Irisdynamics Magnetic FFB
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What??
@A.S:
If you are honestly interested in something, maybe you should communicate differently in order to get that information.
Or research on your own, which is a valid option and not that difficult tbh.
Interesting. YOU make the claim and then as ME to research it? Sure, dude.Besides, if you would have read carefully… you would have understood, that someone who “might” make a product, will not share his information of how to, before he turned the “JUST What ifs” - as you downed it - into actual reality. Talk is cheap…and right now we are just talking - and with you, from my point of view, not very constructive.
Replies from others were more valueable and usefull, or objective so far.
Well, if you were planning to make this into a business venture, you should’ve said so and made it clear from the get go. As it is, IMHO, you’re just looking like a selfish person dangling a carrot in front of an otherwise open and sharing community. I have no obligation to make anything constructive in such a discussion. Also quite hypocritical to say I should’ve asked differently to get info and then turn around immediately and say you weren’t going share it anyway.Talk is indeed cheap, buddy, and so far, that’s all you’re doing.
Nevertheless, i just now remembered valueable lessons.
Don´t argue with potential custormers.
Customer is always right.
Listen to them (the market) and extract the data required to “make them happy”.
Customer is “king”, but dont socialize with them privatly.
So, in a way it was constructive, but also enough of it.
Yeah, “potential” is right. Just like DCS “potential.” Also, you just remember this lesson NOW??? After being a business man your entire life?I am not interested in excuses, or opinions how things are (doh! not shit sherlock), or could or could not be hypothetically.
More interested in ideas and forward moving inspirational thoughts and solutions (these kind of “what ifs”) - thus making the post about this totally new and unconventional approach (1st post).
LOL dude!! YOU are the one making excuses as to why this “potential” better product is not out in the market yet. Please stop shooting yourself in the foot.PS: " poor man’s FCC thread" << i remember having seen something like this in the past. Do you have a link?
Apologies for that; I was referring to the Low Cost FSSB thread. I was so tempted to be un-constructive and just tell you to Google it yourself, but I’m not like that. -
Holy Crap where am i, lol? At RuPauls TV show? Dude (wait, are you male or female?) … its ok.
Please stop this “turning in circles”, “chasing own tails” - drama-queen stuff. Its all good. I am not attacking you or your opinions here.But i ALSO DON´T OWE you nothing!
I didnt make any claims… i wrote i think!!! it can be done better (post #29). If you think it can not be done better, fine.
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@A.S:
I didnt make any claims… i wrote i think!!! it can be done better (post #29). If you think it can not be done better, fine.
That’s not exactly what you were saying:
@A.S:to be very honest… i believe, people who have electronics base knowledge and metal-work skills, could make a better and cheaper version of that.
@A.S:
BUT i have seen the tech used in the FCC3 and i know there are better, more precise, more endurable “load sensors” on the market for only a little higher prices.
@A.S:
My approach comes from a developers point of view, in terms of “Can a better product for a lesser end-sales-price be produced?”
I think - based on what i know - YES. (market quantity - quality - production/marketing costs, profit margin thoughts etc etc).@A.S:
Holy Crap where am i, lol? At RuPauls TV show? Dude (wait, are you male or female?) … its ok.
Lovely how you stoop so low. What does male or female have to do with anything? Don’t bother answering, rhetorical question
Please stop this “turning in circles”, “chasing own tails” - drama-queen stuff. Its all good. I am not attacking you or your opinions here.
I’m not the one doing the side-stepping, dude. Also has TOTALLY nothing to do with attacks or opinions. As RD said, more like brain masturbation or blowing into the windBut i ALSO DON´T OWE you nothing!
My, my, my…. posting in all-caps… who’s the drama queen now? Also, I’ve never said you owe me anything. Stop the strawman arguments.Long story short, you’ve made a claim which you have no intention of supporting; if it were true, you had no intention of sharing the info anyway so either you’re lying or you’re just being mean. It doesn’t really matter which one as 1) your “product” is nowhere near being available and 2) the current offering is very fit for purpose and is is priced at an acceptable level. You had no intention of altering the current situation and just felt the need to brag.
Good day to you sir.
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Alright, i will bite - for the sake of respectfull conversation and entertainment.
Call me liar or mean. I dont give a shit about what you think tbh., because your motives and argumentations are transparent and so far empty.
Yes, all that is, what i said and i stand for it for good reasons-
Nay sayers like you are usually the ones bragging later owning one of such devices, because they buy always the “status quo crap”. They have no other choice.
I have seen the same bashing and ridicule with MFGCrosswind pedals initially as he started from the “garage”. Now people are “bragging” with picture posts, that they bought and own one. -
People with a purpose and a background, dont just “brag” (correction: question current offerings) or write like i did for no reason. I am aware of the BS AND valueable feedback i will get back.
