TM HOTAS noworkee
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@finsterdow Which model, precisely?
What happens – isn’t recognized, or causes BMS to crash when entering 3D… or fail to startup…
I saw the other thread but it wasn’t clear.
Share with us the contents of your
DeviceSorting.txt
file, if you would please…? -
@airtex2019 It gets the screen splash after Launch and then CTD.
The label on the Throttle states Thrustmaster Afterburner on top and Top Gun on the bottom. The Stick states Top Gun Afterburner Force Feedback on top, nothing on bottom.
This is the txt file…
{B550044F-0000-0000-0000-504944564944} “HOTAS Force Feedback Joystick”
Curious if you know if HOTAS’s have 32 and 64bit device drivers. I’m not sure at what layer they operate. Its been a couple years since I looked into this. And I’m not literate in bit level O/S
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@finsterdow Hmm I think that’s pretty old … is it USB? These days almost any joystick that’s USB will work with standard HID class device drivers in the OS. No need to install anything from Thrustmaster.
The HID spec does include force-feedback functionality… but I don’t have such a device so I can’t really test to verify it works or not.
Are there any log/dump files in your
C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\User\Logs
folder?You can also try running BMS with the
-mono
command line parameter, to see if any interesting debug messages appear, which shed light on the situation… -
@finsterdow Is your problem that BMS works but you can’t map your HOTAS or is the problem that BMS crashes after the splash screen?
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@Atlas CTD after the splash screen.
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Yes, it is USB. is there a problem with it being a USB device? Maybe I need a USB to 9 pin adapter? Or are you saying buy a new HOTAS?
Here’s the user/logs file. Are FAULT and FAIL messages normal?
I will try -mono command next
[ 1:11] [ 1:11] [SET] [4] [FLCS BIT PASS ] [-1]
[ 2:28] [ 2:28] [SET] [44] [FAULT TO/LDG CONFIG ] [-1]
[ 2:36] [ 2:36] [CLEAR] [44] [FAULT TO/LDG CONFIG ] [-1]
[ 2:51] [ 2:51] [SET] [44] [FAULT TO/LDG CONFIG ] [-1]
[ 3:34] [ 3:34] [CLEAR] [44] [FAULT TO/LDG CONFIG ] [-1]
[ 4:03] [ 4:03] [SET] [51] [FAULT PULLUP ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [CLEAR] [51] [FAULT PULLUP ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [50] [ANTI SKID ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [177] [ENG A/I FAIL] [85]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [116] [DLNK FAIL] [5]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [134] [FCR BUS FAIL] [3]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [58] [IFF INM4 DEGR] [30]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [138] [RWR BUS FAIL] [3]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [22] [ENG FIRE ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [121] [MMC DEGR] [300]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [226] [FAULT FLCS ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [147] [MFDS RFWD FAIL] [177]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [231] [FAULT FLCS ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [217] [FAULT FLCS ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [114] [HUD BUS FAIL] [3]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [127] [CADC BUS FAIL] [3]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [130] [CMDS INV DEGR] [6]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [185] [RWR LEFT FWD RECIEVER FAIL ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [31] [FAULT HYD A COMPRESSOR FAULT ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [32] [FAULT HYD B COMPRESSOR FAULT ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [15] [FAULT STANDBY GENERATOR SOFT ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [14] [FAULT MAIN GENERATOR HARD ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [19] [ENG FLOUT ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [21] [ENG HYD ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [119] [MMC DEGR] [300]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [214] [FAULT FLCS ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [221] [FLCS CCM FAIL] [22]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [216] [FAULT FLCS ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [43] [FAULT PROBEHEAT ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [146] [MFDS LFWD FAIL] [168]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [187] [RWR LEFT AFT RECIEVER FAIL ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [135] [FCR XMTR FAIL] [94]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [55] [FAULT CADC ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [124] [BMUX BUS FAIL] [3]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [188] [RWR RIGHT AFT RECIEVER FAIL ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [16] [FAULT STANDBY GENERATOR HARD ] [-1]
[ 4:06] [ 4:06] [SET] [20] [ENG FLOUT ] [-1] -
Heres log file after mono
C:\Falcon BMS 4.36>Launcher.exe -mono
C:\Falcon BMS 4.36>dir
Volume in drive C has no label.
Volume Serial Number is C27A-F317Directory of C:\Falcon BMS 4.36
10/27/2022 04:21 PM <DIR> .
10/27/2022 04:21 PM <DIR> …
09/10/2022 01:39 PM <DIR> Bin
08/21/2022 02:59 AM 2,247,281 Config.exe
10/27/2022 05:01 PM <DIR> Data
09/10/2022 01:39 PM <DIR> Docs
07/02/2022 10:41 AM <DIR> Hotas
03/12/2016 03:45 AM 1,220,096 Launcher.exe
04/12/2022 03:17 PM <DIR> Tools
09/10/2022 01:39 PM <DIR> User
2 File(s) 3,467,377 bytes
8 Dir(s) 916,205,608,960 bytes freeC:\Falcon BMS 4.36>cd user
C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\User>dir
Volume in drive C has no label.
