Visibility settings in 433

[Hans]

As I understand it this Visibilty is controlled inside the F4UI and not via Weather commander for the 4 different weather types (Sunny, Fair, Poor, Inclement)

The Stratus Layer is the same setting that used to be in the falcon BMS.cfg in 4.32

set g_nWxStratusBaseSunny 35000 // Vars to control the stratus base for Sunny weather
set g_nWxStratusBaseFair 30000 // Vars to control the stratus base for Fair weather
set g_nWxStratusBasePoor 13300 // Vars to control the stratus base for Poor weather
set g_nWxStratusBaseInclement 7500 // Vars to control the stratus base for Inclement weather

How to get Poor Thick?
How to get Inclement Thick?

How thick is the ground /fog layer? Can it be controlled somewhere?
In 432 it was always from the groud up to the base and you could set a numerical value for start for and end fog
In 433 we have silder that goes from 0 to 30 miles, How exactly does that work?
Is there a way to precisely control visibility (say for training puposes you want the visibilty to be just above the legal limit for an Approack (Tacan, ILS or PAR or whatever the case may be)

In the long run it would be really cool if all weather control could be done in one place (everything inside F4 or everything inside weather commander)

[Red Dog]

All weather settings are now in one place: the weather tab.
I suggest having a look at the BMS manual, weather chapter. Most if not all of your questions are answered there

[Hans]

I looked and no, they are not answered.

I have 4 weather types and 5 different stratus base layers. How does that work?

How exactly does the sliders work, before you had a fog start and a fog end numerical value. now you have only 1 slider. It might control the same thing that was called fog end (at which distance do you have 0 Visibilty) with fog start always at 0.
There might be a hard coded distance between fog start and fog end with the slider them moving the for start and for end values.
it could be programmed even differently

Is it possible to set exact numbers (maybe with an external tool) to precisely control visibility.
A slider that goes from 0 to 30 Nm (or 10 km, what is correct here, cant be both) is not really precise. Are the sliders linear or logarithmic?

[Mav-jp]

@Hans:

I looked and no, they are not answered.

I have 4 weather types and 5 different stratus base layers. How does that work?

How exactly does the sliders work, before you had a fog start and a fog end numerical value. now you have only 1 slider. It might control the same thing that was called fog end (at which distance do you have 0 Visibilty) with fog start always at 0.
There might be a hard coded distance between fog start and fog end with the slider them moving the for start and for end values.
it could be programmed even differently

Is it possible to set exact numbers (maybe with an external tool) to precisely control visibility.
A slider that goes from 0 to 30 Nm (or 10 km, what is correct here, cant be both) is not really precise. Are the sliders linear or logarithmic?

5 different stratus layer ?

wow…. we dont fly the same version
…

for visibility they are coded in log(10*x^3 +ln(ageofcaptain))

next time you read real weather bulletin ask fogstart and fogend…

[Hans]

Yes, 5 as seen in game and in the BMS Manual page 5-57

Sunny……35000 ft
Fair…30000 ft
Poor / Incl…13300 ft
Poor Thick…2000 ft
Incl Thick…7000 ft

[Hans]

for visibility they are coded in log(10*x^3 +ln(ageofcaptain))

My birthday is the 30th may, Where can I download the yearly patch?:D

[Mav-jp]

@Hans:

Yes, 5 as seen in game and in the BMS Manual page 5-57

that is 3 layers atlitude and 2 thickness

not 5 layers

[Hans]

So with the numbers above there would be a cloud layer from
13300-2000 = 11300 ft to 13300 ft in poor weather (assuimg those altitudes are above MSL)

and
from 6300 to 13300 in inclement weather.

if I would set the slider to 0 I would not see anything at 6301 ft and would have a clear view at the ground at 6299 ft.

If I´d want to create a IFR situation close to the Minimums at Kunsan for example.
I could set Poor weather stratus base at 13400, poor thickness to 13000 and the visibility slider so something like 0.5 miles

This means I should see the runway lights start to appear at about 400ft + 3000ft*Sin 3°= 560 ft MSL and should see the runway clearly at 400 ft MSL whcih would even allow to do a LOC but not a circle to land

[Mav-jp]

@Hans:

So with the numbers above there would be a cloud layer from
13300-2000 = 11300 ft to 13300 ft in poor weather (assuimg those altitudes are above MSL)

and
from 6300 to 13300 in inclement weather.

if I would set the slider to 0 I would not see anything at 6301 ft and would have a clear view at the ground at 6299 ft.

If I´d want to create a IFR situation close to the Minimums at Kunsan for example.
I could set Poor weather stratus base at 13400, poor thickness to 13000 and the visibility slider so something like 0.5 miles

This means I should see the runway lights start to appear at about 400ft + 3000ft*Sin 3°= 560 ft MSL and should see the runway clearly at 400 ft MSL whcih would even allow to do a LOC but not a circle to land

be careful

Visibility and clouds layer are 100% independant…

visibility is only FOG related, you can have FOG in sunny conditions.

the only link is that FOG applies only under the cloud layer, not above.

the level of FOG INSIDE cloud layer can not be changed by the user, is is alway the same whatever the condition

[Hans]

Ok think I got it now, well almost

If I set the fog slider to the maximum will the cloud ceeling and cloud base be a sharp change or will the code blend the edges automatically?

