F16 Hud design - symbology moving when "pulling g" in turns ?

[mstram]

In regards to the design of the REAL JET (which obviously Falcon attempts to simulate as closely as possible)

Does anyone here know what the idea was behind having the symbology on hud “move off screen” when pulling g’s in turns? I.e. the “pitch ladder”.

Makes no sense to me.

Though presumably not realistic, I’d love to have an option to disable that behavior.

[Dee-Jay]

? … What do you mean by “having the symbology on hud “move off screen” when pulling g’s in turns?” … Do you mean the FPM (Flight Path Marker) ?

[Zaltys]

Exactly what symbology? Please, don’t make premature claims on not realistic stuff without prove.

[mstram]

@Dee-Jay:

? … What do you mean by “having the symbology on hud “move off screen” when pulling g’s in turns?” … Do you mean the FPM (Flight Path Marker) ?

It’s not just the FPM. The “pitch ladder”, and the heading indicator, also “fly” out of view in the hud on a turn of ~5-6 g’s.

I thought it might be related to info I’ve found on hud-crosswind behavior ?

[Agave_Blue]

@Zaltys:

…. Please, don’t make premature claims on not realistic stuff without prove.

He didn’t say it’s current state is not realistic. He said he’d prefer the HUD symbology were fixed in place even if that might be unrealistic.

[Amraam]

Nope, this is the normal behavior. No issues :

Comon, we will not make an option of everything ;).

[OldGoat5]

You can prevent some of it with the drift cutout switch on the icp, if you want.

[roccio]

I think he was only asking why some simbology drift away in RL HUD.

[Dee-Jay]

@mstram:

It’s not just the FPM. The “pitch ladder”, and the heading indicator, also “fly” out of view in the hud on a turn of ~5-6 g’s.

I thought it might be related to info I’ve found on hud-crosswind behavior ?

Normal and desired behavior. Those info are stricked to the FPM undder high AoA (no Gs actualy) by desing. For the “why” this choice exactly, you should rather ask Lokeed Martin.
Fot the heading tape, it depends on mode and master mode. IIRC, the heading tape stick to the FPM only when gear is down and depending on F-16 updates also. Under high Aoa (no Gs actually) I bet for a FPM visibility issue.

No way to customise it extept by setting the HUD to “Drift/CO” mode which is centering the FPM and the pitch ladder on the yaw axis (not advised for landing and CCIP attack.)

[Zaltys]

@Agave_Blue:

He didn’t say it’s current state is not realistic. He said he’d prefer the HUD symbology were fixed in place even if that might be unrealistic.

Sorry, my bad. Misunderstood the sentence.

[mstram]

@Amraam:

Nope, this is the normal behavior. No issues :

Comon, we will not make an option of everything ;).

Sorry to be un clear. I should have specified in the design of the real jet, why is the hud designed that way.

As for “option for everything”, there are a bunch of options in the config editor that I DON’T use, ever touch or adjust. Funny how those were decided to be useful / necessary

[Amraam]

And this option will be reduce as much as possible ;).
I don’t know for the real aircraft, should be ask to LM. But I guess is to give more feedback about the turn rate.

[mstram]

@Dee-Jay:

For the “why” this choice exactly, you should rather ask Lokeed Martin.

Well I thought that the enthusiasts here would know that vital … er trivia information

@Dee-Jay:

For the heading tape, it depends on mode and master mode. IIRC, the heading tape stick to the FPM only when gear is down and depending on F-16 updates also. Under high Aoa (no Gs actually) I bet for a FPM visibility issue.

No way to customise it extept by setting the HUD to “Drift/CO” mode which is centering the FPM and the pitch ladder on the yaw axis (not advised for landing and CCIP attack.)

I tried the Drift/CO switch, has no effect on “pulled turns”

Ya, the heading tape I’m constantly resetting to the top with CTR-ALT-S, another annoyance. Why it gets switched when changing modes is another good question (for the original real plane designers)

[Raptor]

Pilot main concern is to fly the plane, thus his 1st priority all the times is know exactly were the plane is going. That is done through the FPM, the pitch ladder is obviously “attached” to the FPM as the overall “system” is moving together during turns, its simple physics.

[Dee-Jay]

@mstram:

I tried the Drift/CO switch, has no effect on “pulled turns”

Normal as it is only concerning the FPM and the pitch ladder as said in posts #9.

[Stevie]

While selecting DRIFT/CO doesn’t appear to “do anything”, it actually does - it slows the onset of display of crosswind drift, but you can still out pull it. Where I use it most is in the landing pattern, or when straffing. More applicable at lower speeds. The drift-off of HUD symbology as displayed in BMS (and FAF) IS realistic in this regard - I do know that some USN sims I’ve flown do have the ability to “cage” the HUD - which then makes it behave as the OP would like…but the Falcon don’t do dat.

Selected or not, once you learn to read the drift you’ll find that you’ll learn to manage energy/bleed far more effectively - just sounds to me like you (the OP) are over-pulling…which is to be avoided unless excursions are required when fighting.

[Malc]

I think the HUD picture moves in relation to angle of attack, yaw rate, etc. but this is just a guess though.

The heading tape moves top or bottom of the HUD to be less intrusive depending on current mode. AA it’s at the bottom as invariably your targets will come into view from the top, and AG it’s at the top as your targets will come into view at the bottom. Common sense thinking really!

[Stevie]

It’s more about the relative wind. The pitch ladder moves left/right in accord with side-slip - so if you are rolling/pulling and the ladder goes off the side of the HUD is is because you are un-coordinated and putting on enough G to induce an angle of side-slip (roll-yaw coupling, in one of it’s senses). If you notice, you can bring the ladder back to center by relaxing G, changing roll, or stomping rudder in the appropriate direction.

Learning to actually use it is part of learning to control the airplane effectively.