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AV8Rs and Stevies posts had content and intelligence, you are just arguing for the sake of it. We have many of that kind people in the sim community. Not able to add much, but loud in bitching much.
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If you would know me better, you would know, that i shared shit loads of information on that mattter on the FO forums, but few things (own ideas) i can and will not share at this moment - for obvious reasons.
IF i ever will really produce it… you will know about it soon enough. There is a high probability, but i can´t make promises, nor tell when atm. So far i only built one for myself… and other (the real ideas) exist only “on paper” (within software).
What i can tell you though is, that … (well, i dont think it interests you anyways, but it might interest others)
…the initial market research, product comparisions, analysis of these and their details and the own initial design/proto-types and tests are the lesser problem. The distribution channels later are not a big of an issue either. The branding, registration and marketing is also not a problem, at least not from my perspective or point.
Understanding the demand and needs, and wishes of customers/users is MOST crucial. Understanding the flaws of “current offerings” THEREFORE aswell! And now we get to the price(cost) possible.
The BIGGEST problem is in the finding profit-able production-cost solutions IF the intent is to produce in higher numbers!!!
That instance is mostly - if not always - underestimated by “garage inventors” and “Low cost FCC DIY´ers” and it is, what drives the sales price at the end.
My problem is not, starting it (ie. making few units and selling them by order and gaining feedbacks and reviews …or/and growing with the orders). My problem is, how to proceed, if shit gets real (if it really grows in numbers).
I have been in contact with two industrial designers and a friend, who already went through all this selling more than 4 million units of his own product. They were able to give me an insight into this area (cost analysis, sub-contractors, machines, molds, packaging, transport etc etc)… and you would be suprised, how expensive things can get. I can fully understand, why “MadCatz” (Saitek) i.e is made in foreign countries (Korea, Taiwan? i forgot) and why the design concept they used therefore. I also can respect (understand) the struggles thrustmaster faces(d).
Nevertheless, most sticks on the market are litterally over-priced junk! and use really low quality components and internally hidden “crap design” - people with smarts and honesty owning those agree with me (but most guys buy “by the looks” and decide “subjective” and dont dare to take a screw driver and look inside things anyways).The industry provides massive and better alternatives if it comes to components (i.e micro-switches, sensors, cables etc etc), but again…
the real challange is to create a product line from the “bathtub idea” all the way to final distribution… well planed and thought-through in all aspects.Ofc, you can built one prototype… “brag” about the solution with pictures on forums. Many guys have done that, especially on russian forums … their DIYs are way more advanced what i have ever seen on english forums.
If it is only a hobby, then this act (sharing is caring) is a nobel act - although even those people found or met their personal “-ICE-s” who just knew it all better and all feedback was only critisism and provocations - real “wind”, lol.
But, if the intent is to commercialize those ideas…this kind of premature bragging would be litterally STUPID. -
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I have absolutely no idea why you come at me with attitude and frankly, this exchange has lowered my respect for you… but you don’t care what I think anyway, so no issues there eh?
@A.S:
Alright, i will bite - for the sake of respectfull conversation and entertainment.
Reading the rest of your post, you sure have a funny definition of “respect.”Call me liar or mean. I dont give a shit about what you think tbh., because your motives and argumentations are transparent and so far empty.
Yes, all that is, what i said and i stand for it for good reasons
Pffft!! My motives are my own and trust me when I say you’re far off the mark. As for arguments, I’m not making any. I’m only asking questions and asking you for proof of statements YOU made. That’s not against some forum rule or some law, is it?- Nay sayers like you are usually the ones bragging later owning one of such devices, because they buy always the “status quo crap”. They have no other choice.
I have seen the same bashing and ridicule with MFGCrosswind pedals initially as he started from the “garage”. Now people are “bragging” with picture posts, that they bought and own one.
Stereotype much? Also, I’m not the one doing the bashing of an established product here, mate.
Also, to prove my point that you’re talking out of your bottom, take a look at this:
Does that look like an FCC or FSSB setup to you? Putting your foot in your mouth again, and this time shoving it in with gusto, I see…
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People with a purpose and a background, dont just “brag” (correction: question current offerings) or write like i did for no reason. I am aware of the BS AND valueable feedback i will get back.
LOL… valuable feedback for a product that you may or most likely may NOT bring to market? -
AV8Rs and Stevies posts had content and intelligence, you are just arguing for the sake of it. We have many of that kind people in the sim community. Not able to add much, but loud in bitching much.
Sure, dude, sure. Also, you’re confusing “asking” and arguing. I apparently also don’t add much to the comunity as well. I’m sorry but I’m finding it difficult to find that “respectful conversation” you were talking about…. -
If you would know me better, you would know, that i shared shit loads of information on that mattter on the FO forums, but few things (own ideas) i can and will not share at this moment - for obvious reasons.
