F-16 (BMS) Flight model Stress Test, Wheel brakes to 15,000ft in 45secs
-
Here’s an interesting stress test: wheel brake release to 15,000ft in 45secs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ai4ChkDu3hE
As you can see, he takes off around 15secs, gains speed for another 17s before he zooms up to 15,000ft in about 13s.Apparently ithe guy flying was Solo Turk:
I can’t see his angle, looks like anywhere between 85 to -85 degrees.
Tried the exact same thing in BMS (with around 1100lbs of fuel) and i’m out by around 4-5secs
Plane in vid is a F-16BM-MLU (PAF), i used the F-16B 15.
Can anyone accurately recreate this event in BMS 4.33? if not, flight model might need some tweaks
If ‘yes’ then it’s testment to the FM accuracy -
That doesn’t look like 15,000 feet to me. Maybe 5,000?
-
To do 15000’ in 12-15 secs you would need an average rate of climb of 60000-75000fpm. Too bad you can’t see the HUD!
-
Yeah that’s like 5-8k ft.
Harry (Formerly Amraam at Frugals etc.)
(I'm not currently active with ViperDrivers, but these guys are the best BMS school out there!)
-
…I’ll bet that’s 15K. MSL, not AGL. Try it like the diagrams in this thread - scroll down:
Stevie
-
You sure the video hasn’t been speeded up? - without the HUD tape all misleading guesswork.
-
4-5 seconds and you consider FM need tweaking ?
is that a JOKE ?
ok tell me in your video :
what was the atmospheric pressure ?
what was the temperature ?
what was ground elevatio at take off ?
what was the wind heading and force ?
as you can see the effects of all those factors is much more than 4 to 5 seconds
-
That was an unrestricted climb which, by normal ATC standards, would be clearance to a designated altitude. Typically controlled airspace over an airport is 5000 feet before hand-off. An educated guess would be that this was in the realm of 5000 feet as others have stated. They could not clear him fast enough into FL15 for that climb to go that far that fast. Hope that makes sense.
-
That was an unrestricted climb which, by normal ATC standards, would be clearance to a designated altitude. Typically controlled airspace over an airport is 5000 feet before hand-off. An educated guess would be that this was in the realm of 5000 feet as others have stated. They could not clear him fast enough into FL15 for that climb to go that far that fast. Hope that makes sense.
Apparently ithe guy flying was Solo Turk:
Article clearly says 15,000ft
-
I did it in BMS in 0:42. (Kadena to 15,000 MSL).
-
I did it in BMS in 0:42. (Kadena to 15,000 MSL).
Very nice. Would like to see a video on that.
What was your speed before climb?
-
He pull up at the end of the runway, did you pick up enough speed to do the same? Not related to the test per say, just curious.
Regards
F -
He pull up at the end of the runway, did you pick up enough speed to do the same? Not related to the test per say, just curious.
Regards
FI tried to gain as much speed as possible in 30secs (from wheel brakes), I think I had around 550kts before executing the climb.
-
This is a combat departure, 400kts.
But nope, this is clearly not 15.000 ft ;). -
Totally believable for a lightly loaded F-16…and in general, aircraft are restricted to 60 degree climb out to avoid the prohibition against “aerobatic” maneuver within an airport traffic area - this guy clearly pulled to vertical, so he must have had some special authorization for the attempt. Or cleared the edge of the traffic area prior to his pull…either way, totally believable performance in the RW under the right circumstances.
Stevie
-
any comparison with videos are irrelevant as many parameters are unknown
take real EM charts and accel/decel charts and the you can start real testing.
advice : dont loose your time HFFM is spot on at 99%
-
Totally believable for a lightly loaded F-16…and in general, aircraft are restricted to 60 degree climb out to avoid the prohibition against “aerobatic” maneuver within an airport traffic area - this guy clearly pulled to vertical, so he must have had some special authorization for the attempt. Or cleared the edge of the traffic area prior to his pull…either way, totally believable performance in the RW under the right circumstances.
Indeed, I’m trying to create a Tactical Engagement with the right conditions to enable such a feat. When I do it the same way as in the video (and with no payload, 1100lbs of fuel, Kimpo) i manage around 48-49 seconds (this is without playing around with weather). I did it ‘my way’ another time (without matching the video takeoff and climb times) and managed 46.6s (held a 75degree climb angle). Just trying to work out the right conditions…
-
any comparison with videos are irrelevant as many parameters are unknown
take real EM charts and accel/decel charts and the you can start real testing.
advice : dont loose your time HFFM is spot on at 99%
I believe you, just having fun trying to recreate the event in BMS (and workout the necessary conditions) for a scripted TE.
-
You also have to bear in mind that any charts you are using are probably not even applicable to he jet in the video, as far as configuration goes - one must be very specific when applying performance data to a situation…so your approach of building an approximation by inspection is certainly valid and it will be neat if you can get BMS to match. I don’t see any reason why you shouldn’t be able to. You’re also on the right track with managing your technique in flying the profile - gross weight is a factor, so try short-loading fuel as well as slicking off the aircraft. Just make sure to give yourself enough fuel to make it back to the airfield and land!
-
Hi Guys,
Unrestricted Tactical Climbs are standard procedure in any High Risk Combat environment, mainly to protect from small arms fire and short range SAMs, however….in these environments, they are loaded down with lots of Gas and Weapons, and typically don’t have Delta Airlines flying overhead
This would be a Great Question for Haole, since he’s a certified Maintenance Test Pilot, which required a max performance tactical climb in a clean jet, after certain engine / maintenance was performed.
Let me text him and see if I can get him to jump in the conversation and verify the results or clear up the information.
I know enough to know that the vertical pull entry speed and the actual (G’s) in that pull are key to maximizing the climb performance. Too little and it takes too long to reach a max performance climb angle, thus adding time. Too much speed / (G’s) in the pull, and you’re depleting valuable potential energy. What’s the magic Speed / Vertical pull (G) wise…heck I don’t know… Haole Help Please!!
This is another reason we need a “Haoles Corner” here on the BMS Forums, so we can get real world data from an actual Viper driver with combat experience…who is available and likes to help simmer out!
Stang out
