Theater developmental notes - Editing and Airbase
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Hello,
I have edited a stock airbase by doing some simple things (adding hangers etc). I exported the features only, and saved my changes. However when I re-open the custom airbase, the runway numbers have changed to the default 01-10). I tried changing them back to the correct runway numbers in the PHD data, however it no longer changes, it stays at 01-10. I can change the runway numbers in all other airbases but not the custom ones. So I started over from scratch. As a test, I added a couple of hangers and saved the changes, this time I did not touch the point data. Same thing happens again. I am going crazy trying to figure the issue out. Any direction helps. Thanks in advance.
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if the runway numbers show up correctly in the Falcon Editor then they should show up in Falcon.
When u say u exported the features only? why do this? For backup?
Do u create first the airbase in f4browse? then u have to add it with tacedit. then u edit it in Falcon editor then u test it in Falcon. -
if the runway numbers show up correctly in the Falcon Editor then they should show up in Falcon. They do not show up correctly in falcon editor once I have added features and saved. The airbase that I edited is an airbase that is already in the database (default airbases).
When u say u exported the features only? why do this? For backup? Yes
Do u create first the airbase in f4browse? then u have to add it with tacedit. then u edit it in Falcon editor then u test it in Falcon. I have tried this method as well by following your Youtube videos that you have posted in other posts. However, 2 things:
1. When I add copy an airbase in F4browse and insert it into the database, any changes I make to the airbase also changes the airbase I copied from. I have a feeling that I’m doing something wrong, not sure what.
2. I still cannot change the runway numbers in Falcon editor once I have added and saved any changes made to the airbase. This happens only when I have made the changes and saved them.Side note: Testing modified airbases in Falcon, all aircraft can takeoff and recover without a problem. The E-3 Awacs however, does not. It takes the runway and attempts to takeoff, when it gets to the end of the runway it loops back around to the beginning of the runway and starts all over again. This occurs on both modified airbases as well as stock runways. I don’t think it’s related to the other issue, however it holds up all other traffic that behind it.
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hmmm messed up… no time to reply in detail now… will come back soon. Sorry.
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Okay, thanks Arty,
Hopefully some knowledgeable folks will pop in here soon… -
lol no one…
So here goes:
1. use the AddCopy method: https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?12812-CT-Limits&p=178043&viewfull=1#post178043
2. use this video (Latest vid without the messup in ct#): https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?14127-Questions-questions&p=236692&viewfull=1#post236692
3. Runway textures and how to change them: https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?14127-Questions-questions&p=216287&viewfull=1#post216287In case the number u want ain’t there in the texture sets then u have to create them. Done that for VENIZELOS INTL for Aegean v2.1 for my squadron as the original Aegean has other numbers. But have in mind that u have to also change the taxiways signs.
So:
1. Find the features needed to be changed from Falcon Editor.
2. So find the features in LodEditor (LE) and within find the textures needed to be changed.
3. Edit the textures to create new ones or totally create new ones (u must get creators approval bla bla…)
4. For Runways: Add those textures with LE to the corresponding features: https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?15225-How-be-added-a-new-skin-without-replacing&p=215730&viewfull=1#post215730
5. For taxisigns u must add (AddCopy) the objects and assign the new textures u made.
6. Go to Falcon Editor and replace on the new (From Add Copy) airbase (if u made a new one) the features u did and the runway texture u added.Should work like a charm…
Oh about the airplane that was going up and down on the runway…
yeap this… U must follow a specific order on the points designated on the Airbase runway.
Meaning in the Point Data for the RunwayListType (if u double click on it (on the name under the Point Data frame on the left) u get the properties of the runway) take care for the:
RunwayPt
TakeoffPt
TakeRunwayPtThey must be in the correct sequence else u will see strange things happen with the AI.
Like taxi all the way on the runway to go to the otherside to take off… or try to land vertically on the runway… depending on the changes u made.
Can’t really recall the sequence… I did it by try and test… somehow I did it but not 100% sure to tell u how. I done it to change from where the airplane Ramp start… I wanted them from the HAS Hangars and not from the Large Parking Area.HAVE in mind the above tools can fubar your theater. So take frequent backups while working with them… I ended up with Aegean with over 200gb of backups lol… 2-3 times files where a mess… even on the first release of the theater it got fubared… and it was showing a monument under a bridge on the sea :lol: Mostly F4browse messes things up IHO.
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Okay this is great for adding a feature, however does the same thing apply when adding an airbase, using the add copy technique? And if so, when I make change to the “copied” Airbase will it change the original as well?
