Maverick issue

[albs]

I am having an issue with mavericks. Basically my first shot works perfectly then evertime from that point on that I lock a target the cross flashes and nothing I do seems to get it to stop. I line up with the target, level my wings , and even try to point my nose down at the target but no dice.

[Quasi_Stellar]

Hmm, Handoff is Complete? Are you too fast? Is there a Malfunction or Hung weapon? I’ve had the flashing happen a time or two… Sometimes you have to knock off and go around and maybe you’ll get settled in better. Have to keep it in the keyhole, though…

[Tensta]

@Quasi_Stellar:

Hmm, Handoff is Complete? Are you too fast? Is there a Malfunction or Hung weapon? I’ve had the flashing happen a time or two… Sometimes you have to knock off and go around and maybe you’ll get settled in better. Have to keep it in the keyhole, though…

Depends if hes using TGP handoff or just trying to keyhole a pre-designated position. Its wonky sometimes. Thats why I prefer using the TGP handoff, though it’s always a little bit of hassle boresight all the mavs.

[albs]

i fired at max range at a tank then uncage and targeted one next to the last target. targeting took 2-3 seconds and the cursor flashes even if i line up the fall line. I even tried to lower my nose but it wouldn’t track. Flew away 10 miles turned around and lined up, targeted another and the same thing happened. So the + needs to be near the center then? So if it right, fly right , if its low climb, etc? I was targeting using the fcr to lock and wpn page to slew and designate the target. I also tried it 3 different times same result first hits all subsequent shot don’t track.

[razo]

you need to have the + in the keyhole, which is IIRC described in the manual

[albs]

ok so do I move the jet toward the + to move it?

[Quasi_Stellar]

Yes… page 151 of the dash 34 shows the keyhole concept. By using the WPN page as SOI, am I assuming you are not boresighting each maverick station? You really need to be using boresighting and the TGP. I flew the training module many times before I had it down. Lock with TGP as SOI and fly the cross into the keyhole

[albs]

yes I am using pre in this instance. I want to be practiced in all ways of using it not just tgp handoff.

[Quasi_Stellar]

I’m sure someone with a higher pay grade will correct me… I’m pretty sure PRE should be used with boresighting… if you want to switch to WPN as SOI you may need to forego the TGP. Losing the benefit of the system. Have never tried it… I use the handoff exclusively since it’s the new paradigm of Mav employment. Even in VIS and BORE modes the TGP is used to fine tune your final target acquisition.

[albs]

seems to only be stable when the pitch angle is 5 or less if you get closer than 15 miles. Was able to get off a second shot that hit finally but had to dive and get way close on the second. will see if handoff works better. I was definitely well in the keyhole and it would not stabilize. However, it did stabilize though at angels 15 and 15miles out for both initial shots. The second shot on the first run I had to dive hard and finally got a stable shot at angels 10 and about 5 - 8 miles out from the target. On the second run I dove the same and had the angle less than 5 degrees and a clear view of the target with in practically centered and it wouldn’t stabilize. Both initial runs the pitch angle could be higher than 5 degress but only when 15 miles or so out. Once I got in close it was hard to stabilize. As a last note get your shots in first or tell your ai wingman who to attack or they may steal a kill on you.

[Quasi_Stellar]

15 miles is far out for a mav shot especially at 15k. I like about 7 miles at 7k, and about 5deg nose down at Mach 0.8…or so… good luck to you, hope you have success soon.

[Frederf]

There are quite a few solid pointing cross requirements:
1. Seeker side-look angle (10° radius circle plus the keyhole extra area)
2. 30° bank
3. 30° bank change since track started*
4. 30°/s bank rate
5. Good track quality (minimum pixel size, range, contast)
*may not apply BMS

Automatic boresight correlation (ABC) is kind of a bypass of PRE/VIS as it is a process triggered by the TGP. When you use ABC you aren’t really doing either PRE or VIS. Not sure how possible ABC is to trigger in BORE as you can’t SOI TGP in pre-designate and I think in all three modes post-designate you can’t ABC.

Make sure you’re in the range gate as well. 10-12nm is quite far. Usually the seeker limits track inside the kinematic (bracket) range.

As always make sure you’ve boresighted all stations you want to ABC handoff. Otherwise it will likely fail handoff or less likely get handed off to the wrong target. Mavericks are surprisingly picky about launch conditions and track quality. It’s usually best to get as familiar as possible with them in the simplest delivery mode (BORE) before progressing to PRE and/or VIS and lastly to ABC. Each step up the complexity chain builds off the familiarity of the last.

[Blu3wolf]

@Quasi_Stellar:

I’m sure someone with a higher pay grade will correct me… I’m pretty sure PRE should be used with boresighting… if you want to switch to WPN as SOI you may need to forego the TGP. Losing the benefit of the system. Have never tried it… I use the handoff exclusively since it’s the new paradigm of Mav employment. Even in VIS and BORE modes the TGP is used to fine tune your final target acquisition.