Volume Serial Number is C27A-F317Directory of C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\User
09/10/2022 01:39 PM <DIR> .
09/10/2022 01:39 PM <DIR> …
04/12/2022 03:17 PM <DIR> Acmi
10/28/2022 02:59 PM <DIR> Briefings
10/28/2022 03:02 PM <DIR> Config
10/28/2022 02:56 PM <DIR> Logs
08/21/2022 03:06 AM <DIR> Patches
08/21/2022 03:06 AM <DIR> Pictures
04/12/2022 03:17 PM <DIR> TestScripts
0 File(s) 0 bytes
9 Dir(s) 916,205,543,424 bytes freeC:\Falcon BMS 4.36\User>cd logs
C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\User\Logs>dir
Volume in drive C has no label.
Volume Serial Number is C27A-F317Directory of C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\User\Logs
10/29/2022 11:38 AM <DIR> .
10/29/2022 11:38 AM <DIR> …
10/29/2022 11:38 AM 4,960 2022-10-29_113838_xlog.txt
10/28/2022 10:48 PM 2,295 dtc_last_flight_faults.txt
2 File(s) 7,255 bytes
2 Dir(s) 916,205,477,888 bytes freeC:\Falcon BMS 4.36\User\Logs>type 2022-10-29_113838_xlog.txt
[00:00:00.000] 7500 **** Falcon 4.0 ****
[00:00:00.000] 7500 **** 2022 Tommo Inc. All Rights Reserved. ****[00:00:00.000] 7500 **** Falcon BMS 4.36.3 (x64) Build 26590 ****
[00:00:00.000] 7500 **** 2022 Benchmark Sims. All Rights Reserved. ****[00:00:00.000] 7500 Operating System: Windows 10 (10.0.19043)
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Valid F4 installation found [C:\MicroProse\Falcon4\falcon4.exe]
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Create window at 0, 0 with size 1024x768 (client) 1040x807 (window)
[00:00:00.000] 7500 WM_SIZE 0x0 to 1024x768
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SIZE_RESTORED other (SetWindowPos, mSwapChain->SetFullscreenState…)
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SIZE_RESTORED handle resize 0x0 to 1024x768
[00:00:00.000] 7500 WM_MOVE 0|0 to 0|0 (client pos to 8|31) delta -8|-31 for style -1865809920
[00:00:00.000] 7500 FalconMainWindowD3D11::handleOnActivate 0->1
[00:00:00.000] 7500 WM_ACTIVATEAPP 1, previous active window thread 13328
[00:00:00.000] 7500 WM_ACTIVATE 1 (minimized state 0), window handle being deactivated 0
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SetWindowLongPtr GWL_STYLE -1879048192
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SetWindowLongPtr GWL_EXSTYLE 0
[00:00:00.000] 7500 AppWindow::setBorderState: style changed position 0|0 to 0|0
[00:00:00.000] 7500 AppWindow::setBorderState: style changed size to w: 1024 (1024 - 0), h: 768 (768 - 0)
[00:00:00.000] 7500 WM_MOVE 0|0 to 0|0 (client pos to 0|0) delta 0|0 for style -1879048192
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SystemLevelInit
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Initializing Sim Memory Pools…
[00:00:00.000] 7500 DeviceIndependentGraphicsSetup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 TheLoader Setup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Loading texture_POLAK.bin with 250 sets, 3471 tiles
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Flush References - start Cleanup if we don’t get anything below in log, something wrong in here ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 FlushReferences Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 ObjectLOD Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 TheTextureBank Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 ThePaletteBank Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 TheColorBank Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Info: 3DDB is new format (more than 2GB supported)
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Terrain: Load
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Terrain max texID: 3991
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Theater’s installed: Terrdata\theaterdefinition\Korea KTO.tdf
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Theater’s installed: Add-On Korea TvT\Terrdata\theaterdefinition\Korea_TvT.tdf
[00:00:00.000] 7500 GetCurrentTheater Korea KTO
[00:00:00.000] 7500 TheaterReload
[00:00:00.000] 7500 theaterPath ‘C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\Data\Terrdata\korea’
[00:00:00.000] 7500 terrainPath ‘C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\Data\Terrdata\korea\terrain’
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Loading texture_POLAK.bin with 250 sets, 3471 tiles
[00:00:00.000] 7500 objectPath ‘C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\Data\Terrdata\objects\KoreaObj’
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Flush References - start Cleanup if we don’t get anything below in log, something wrong in here ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 FlushReferences Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 ObjectLOD Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 TheTextureBank Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 ThePaletteBank Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 TheColorBank Cleanup ##
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Info: 3DDB is new format (more than 2GB supported)
[00:00:00.000] 7500 GetCurrentTheater Korea KTO
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Reading CT data from XML -> C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\Data\Terrdata\objects\Falcon4_CT.XML
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Reading CT data from XML -> Done, 4361 entries
[00:00:00.000] 7500 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[00:00:00.000] 7500 ~ Loading XMLs took ~ 1.672 seconds
[00:00:00.000] 7500 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Reading Mission data from XML -> C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\Data\Campaign\MissionData_XX.XML
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Could not open visid.map
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Terrain: Unload
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Terrain: Load
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Terrain max texID: 3991
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SoundDriver 0x00000000172769A0
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Sound SetCooperativeLevel HWND=0xf06a4
[00:00:00.000] 7500 CreateSoundBuffer
[00:00:00.000] 7500 QueryInterface IID_IDirectSound3DListener
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Listener SetDistanceFactor
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Reading comm data from XML -> C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\Data\Sounds\commfile.xml
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Reading eval data from XML -> C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\Data\Sounds\evalfile.xml
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Reading frag data from XML -> C:\Falcon BMS 4.36\Data\Sounds\fragfile.xml
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SFX loading took 2463 ticks
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Version: R26590. 1.36.EBS.4_ | Sep 10 2022 | 21:38:42 | MSVC 1929
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Couldn’t open Viper rules file, loading default rules instead
[00:00:00.000] 7500 Viper’s rules are in old file format
[00:00:00.000] 7500 GlobalSimpleThread starting 3 worker threads
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SystemLevelInit finished
[00:00:00.000] 7500 SimulationLoopControl::StartSimC:\Falcon BMS 4.36\User\Logs>
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@finsterdow said in TM HOTAS noworkee:
@Atlas CTD after the splash screen.