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Okay this is great for adding a feature, however does the same thing apply when adding an airbase, using the add copy technique?
Yes instead of addcopy the feature u addcopy the objective.
And if so, when I make change to the “copied” Airbase will it change the original as well?
Nope. U will have 2 different airbases. With this procedure instead of creating one from scratch u copy one that best fit’s for u and then alter it.
Example Country customization. Use same airport but change some features to give a specific country identification. Like signs language Flags etc which are mostly texture work. Have in mind u must addcopy the features and then replace the textures. else u will change both airbases since they share common features. -
Okay, Thanks so much for your help Arty!! I will let you know the results
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Some tips and observations from this thread:
Add-Copy is a viable option to custom AB’s……BUT…there are many unused copies of stock AB’s that can and should be used first IMHO.
No need to expand\clutter it anymore than it is.Arty is correct in the needed order for Runway,Take off,Take Runway points…but is incorrect as to why the AI will taxi to another point and not take off. That has to do with the heading of the list’s…i.e. Runway Dimension and Runway Lists. Those are the Point HEADING List’s we establish. For years they were misunderstood as HEADER list’s. These list’s define the headings of the runway points we add.
Now here is the deal. If we establish the Runway Dimension List heading to the into the wind\RL AB name, lets say a 09_27 then we enter 90 degrees for the Heading. Then we add a Runway List and add our three points to the same heading. The AI will hunt for TRUE heading because you ain’t in KOREA anymore……LOL!!!
Here is how we correct this:
Here we can see at the bottom of the pic that the TRUE heading in game is 271…NOT 270.
So we correct this in our PHD\PT data:Now the AI will take runway and take off from that point.
Best way to do it is to establish your Runway Dimension, plus points (points go clockwise from 0-4). Than add your Runway List and the three points…Runway,Takeoff and Take Runway. Then make a TE in game from take off runway to get the TRUE heading to punch into your list’s.Hope this helps a bit,
demer -
Demmer maybe u r right but I have big doubts about this. And let me explain why:
1. The true heading u show in the first pic can be easily altered and be 272 or 269. How do u align perfectly? there isn’t a 100% sure way.
2. The heading u say to declare and thus the AI will take off from that and not mess up It was the first thing I was setting. Only when I changed the points it was ok. I’m talking for deeper AB editing then just adjusting the runway heading.
If u want to just put the runway on a different heading (small adjustment) then your way is the correct.
In my case I wanted to change the sequence and instead of Rampstarting from the large parking area I wanted them to Ramp from the Shelters where I moved the points inside the shelters but didn’t created the paths and used the ones that existed. If u do only what u r saying ATO goes bazinca and gives order to the AI to land vertically to the runway to the point where they enter the Runway for takeoff. Also for takeoff the AI enter the runway from the correct point but Taxi all the way inside the runway and takeoff from the other side. In your example they taxi enter from 09 but they takeoff from 27. -
Demmer maybe u r right but I have big doubts about this. And let me explain why:
1. The true heading u show in the first pic can be easily altered and be 272 or 269. How do u align perfectly? there isn’t a 100% sure way.
2. The heading u say to declare and thus the AI will take off from that and not mess up It was the first thing I was setting. Only when I changed the points it was ok. I’m talking for deeper AB editing then just adjusting the runway heading.
If u want to just put the runway on a different heading (small adjustment) then your way is the correct.
In my case I wanted to change the sequence and instead of Rampstarting from the large parking area I wanted them to Ramp from the Shelters where I moved the points inside the shelters but didn’t created the paths and used the ones that existed. If u do only what u r saying ATO goes bazinca and gives order to the AI to land vertically to the runway to the point where they enter the Runway for takeoff. Also for takeoff the AI enter the runway from the correct point but Taxi all the way inside the runway and takeoff from the other side. In your example they taxi enter from 09 but they takeoff from 27.1. The TRUE RL heading may not be what you have in game. We need the IG True heading to establish the lists. Also if you have Add Copied a AB and then rotated it in BMS editor (even 1 degree) you need to reestablish the heading in the lists.
AS WELL!!! you need to recreate your TE every time you make PHD\PT adjustments!!!
Otherwise the stupid “Script Monkeys” will try to fly from what they “remember”……LOL!!!2. Taxi points are different. They need to be “Lined Up” for the AI to taxi properly in sequence. There is a neat function in BMS editor that does this for us. Select them and walla! done:
If you are forcing a fast mover (Small Park point) to spawn on a slow movers (Large Park point) ……they will, but your KC10 will also ramp start from your HAS…LOL!!!
Ain’t pretty!!!
