Thrustermaster Combined
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I am upgrading from a Saitek X52 to a Thrustmaster Warthog. I learned how to program with DX on the X52. I am researching the forum and internet about setting up the Warthog and it seems a little different. My first question is whether to use Thrustmaster Combined or not. I read that if you don’t use it you will not be able to use all the buttons on the throttle, specifically the POV’s. If I do use it then I will have to program the keys in TARGET and not DX. Is this correct and is Thrustmaster Combined definitely better and why?
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Hello, yes the Thrustmaster combined is the best option because you can use both stick and throttle together. If in sim apear the stick and the throttle separately you can’t use them both, you will have to choose one. Here in forum you can find realistic mapped profiles for warthog from various users such as Morphine and Mud, so you can run them with the script editor. I’m curently using Morphines profile with the keyfile and is perfect for me.
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Using TARGET also opens up the powerful programming options for the WH setup as well. I have used TARGET with a basic keyboard command layout versus DX programming for a long time now. The only problem I had was in the switch to 4.33 when I had some modifiers like shift, control, etc. on programmed inputs that weren’t pulsed commands. I found the fix for that and am back to problem free flying.
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What I did is exclude everything except the throttle from the TARGET script so I have two controllers: Thrustmaster Combined and Warthog Joystick
If in sim apear the stick and the throttle separately you can’t use them both, you will have to choose one.
This is not true.
This means that all 32button + POV + 8axis only have to cover the throttle. But it also means that you can’t program the joystick with the script and it behaves the same as if the script isn’t running. -
What I did is exclude everything except the throttle from the TARGET script so I have two controllers: Thrustmaster Combined and Warthog Joystick
This is not true.
This means that all 32button + POV + 8axis only have to cover the throttle. But it also means that you can’t program the joystick with the script and it behaves the same as if the script isn’t running.This sounds interesting. Does this allow you to use 32 DX callbacks for each, totaling 64 callbacks? I have not received the Warthog yet so I can’t hook it up but I would like to get an idea about what I am doing before I get it. The most important point for me is to have all buttons including POV’s working in BMS. Then I would like to be able to program as many buttons with DX callbacks as possible because I learned with my X52 that it works a lot better that way. I don’t know if it is the same with the Warthog but I have heard people with all kinds of HOTAS say that dx is the way to go. Now that I know that I cannot use all the buttons unless I use Thrustmaster Combined, I have to learn about Thrustmaster Combined. It sounds like by excluding everything except the throttle, maybe I can use more DX callbacks instead of use TARGET. I don’t know if TARGET has the same problems that Saitek has so I am curious as to whether DX callbacks are the way to go and how to maximize the use of DX if so.
Edit: Frederf, I just took a look at your profile and I really like what I see. I want my HOTAS to be as similar to the real thing as possible and it looks like you have got that going. I think I will use yours while I figure out how TARGET works and the differences between Warthog and Saitek programming.
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I have never had to program anything inside of target. The wheel has been invented already, so I have used the awesome profiles provided by ice and morpheus and modified the functionality slightly via the key file. Theirs is a combined thrustmaster and all the buttons, hats, and axis function in my setup. Good luck, and enjoy the warthog!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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I have never had to program anything inside of target. The wheel has been invented already, so I have used the awesome profiles provided by ice and morpheus and modified the functionality slightly via the key file. Theirs is a combined thrustmaster and all the buttons, hats, and axis function in my setup. Good luck, and enjoy the warthog!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I have been looking it over and I will probably try out Morphine’s profile as well. I am pretty sure I will want to personalize a bit to match my hardware and preferences so I am getting ready to dive in.
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Thrustmaster Combined is an umbrella virtual device. If you have all 6 controller types that TARGET handles you can include any combination of those controllers under the umbrella. For me I exclude the joystick from the umbrella so it behaves independently. The umbrella device is limited by the POV+32+8 limits inherent in DirectInput just like any other. I happen to have an old image that should help visualize.
If you can describe it in a sentence, TARGET scripting can accomplish it as a general rule. Since I’ve published the script/key combination I’ve changed it a little more to utilize even fewer DX buttons by utilizing the “release” context. For example a 2-position switch can be controlled using 1 DX button. The button pressed activates Callback1 and the button released activates Callback2. This can free up more DX numbers if one is running out (though probably not enough to cover both devices with only 32).
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Thanks Frederf! That helps a lot. It looks like the way you have it set up would work good for me. When I get my Warthog is there any chance I could get your current setup and see how I like it? I think the way you are freeing up DX buttons is a great idea. I also wonder about the mappings of the stick and throttle. I hear that BMS code matches the F16 flight model almost exactly and if you change the curve it will not be accurate. Is that a problem with the Warthog and TARGET?
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Sure.
Axis curves isn’t too sacred because the real thing is force-sensing. Unless you have the $X00 mod for the Warthog that makes it force sensing too it’s an approximation. I did disassemble, sand, and lubricate the joystick gimbal and it’s an improvement. I can’t actually mess with my pitch-bank curves since I don’t include the joystick in the TARGET device. I just run a small deadzone. I can’t imagine anyone feeling that the out of the box stick response in BMS as unsatisfactory.
I did make a custom curve to make deadzones and response for the cursor stick which is not the most precise thing in the world. That probably varies from user to user but the numbers are easy to edit. Since I do all the deadzone/curves in the profile I don’t run any deadzone in BMS for the X/Y cursor axes.
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OK. That sounds good to me. I will probably just plug it in and load your profile and give it a go. Now I understand that since the stick is not even in TARGET it will be the original curve and is only affected by the in game settings. That works for me. I have never had a problem with the normal curve on my X52, it’s just that it is worn out and old. I plan on using the Warthog with your profile for long enough to make sure it is working properly and I will not have to RMA it. Then I will take it apart and grease it, and maybe sand a little as well. Then I’ll use it for a while, maybe until it gets some slop in it and take a look at the FSSB. I am not too picky about my HOTAS as long as there is no friction problems with the stick. From what I hear it is a huge upgrade from the X52 and if my X52 wasn’t so worn out then I would be fine with it. One thing that will be a deal breaker for me is if the mouse cursor doesn’t work well for the FCR. That is one thing that the X52 does pretty well. If the Warthog doesn’t do that well then I will be bummed and have to think about going another way.
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You can use Target to have Falcon see the Hog as a “Combined Device” as I do, then set up the Stick and most of the Throttle inputs in Falcon as you would for any DX device.
The Boat Sw, China Hat and Throttle base I use Target to Program.
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I think I have a good idea how the Warthog works.
I can do one of three things:
1. Do not use Thrustmaster Combined and lose some buttons on the throttle.
2. Use Thrustmaster Combined on both throttle and stick which will give me access to all POV’s, Hats and buttons but I will have to map some of them though TARGET because of being limited to 8 axis, 1 POV and 32 DX buttons.
3. Use Thrustmaster Combined on the throttle only with the stick exclusive which will give me acces to all POV’s, Hats and buttons but I will have to map some through TARGET because of being limited to 8+2 axis, 1 POV and 32+19 DX buttons.I was naïve and thought the Hog would be just like the X52 but better. I look forward to getting it all set up and testing it out.