so how do you know it is the TM HOTAS that is at fault if you can’t into the UI after the splash screen?
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@Atlas Just quessing since it CTD’s after splash screen with HOTAS connected and runs when its not connected. I guess I don’t know for sure if its the HOTAS now that you mention it. It’s just that because of the HOTAS connection the program CTD’s, Might not be the HOTAS its self, but some process that starts when a HOTAS is connected, but not with just a keyboard.
I found two posts about this and I think they had the same HOTAS, but didn’t state if they found a fix.
Someone else mentioed that it could be Thrustmasters FFB DLL. And I should try deleting it, or renaming it. Not sure where to find that
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@finsterdow Here’s the Joystick device driver file
Maybe IFC23.DLL
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Not IFC23.DLL
I’ve asked Thrustmaster for help, but gobbledeegook. Corporate answer. Its legacy no support.
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@finsterdow said in TM HOTAS noworkee:
@Atlas Just quessing since it CTD’s after splash screen with HOTAS connected and runs when its not connected. I guess I don’t know for sure if its the HOTAS now that you mention it. It’s just that because of the HOTAS connection the program CTD’s, Might not be the HOTAS its self, but some process that starts when a HOTAS is connected, but not with just a keyboard.
I found two posts about this and I think they had the same HOTAS, but didn’t state if they found a fix.
Someone else mentioed that it could be Thrustmasters FFB DLL. And I should try deleting it, or renaming it. Not sure where to find that
Is this your joystick?
https://support.thrustmaster.com/en/product/topgunafterburner-en/Have you tried with another peripheral if BMS still crashes?
Try a clean install of BMS?
Any reason you’re not using TARGET software with that joystick setup? -
@finsterdow said in TM HOTAS noworkee:
is there a problem with it being a USB device?
no of course not… almost everything is USB.
I was just saying, HID devices describe themselves to the OS… no “driver” should be required, even for LED lights and FFB effects, as far as I know (but I haven’t tested or verified that).
so, one thing to try is maybe delete/uninstall the TM drivers. not sure how easy that is, or how to tell if it was completely successful or not tho.
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@airtex2019 Yes, I’ve done that.
Firstly, I want to thank you guys for the help you’ve given me. Over the top and gone the extra mile. That’s all one could ask.
A couple last Q’s
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I want to try the “delete the FFB DLL” thing, but don’t know its name. Ive asked Thrustmaster for help, waiting to hear back. If anyone knows the name, I’d appreciate it.
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Can you tell me if this HOTAS will work with BMS? Thrustmaster T-Flight Hotas X Flight Stick for PS3/ PC, Black. I just want one that works, don’t need all the Bells and Whistles. Just want to get into the SIM and fly and learn, then I’ll spend the big bucks on a new one
I love this SIM. The best one out there as far as I’m concerned.
Please don’t spend anymore time trying to figure out why this thing doesn’t work. You’ve done enoughThanks again
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@Atlas Sorry for my Newbie knowledge but what do you mean TARGET software?
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@finsterdow TARGET is the name of Thrustmaster client software, for calibrating and remapping your devices.
I don’t know if it would help or not, here. Maybe
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@airtex2019 I know I said no more Q’s, but I just had to. One thing that’s lost in all this is, this worked on 4.33 at 32bit.
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@finsterdow As @airtex2019 said, this is the new software for TM stuff. Try using that to download your drivers, see if that works?
Apologies for not being able to give specific advice as I would guess not many here have your specific hardware.
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@finsterdow Yes, I can confirm this works with BMS…I acquired one for this purpose when I started BMS. Using JoyToKey I was able to increase it’s functionality by creating button combinations - I’d be happy to share my config file for it to help you get started, just PM me if you’d like to try it. Also using voice recognition helps to supplement extra input, particularly with comms menu commands. VoiceAttack with @SemlerPDX’s AVCS4 profile is the premier way to go here, but you also have a free option with FoxVox here. I highly recommend either option.