You should boresight when using mavericks. If you do not boresight in VIS mode, the issue will be that the range indication may be incorrect, and the location of the TD box and the mav seeker LOS will not be coincident. If you do not boresight in PRE mode, the issue will be that the range indication may be incorrect, and the location of the mav seeker LOS will not be along the area pointed by whichever sensor you are using (TGP or FCR).

This may not be such a big issue, and as such not boresighting may not be a problem. Its hardly a big deal to actually accomplish though, so its worth doing for each station anyway.

[Ironman53rd]

What was your first target and what was your second target?

If your first was a building and your second a mover or an irregular shaped object - Radar antenna that sort of thing, I would say you DO need to get in a lot close to kill movers and irregulars that you do a nice slab sided building.

As a rule of thumb with “D’s” half your Angels is a good range in Nm’s for you to get a lock - but see above comments also.

“G’s” have longer range than “D’s” so about 2/3rds of Angels to Nm’s is about right.

At extreme range there is more chance of a “flasher” just as you decide to hold down the pickle button - that’s annoying when it happens, so get well inside the bracket if you are not under threat before you pickle with a solid cross obviously.

Ironman

[macieksoft]

I see that so many people have problems with Mavericks.
I also wasted some of them at the beginning. Now i am able to fire them without wasting them.

There are 3 most important things:
-Don’t be too far . If your mavericks fall short, you can tell it by looking at external weapon wiev, you are too far from target.
-Maintain stable flight, reduce bank rate to minimum, this is very important in BMS.
-Don’t fire off boresight, off boresight MAV is always wasted MAV. Different variants of MAV have different acceptable seeker angles at launch.

If you fire off boresight or when you are not in stable flight your missile will fire but won’t guide on target, it will simply fly ballistic without any guidance.

Its easy to screw the launch, but with a little experience you will become tank buster.

[Darkman]

Here are my top tips for successful Maverick employment:

1. Read Chapter 3.2 in the TO BMS1-F16CM-34-1-1 manual to understand limitations, functions, capabilities and procedures.
2. Read Mission 13 in the BMS-Training manual before/as you fly training mission 14 to put what you’ve learned into practice.
3. Practise until you become proficient enough to avoid tunnel vision and be more aware of what else is going on around you.

For example if you are within operational limits and in range you will have a stable weapon pointing cross; if you don’t know what those limits are how do you expect to be able to reliably use this missile?

[albs]

The issue appears to be backward actually its in close that I can’t get a lock at max range its fine actually. Also I tried that same thing in 4.32 and the it still happens there as well. At max range on the indexer I have a stable shot and get hits. Less than half range on the indexer and its very tough to get a lock. I am going to try switching to vis when I go to lock it and tgp handoff. Also the sensor I am using is the weapon page view from the maverick. I lock the fcr on one of the line of tanks, then when I can see the tanks enough to lock I lock one up. Once I am at max range on the indexer I fire then try to lock another to the tank next to one I shot at, and most of the time I can’t get a stable shot. As a note I am using D’s on the triple racks and my targets are tanks. I would also note with the triple racks I can only uncage 2 at a time. I can’t cycle to the others in the rack. I will also try without the triple racks to see if that is a factor in getting a stable shot.

[Ironman53rd]

NB - 2 points -

1. a triple rack is not found in a RL combat situation
2. you cannot uncage 2 on the same triple rack as the racket motor from the first launch with “blind” the sensors on the second one on the same rack.

You may well find that movers coming towards you or adjacent to your line of flight are easier to lock than those going away from you - they throw up a “dust” cloud that obscures the target lock.

MAVs are not an easy option in 4.33 as they are not in RL - use them for “surgical” stand off strikes with “hand off” mode - the 4.32 days of 6 for 6 in a single pass are long gone !!!

Ironman

[Stevie]

LMAVs work best for tanks IRL…wish we had those in BMS.

[Frederf]

@albs:

The issue appears to be backward actually its in close that I can’t get a lock at max range its fine actually. Also I tried that same thing in 4.32 and the it still happens there as well. At max range on the indexer I have a stable shot and get hits. Less than half range on the indexer and its very tough to get a lock. I am going to try switching to vis when I go to lock it and tgp handoff. Also the sensor I am using is the weapon page view from the maverick. I lock the fcr on one of the line of tanks, then when I can see the tanks enough to lock I lock one up. Once I am at max range on the indexer I fire then try to lock another to the tank next to one I shot at, and most of the time I can’t get a stable shot. As a note I am using D’s on the triple racks and my targets are tanks. I would also note with the triple racks I can only uncage 2 at a time. I can’t cycle to the others in the rack. I will also try without the triple racks to see if that is a factor in getting a stable shot.

With TGP ABC handoff you never touch the WPN format. It’s never SOI. You point track TGP, monitor the handoff, verify good parameters on the WPN format and fire. Repeat. You aren’t really using PRE or VIS with TGP ABC. You’re in a mode about to use it but ABC is performed instead.

Slewing the Maverick has a difficulty proportional to how far the FPM is to the target.

Assuming your second missile is tracking successfully but the pointing cross is flashing then I’d have to see it to get a clue why it might not be going solid pointing cross.