IF i ever will really produce it… you will know about it soon enough. There is a high probability, but i can´t make promises, nor tell when atm. So, far i only built one for myself… and other (the real ideas) exists only “on paper” (within software).
Sorry, I don’t go to the FO forums… and like I said, if your intention was not to share, you could’ve made that much, much clearer from the get-go.What i can tell you though is, that … (well, i dont think it interests you anyways, but it might interest others)
Hahaha… cute! Very noble of you to be sharing info now……the initial market research, product comparisions, analysis of these and their details and the own initial design/proto-types and tests are the lesser problem. The distribution channels later are not a big of an issue either.
The branding, registration and marketing is also not a problem, at least not from my perspective or point.
Understanding the demand and needs, and wishes of customers/users is MOST crucial. Understanding the flaws of “current offerings” aswell!
And you being neck-deep in your target “market” should have no trouble in this! You’ve already cited the flaws of current offerings…. not that you’re bashing them, mind!The BIGGEST problem is in the finding profit-able production-cost solutions IF the intent is to produce in higher numbers!!!
I’m sure the demand for this will be staggering, considering this is a niche market… I wonder who made this statement earlier…I find this to hold no water anyway… I know from my limited time in the VP forums that serious simmers — the obvious target for these products — totally understand and are willing to work with people to supply this hobby with better, higher-quality components. These customers are willing to wait months if not years to get their hands on their new toy. These customers understand low production units, limited production runs, and longer-than-normal production times! So why worry about the “if the demand takes off” when you aren’t even offering anything yet? It’s like worrying about what I’ll do with my lottery winnings when I’m not even sure if I’ll buy a ticket this week.
That instance is mostly - if not always - underestimated by “garage inventors” and “Low cost FCC DIY´ers” and it is, what drives the sales price at the end.
My problem is not, starting it (ie. making few units and selling them by order and gaining feedbacks and reviews …or/and growing with the orders). My problem is, how to proceed, if shit gets real (if it really grows in numbers).
I have been in contact with two industrial designers and a friend, who already went through all this selling more than 4 million units of his own product. They were able to give me an insight into this area (cost analysis, sub-contractors, machines, molds, packaging, transport etc etc)… and you would be suprised, how expensive things can get. I can fully understand, why “MadCatz” (Saitek) i.e is made in foreign countries (Korea, Taiwan? i forgot) and why the design concept they used therefore. I also can respect (understand) the struggles thrustmaster faces(d).
Cool! However, have you asked the makers of FCC or FSSB as to what their total sales are to-date? I doubt it’s anywhere near 4 million, so the challenges of your associates may not even be a factor for you.Nevertheless, most sticks on the market are litterally over-priced junk! and use really low quality components and internally hidden “crap design” - people with smarts and honesty owing those agree with me (but most guys buy by the looks and dont dare to take a screw driver and look inside things anyways).
Maybe because they don’t have the skill or knowledge to tinker with anything? Nah! Let’s go ahead and call those people shallow!The industry provides massive and better alternatives if it comes to components (i.e micro-switches, sensors, cables etc etc), but again…
But again… nobody takes them up on it because development and production vs. expected ROI doesn’t make it worth it… so all of this is a “what-if brain masturbation.”the real challange is to create a product line from the “bathtub idea” all the way to final distribution… well planed and thought-through in all aspects.
Ofc, you can built one prototype… “brag” about the solution with pictures on forums. Many guys have done that, especially on russian forums … their DIYs are way more advanced what i have ever seen on english forums.
If it is only a hobby, then this act (sharing is caring) is a nobel act - although even those people found or met their personal “-ICE-s” who just knew it all better and all feedback was critisism and provocations, lol.
Yeah, let’s get all personal now, shall we? So much for not giving a shit to what I think, huh?But, if the intent is to commercialize those ideas…this kind of premature bragging would be litterally STUPID.
Hahahahaha…. which you just did, sans pictures and an actual prototype. See, if some Russian built a prototype, bragged about it, but ends up helping other people make their own by sharing knowledge and resources, that is something to be applauded. 1) He built a damn prototype and 2) he’s helping others! When someone says “I can do better” but has abso-****ing-lutely nothing to show for it aside from his words, does not share any knowledge or resources, and starts going on a tantrum, well, that’s a different story entirely.I guess the proof will be in the pudding, eh? Bottom line, I look forward to the day when you offer a better, more precise, higher quality force-sensing stick at a significantly lower price than current offerings. I totally don’t mind being wrong, and I’d love to be wrong on this one… but until then, well, I can’t quite remember who said this, but “talk is cheap!”
I wish you a very good day, sir!
