandit”) is not hard, some extra info (hot/cold) either, but describing the picture with correct labels for each group (north trail group, etc… ) and correct global situation ("Wall, “Echelon”, “Vic”, “Champagne”), etc. is trickier to do though. I agree this would definitely be nice.

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • Blu3wolf
                                        Blu3wolf @jhook last edited by

                                        @jhook:

                                        Thats not true. With ground traffic and hot pit taxi to park, as well as taxi to arming zones, there are specific taxi instructions during these operations. You do not just taxi into a hot pit area, let alone an arming area. Ussually you are directed into a holding line before you can taxi to those areas.

                                        I stand by what I said, and annotate that hot pits are also atypical. You get an aircraft marshal through hot pit and arming areas, but not progressive taxi.

                                        If it helps you, just pretend you are practicing commout operations. Details for that in the 13-205 iirc.

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • mrwell
                                          mrwell last edited by

                                          If ATC were easy to program or to be replicated by a machine they’d long ago dumped human controllers, don’t you think? 😉

                                          Amraam 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • Amraam
                                            Amraam @mrwell last edited by

                                            Bluewolf is right about progressive taxi. most of the time, the taxi in use is know by SOP’s and pre-brief. Progressive taxi is somethings more civilian because you never sure if the guys know the local procedure or not.

                                            Red Dog 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                            • First post
                                              Last post

                                            83
                                            Online

                                            9.9k
                                            Users

                                            20.6k
                                            Topics

                                            343.1k
                                            Posts

                                            Benchmark Sims - All rights reserved ©