Here is a vid of how it works:demer
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1. The TRUE RL heading may not be what you have in game. We need the IG True heading to establish the lists. Also if you have Add Copied a AB and then rotated it in BMS editor (even 1 degree) you need to reestablish the heading in the lists.
yeap that is why u turn the runway Or the whole AB and then u declare the new heading to all: RnwyDimListType & RunwayListType.
AS WELL!!! you need to recreate your TE every time you make PHD\PT adjustments!!!
when u say TE what do you mean exactly?
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when u say TE what do you mean exactly?
We build a test Tactical Engagement to test our edits. If we DO NOT make a new Test TE then the AI will fly from the previously saved data.
Sigh….we have to remember that we are not just altering the PHD\PT Data files, we are also changing data in other files.
If you are working the OBJ data in a SaveX…that’s a NoGo.
We need to establish the OBJ’s in TE_New first. Then export and import into SaveX. (Delete All first or you will get a Duplicate Error)
That last tip in itself would take another thread and 2-3 Falcon weeks to explain…LOL!!!
(But that is how I got the Pusan Scenario to run in FF…chuckle!!!)demer
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Savex??? Hmmm i never thought - knew a new te mission should be made.
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Savex??? Hmmm i never thought - knew a new te mission should be made.
SaveX…. the X represents the .cam #…0,1,2…
If we use those files for testing than we need to export\import Units and rebuild Squads everytime we make an edit. Otherwise the AI will not “pick up” on the Data change. Time consuming to say the least.
A new_te.tac allows me to make correct edits “on the fly” and test results immediatly in game
Also, in GUAM I am only dealing with a handful of custom AB obj’s. They are, ATM, the only obj’s in Theater.
That being stated, they will only support TE’s not Campain’s.B4 we ask why… and we will…LOL!!! I’ll try to explain with a KISS!
In the Campain’ in my ass, an AB Obj needs some “associated” Objs to produce a functional Data Rate. (The Data Rate box for AB’s in F4Browse is misleading as it only defines how many runways are on the Obj…1 or 2…or is it 0 or 1???..LOL… ICRCATM…Naldo,Biker???)
These 'associated" obj’s need to be Power Plants, Factorys…etc…anything that produces useable data (supply) for the AB obj to use and remain viable for resupply to the squads (not replaneing, thats another hot topic ATM)
and they need to be within a certain radious that, ICRCATM, to be effective…LOL!!!demer
BTW…this is one of the many reasons Add-On’s fail in one way or another…sigh
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OMG!!! This is gold!! Thank you. Now to go and try and fail and try again!! This will lead to a thousand new questions!! But I must first get the RnwyDimListType & RunwayListType issue resolved. ATM, I’m not working on a camp, only trying to get airbases correct for a theater in dev. First question of the bat:
Add-Copy is a viable option to custom AB’s……BUT…there are many unused copies of stock AB’s that can and should be used first IMHO.
No need to expand\clutter it anymore than it is.What airbase are already in the the DB by default that are not being used, or how can I find those not being used? (I will be using a default Korea DB “copy” OR a custom Balkans object folder with new objects already inserted).
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OMG!!! This is gold!! Thank you. Now to go and try and fail and try again!! This will lead to a thousand new questions!! But I must first get the RnwyDimListType & RunwayListType issue resolved. ATM, I’m not working on a camp, only trying to get airbases correct for a theater in dev. First question of the bat:
What airbase are already in the the DB by default that are not being used, or how can I find those not being used? (I will be using a default Korea DB “copy” OR a custom Balkans object folder with new objects already inserted).
Dutch,
We could start here:
As you will see, this AB CT record has no Features or PHD\PT Data:
It is presently, and has been for awhile in the Falcon DB, just taking up space……:(…sigh, as we don’t have enuff’
So why not just use it instead of Add Copy?!?!?!
Because we are LAZY…LOL!!!
Much easier to Copy then Build from scratch…BUT!!! The BMS editor allows us now the ability to copy in Features and PHD\PT data seamlessly. That ability was available with the old tool’s, but you had to use a couple of them to achieve that result.(and you had better not make a mistake…not one…or the whole damn thing would CTD as soon as you (Joe Player) spawned…LOL!!)
That being stated, I expect soon to post a video TUT of how I do it now… I’m liking this BandiCam thing (Thanks A.S)demer
(P.S. tried to catch up with you @ Archers TS, I’ll try again)
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Okay. I will PM and setup a real time this time lol!!
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Shhhh……
demer
IF you “Get It” you maybe can “Surf with the Alien”……LOL!!!