- Nay sayers like you are usually the ones bragging later owning one of such devices, because they buy always the “status quo crap”. They have no other choice.
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I look forward to the day when you offer a better, more precise, higher quality force-sensing stick at a significantly lower price than current offerings. I totally don’t mind being wrong, and I’d love to be wrong on this one…. but until then, well, I can’t quite remember who said this, but “talk is cheap!”
Now you said something “good” once in a while
Buddy… this is not personal. I made my standpoint clear i think, which is not only my view anyways and which is exactly what you said
better, more precise, higher quality force-sensing stick at a significantly lower price than current offerings.
YES, i believe that this is very possible. Even MORE so than with mechanically moving sticks btw.
What do you want from me? Why do you even bother debating with me the way you do?
We are turning in circles here. What is your point?
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@A.S:
I never posted anything yet. The 1st post of this thread is NOT MY product. Just something “new” i stumbled upon on the net.
I never said you did…. and I know the 1st post is not yours. DUH!! This conversation was simply a result of your claim in post #20 & #23 of this thread. I will be honest with you and tell you that those statements gave me two scenarios: 1) that a FCC/FSSB-type product could be produced for cheaper and/or 2) that a current FCC/FSSB could be made even better with improved electronics. Either way, a better product. You cannot blame me for being interested in either scenario, regardless of whether I currently own an FCC/FSSB. So I ask you a bunch of questions on post #27, but then you come back at me with a snarky “google it” reply… I have as much chance of success there as you have doing brain surgery tomorrow. That’s not to say either of us is stupid, just that either topics are outside each one’s scope of knowledge. It’s like telling a newbie to RTFM without referencing page numbers or keywords.Now you said something good once in a while
And I sincerely, truly hope you prove me wrong, dude! I will be one of your first customers! Sooner would also be better rather than later I’ve tried an UberNXT2-modded Cougar, I’ve tried an FSSB-R1-modded Cougar, and still I’ve stuck to my WH…. maybe it’ll be your implementation that will get me to replace my WH base! Who knows?! Can’t really tell until the product is available though!Buddy… this is not personal. I dont have time for these kind of weddings. I dont even know you, nor do you know me.
What makes you think it is? You were the one that started it with the snarky replies, accusations of empty and un-constructive posts, being holier-than-thou, even using my name to signify a profoundly negative person…. which to be honest I did not expect from a long-time community member like yourself. Snarky replies, stereo-typing, and for some reason hating on the people who owns FCC-3s, yet you can’t even apologize after being shown how baseless your accusations were. All of that and you have the cheek to say “this is not personal”… sure, dude, sure.I dont know what you want from me? What do you want from me? Why do even bother arguing with me the way you do?
I made my standpoint clear i think. We are turning in circles here.
Just wanted info…. like I said, you made the claim of knowing how to make a better product… I think the mistake you made was bragging about it when you have nothing to show for it at this stage nor were you willing to share your knowledge with the community. Not cool at all. But yeah, you made your stance clear — you do not have the time/resources/money/whatever to bring such a product to market yet you are not willing to share your knowledge… in a community where an excellent simulation mod is given for free… in a community built upon the “experienced” helping the “newbies”… in a community where other hardware and software mod creators go above and beyond for the hobby. While you are totally within your rights to do this, well, like I said, not cool at all.The rest of my posts were just to expose the irony of the situations you’ve put yourself in, the places where you’ve put your foot in your mouth, the places where you shoot yourself in the foot… and to counter the rudeness in your posts.
Bottom line, as Red Dog said, this is all brain masturbation until you actually do what you speak of. The creators of the FCC and FSSB mods have their reasons for choosing the design and components that they have and so far there has been no outcry of inferior performance and they have their track record to back up their decisions…. and until you have a product in the market which proves itself superior in build quality and reliability, well, as you yourself said, talk is cheap.
I hope that clears it up for you.
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Guys yeap it’s pointless.
AS man u ask others for business u have no idea about it… Well it’s like going in a DF with radar off and HP off.
Yeap those force products are expensive. Guess what iPhones are way more… They cost less their half price but selling like crazy even if others are even better.
Have u thought of it for your business endeavors for building and selling like crazy?MilesD has a nice approach. He builds quitely, low prices for the poor us, very good quality, best support out there even when not his issue.
I can do those, I do those. End of story.Στάλθηκε από το MI 5 μου χρησιμοποιώντας Tapatalk
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I think this topic has run it’s course
there is nothing of value in here and if it continues i’m afraid ppl will get banned.One last bit of advice to those willing to make better than what’s already available :
- you’re free to do it
- don’t spit on the opposition to make your project look better
- Rather bring your quality and proven facts to the front stage - if they are real, they should be enough to prove your point.
Till then, this is all vaporware