So to get my LOC minimums I should set the cloud base to something like 500ft (e.g 13500ft base and 13000 thickness) and the fog slider to something like
800 ft / sin3° = ca 2.5 Nm to blend the edges and create a more natural feel.

[Red Dog]

For you guys easier minds following this conversation, basically you just adjust the cloud layer for ceiling. (Cloud base is the lowest altitude of the clouds not the highest as said above - and thickness is the thickness of the layer from the cloud base and up)
and the VISIBILITY slider for horizontal visibility (Under the clouds).
No rocket sciences needed. Just pure logic as explained in the manual, as stated before.

BMS manual Page 5-57 with the answer you didn’t find in Bold Hans

The cloud tab controls visibility and cloud and contrail layers. Clouds are now shared in multiplayer which means that all players should see the same cloud cover throughout the theatre.
Visibility can be set for each weather type with a slider changing from zero (no visibility) to 30Nm (10Km) visibility. The TE designer can control two clouds layers: Cumulus and Stratus.
• Cumulus are generally associated with good (but unstable) weather. They are puffy and cotton (wool)-like clouds. They can cover up to 50% of the sky and the base altitude of the cumulus can be set for each type of weather in the CUMULUS LAYER section. Please note: you cannot have cumulus clouds in Sunny; cumulus settings are only valid when cumulus clouds are possible.
The CUMULUS COVERAGE slider adjusts the number of cumulus clouds in the sky. This has a big FPS impact. The second slider THICK/SCATTERED changes how dense the cumulus clouds appear. The left position of the slider will create 1 big thick cumulus cloud, the further the slider is placed to the right the more cotton like the Cumulus cell will look with many smaller scattered cumulus clouds.
• Stratus are horizontal layering clouds usually associated with stable weather. Stratus are set in the STRATUS LAYER box. Base altitude can be set in feet for Sunny and Fair, but the layer is always thin. In good weather stratus clouds are usually thin layers at high altitude. Poor and Inclement always have the same base altitude but the layer thickness can be different (Poor Thick and Incl Thick). Very often in bad weather the stratus layer has embedded Nimbostratus, which generate a lot of rain and bad visibility.

[Blu3wolf]

Loving the fact that clouds have a thickness to them… descended into the WX yesterday en route to KUN and had a bit of a fit, had to go looking for lead to make sure I could still see him!

[Mav-jp]

@Red:

For you guys easier minds following this conversation, basically you just adjust the cloud layer for ceiling. (Cloud base is the lowest altitude of the clouds not the highest as said above - and thickness is the thickness of the layer from the cloud base and up)
and the VISIBILITY slider for horizontal visibility (Under the clouds).
No rocket sciences needed. Just pure logic as explained in the manual, as stated before.

BMS manual Page 5-57 with the answer you didn’t find in Bold Hans

BE CAREFUL

for cumulus you adjust cumulus BASE

for stratus you adjust ceiling, so stratus base = stratus ceiling layer - thickness

[Hans]

zero (no visibility) to 30Nm (10Km) visibility

30 Nautical miles = ca 55.6 Kilometer.

I guess the silders goes from 0 to 30 Nm, Where do the 10 Km come in?

[Hans]

The funny thing is that according to the ICAO the cloud ceiling is the lower end of the cloud and the cloud base is the upper end.
If you stay below the ceiling you will fly below the clouds, If you stay above the base you will fly above the clouds.

In normal english, in metrology and in mav-JPs and Reddogs it is the other way round.

According to ICAO one had to say
for cumulus you adjust cumulus Ceiling

for stratus you adjust base, so stratus ceiling = stratus base layer - thickness

In any case the clouds go from 13300 ft to 6300 ft (7000 ft thickness) in inclement weather with the numbers I quoted out of the manual.

If anybody has some insight what the meaning of 10km is (see aboves post) I would be grateful

[Hans]

Tested and made 2 strange observations
Weather Poor: Status height 5000 ft Poor thickness 3000 ft

A) Fog at 30 NM (I know unrealistc but for the test)
Below 2000 ft I see a cloud above me and I can see very well.
Inside the cloud layer (from 2000 ft to 5000 ft) I see grey
Above the clouds (5000 ft) i see clear weather and blue skies.

All that is as expected. However when flying above the cloud layer and looking down I can see holes in the clouds below me, I can see the ground through those holes (looks like the holes are part of the grafic that textures the top of the cloud layer)
When I fly in one of those holes in the clouds I can see the ground until I descent below 5000 ft and are suddenly in the clouds, were just a second before I could see a hole.

Solution might be to modify the “cloud level skin” so there are no holes.

B) Fog at a small number (about 1 slider button diamater, so maybe about 2000 ft)
Visibility below the cloud layer and in the cloud layer shitty as expected.
again grey until I reach the 5000ft (top of the cloud layer)
Above those 5000ft everything around me looks white, The sun is visible but not really bright and there is no blue sky.

Seems like fog settings are in some way active above the cloud layers as well

[Hans]

Friendly bump. since I dropped from the first page rathr quickly.

Is eveybody seing the same? Is there a trick to get the described behaviour (Fog settings only applied below the stratus clouds)?

[Mav-jp]

know issue
. only workaround would be to remove the holes in the texture…. or to make different textures dependant on fog value below…

[Hans]

Rgr, any insight on case B) as well?

[Mav-jp]

i will check B)