Question about CMS switch, SEMI/AUTO Consent and Jammer
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Hi there
I’ve read (and re-read) the checklists, Dash-1 and Dash 1-1 manuals and done a number of searches here but am not finding the information I need about the CMS switch. I’m using a Warthog HOTAS programmed using Mud’s profile and as close to the Dash-1 as I can get it. I apologise in advance if I have missed something obvious.As I understand it, CMS aft commands consent for the Semi and Auto CM release modes and activation of the ECM pod (assuming it is carried, powered, and available). CMS right toggles between Semi and Auto CM release modes and commands Standby mode for the ECM pod. My question is: is there a way to separate these functions?
For example, assume I am carrying an appropriately powered (but non-transmitting) ECM pod, and I’m in Semi or Auto CM mode; if I am prompted to release countermeasures, how do I do that without turning the jammer pod on as well (as I may not want to)? Alternatively, if I have already activated the pod and want it to remain active, but then want to toggle Semi or Auto modes, how do I do that without also putting the pod into standby?
Is there a hold function on the switch that I am missing, or is there something else I need to do?
Thanks in advance.
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Hi there
For example, assume I am carrying an appropriately powered (but non-transmitting) ECM pod, and I’m in Semi or Auto CM mode; if I am prompted to release countermeasures, how do I do that without turning the jammer pod on as well (as I may not want to)? Alternatively, if I have already activated the pod and want it to remain active, but then want to toggle Semi or Auto modes, how do I do that without also putting the pod into standby?
Is there a hold function on the switch that I am missing, or is there something else I need to do?
Thanks in advance.
Put the CMS programm to MAN mode, so you can tell when you release and when you activate jammer and deactivate it
But you have to programm it the way you want to release CM as you want before flight
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Normally those functions would be on the ECM panel, which is mostly not implemented in BMS.
You can disable the jammer by toggling the ECM switch on the panel of the same function; In this manner, you can dispense countermeasures without turning the jammer on. By putting the ALE-47 CMDS panel mode to MAN mode, you can activate the jammer without dispending countermeasures.
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You’ll notice that if the jammer source switch (I call jammer link due to Falcon behavior) is on that the jammer will enable in most cases in CMDS AUTO regardless of the CMS-aft/right consent set by the pilot. In a dead empty world the ENBL light will not come on even if jammer is linked and CMDS AUTO. Presumably the jammer is not receiving anything which suggests it needs to be on*.
*on being a bit of a misnomer. The ENBL light reflects “transmit enabled” such that the jammer is free to transmit but is not required to. You could fly around with the ENBL light burning for an hour and not transmit a single squiggle of jamming energy in that time.
If you “unlink” the jammer via the JMR switch on CMDS then the jammer is no longer providing its own consent for jammer state and you have manual-type control over it by CMS-aft/right.
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From my experience this is what works, allowing me to use jammer, chaff and flares independently. I could be wrong though and I would like to know if I am.
I set my ECM to semi. CMS up runs program whichever it is set to. CMS left runs program 6. Slap witch runs program 5. CMS aft turns on jammer. CMS right disables jammer.
When I don’t have my jammer on I can press CMS up, left and slap switch which will run those programs. When I have my jammer on the same happens. In semi I have never had a program run automatically and I have always been able to release CM manually regardless of if my jammer is on or not.
After seeing some of the comments I wonder now if the jammer light can be on in semi and you not be jamming. I was under the impression that with semi it is always on when the light is on and always off when the light is off.
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Viking, why don’t you just use manual instead of semi auto?
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In SEMI you still get dispense on CMS aft but only if the system requests for counter first. In manual you don’t. You get under threat, VMS says “counter”, you press CMS aft, dispense continues for that threat duration. If you want to avoid the jammer you press CMS forward instead of aft which also runs the program only once.
The jammer transmits too much in BMS. The ENBL light shouldn’t mean that it’s necessarily transmitting but I fear in BMS it does. A good test would be to fly 2 humans in a dead quiet world and one turns his radar off and the other enables his jammer. If it broadcasts despite no reasonable need to then the other silent radar guy will see jamming passively.
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Thank you - lots to digest here!
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In SEMI you still get dispense on CMS aft but only if the system requests for counter first. In manual you don’t. You get under threat, VMS says “counter”, you press CMS aft, dispense continues for that threat duration. If you want to avoid the jammer you press CMS forward instead of aft which also runs the program only once.
The jammer transmits too much in BMS. The ENBL light shouldn’t mean that it’s necessarily transmitting but I fear in BMS it does. A good test would be to fly 2 humans in a dead quiet world and one turns his radar off and the other enables his jammer. If it broadcasts despite no reasonable need to then the other silent radar guy will see jamming passively.
In fairness, to meaningfully improve this would require a reword of EW as a whole, I fear.
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Viking, why don’t you just use manual instead of semi auto?
I like getting the consent warning. Does it give the warning in manual? To be honest I chose semi when I first started and have never seen a reason to change. If I knew the benefits I might.
Is this a typo that it doesn’t say you can run program 6 with manual mode?
The MODE knob selects the CMDS operating mode: OFF, STBY, MAN, SEMI, AUTO and BYP. Depending on the mode selected the countermeasures released correspond to the selected program (position of the PRGM knob).
OFF - the CMDS is not powered and countermeasures cannot be released.
STBY - the release parameters and programming can be manually changed using the UFC. It is the only mode allowing reprogramming. The CMDS cannot release countermeasures in this mode.
MAN - only programs 1 to 5 can be released manually by the pilot by using the CMS on the sidestick. CMS forward releases whatever program is selected (1 to 4) through the PRGM knob. Program 5 can also be released with the slap switch on the left side panel.
SEMI - release is not automatic but the EWS will prompt the pilot through the VMS (“COUNTER”) whenever the system feels countermeasures should be employed. The pilot then can give consent to release by depressing CMS aft. The selected program will be then released once. If the threat persists the EWS will prompt for consent again (“COUNTER”). Consent must be given each time. Please note that for the SEMI mode to work the RWR switch on the CMDS panel needs to be ON.
AUTO - Consent must be given once (CMS aft) and is assumed until it is explicitly cancelled with a CMS right. Deployment of countermeasures is thus automatic and can deplete your stores very fast depending on the program selected.Should it say? “MAN - only programs 1 to 4 and 6 can be released manually by the pilot by using the CMS on the sidestick.”
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Hmmmm …. I run manual and selected program 1 - 4 runs from CMS Forward, Prog ?5 from slap switch and Prog ?6 from CMS Left.
I am quite certain that BMS allows me to use CMS Left to dispense from Manual.
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Program 5 is slap, Program 6 is CMS-left. Programs 1-4 are selected on the knob and activated by CMS-forward/aft. Programs 5 and 6 are never automatically activated, only by pressing the appropriate buttons manually (and available in MAN/SEMI/AUTO at all times). It is only programs 1-4 (as set by knob) which are available for semi/auto dispense.
So program 1-4 are part of the normal system CMS-up-down-right. Program 5 is shortcut slap and Program 6 is shortcut CMS-left.
I don’t know if VMS will request “counter” in MAN. I don’t think so but maybe. I wouldn’t be surprised either way.
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From my understanding it would not be a good idea to consent to release by pressing CMS aft when a missile is incoming due to HOJ. When a hostile threat gets within firing range I usually turn off jammer or flash it. If he fires then I turn it off and keep it off so it doesn’t HOJ. If I consent to release with CMS aft doesn’t it turn the jammer on which could give them a HOJ? For this reason it seems to me like consenting to auto release is never a wise choice. I would be interested to hear more.
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In WDP the DTC EWS tab it has:
Request Jammer
Request Counter
Feedback
BingoIn BMS 4.33.1 Data Cartridge EWS tab has:
REQCTR
Enable Feedback
Enable BingoWhat is the BMS equivalent of the WDP option, Request Jammer?
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There must be a relationship between the jammer, chap and inbound HOJ missiles. So Does the HOJ missile use the jammer output for tracking and it’s on board radar for ranging after burn thru, shug… what causes the warhead to detonate? It there a contact switch? Or does it need proximity range from its radar? If it does jammer and CM could work together to trick the inbound to detonate early.
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HOJ doesn’t need to burn through. It is a passive homing mode. It changes the mode from ARH to PRH. The missile stops emitting radar and homes on the jammer which means that it does not emit a signal that needs to burn through. It could be contact detonating or could use a method to calculate range by using math from the radiation signature emitted from the jammer. I don’t know how it does it exactly and that info is likely classified.
“The key processing step in a passive radar is cross-correlation. This step acts as the matched filter and also provides the estimates of the bistatic range and bistatic Doppler shift of each target echo. Most analogue and digital broadcast signals are noise-like in nature, and as a consequence they tend to only correlate with themselves. This presents a problem with moving targets, as the Doppler shift imposed on the echo means that it will not correlate with the direct signal from the transmitter. As a result, the cross-correlation processing must implement a bank of matched filters, each matched to a different target Doppler shift. Efficient implementations of the cross-correlation processing based on the discrete Fourier transform are usually used. The signal processing gain is typically equal to the time-bandwidth product, BT, where B is the waveform bandwidth and T is the length of the signal sequence being integrated. A gain of 50 dB is not uncommon. Extended integration times are limited by the motion of the target and its smearing in range and Doppler during the integration period.”
I do not know if cross correlation can be passed of to a missile or if it can be done within a single missile.
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HOJ doesn’t need to burn through. It is a passive homing mode. It changes the mode from ARH to PRH. The missile stops emitting radar and homes on the jammer which means that it does not emit a signal that needs to burn through.
Which would result in a simple series of flashes of signal if the jammer functionality was implemented more accurately in BMS. The missile stops emitting, so the repeater jammer stops emitting, so the missile starts emitting, so the jammer starts emitting…
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From my understanding it would not be a good idea to consent to release by pressing CMS aft when a missile is incoming due to HOJ. When a hostile threat gets within firing range I usually turn off jammer or flash it. If he fires then I turn it off and keep it off so it doesn’t HOJ. If I consent to release with CMS aft doesn’t it turn the jammer on which could give them a HOJ? For this reason it seems to me like consenting to auto release is never a wise choice. I would be interested to hear more.
This was one of my concerns, but this seems like a good tactic to implement.