Ancient flyer back to noob status (again) - Warthog set-up questions for BMS 4.35
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I hope you won’t mind if I ask a couple of real noob-type questions, even though I’ve been flying on and off since the original Falcon 4.0 emerged. I began with a TM F-16 TQS, then a TM Cougar, modded it with U2NXT hall sensors, and so on, and I’ve just bought a TM Warthog.
In the beginning you had to program the TQS yourself using James ‘Nutty’ Hallows ‘Foxy’ programming language. Made your brain hurt. As BMS developed it got easier and easier, until in the last iteration I flew (BMS 4.32?) I just loaded the keyfile which Dunc had so kindly made, and lo and behold I had a fully-functioning F-16 HOTAS.
The only downside was the wretched Cougar forever losing its firmware, and having to re-instal it and recalibrate stick and throttle, which was a right pain especially the radar cursors (you could never figure what was ‘up’ and ‘down’…).
OK here’s my questions:
1. So if inside BMS 4.35 I load the ‘BMS-BasicDX TM Warthog.key’ file kindly provided in the ‘Docs’ folder, and assign axes appropriately (my Warthog seems to be missing a Radar Antenna Elevation knob but I guess there’s something else there on this impressive chunk of hardware), is that it - I mean have I got the equivalent of Dunc’s proper F-16 HOTAS, and nothing else to do? I see by the way there’s a very neat routine for assigning both afterburner and idle/cut-off detents.
2. If I’ve done this I don’t need the BMS Alternative Launcher, right?
3. Finally, and I feel even dumber at this point, is it right that I don’t need to instal any TM drivers for the Warthog, and I don’t need to calibrate it?! If so, it was worth the money before I’ve even plugged it in.
Last couple of years I’ve been flying 1930s & '40s propliners in FSX (the old version which works properly), and I am pretty excited about BMS 4.35 and getting back to shooting things down and blowing things up - oh, and being shot down. Thanks wonderful BMS developers, my heroes.
Alan
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1. Yes, seems like that is all you need to do - you can set your RADAR Ant. Elevation under Setup > Controllers > Advanced > Avionics (tab along top)
2. Correct, assigning your keybinds using a premade keyfile eliminates most of the need or benefit of using Alternative Launcher, though it does have other features. One thing you might do is set your “DeviceSorting.txt” file to ‘Read Only’ so that even if you unplug your WH between sessions, BMS will not re-write this file with an altered device order. This is under the “.\User\Config” folder
3. I can’t help with this question, I have friends who own this HOTAS, but I don’t. Windows is extremely plug-n-play with most all mainstream devices, but you should refer to TM WH documentation regarding any installation of drivers/software. You definitely don’t “need” any software for any stick unless it is required by firmware, these are typically programming suites for setting keystrokes/macros to buttons. I’ll let other WH owners chime in on this question.
Best wishes and study hard - it’s worth it!
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1. With the .key you mentioned it is intended that you use china hat forward/back as the digital control for antenna elevation. That means your antenna elevation is by button presses and you won’t be setting any axis for it.
3. There’s no exact need for the drivers but it’s easy to do and provides a little more natural support. It’s a DX controller which is a standard that should work without any specific software. That’s different than TARGET which is a profiler software which will require effort and is only needed if you want to use it. Install the drivers, skip TARGET unless you want to do Foxy-type programming.
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Welcome back Alan
I’ve mapped the ANT ELEV function to the red “china hat” on the right side of the throttle arm, operatingi it with my left thumb; this works nicely for me. I’d also advice to give target a wide berth and use DX “programming” (it’s less complicated than it sounds really) all the way. You can use Kolbe’s “key file generator” spreadsheet (found in the docs/Input Devices section) to create a mapping that fits your needs, but the default provided is already very good.
Enjoy the BMS community & all the best,
Uwe
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Gentlemen, thank you for your outstandingly helpful replies!
OK, so load some TM drivers, no TARGET, load the BMS Basic DX TM Warthog.key file through the BMS ‘Advanced’ screen, assign axes ditto, and make the Devicesorting.txt file read-only (thanks for that tip SemlerPDX, I was planning to swap out the Warthog with my Honeycomb Alpha and Bravo so very relevant).
Regarding Ant Elev, thanks for the hint about using the china hat. I notice there’s a ‘Slider 0 Axis’ - a grey thing with a moulded-on lever on rhs of the throttle, depicted as such on page 6 of the manual, but (probably) mis-labelled as ‘throttle friction control’ on page 9 which is surely the other grey thing labelled ‘FRICTION DECR/INCR’ at the front end. Can I ask what you use the Slider 0 Axis for?
Alan
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I use the grey slider axis for landing gear up/down.
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Same.
In the real A-10 that lever controls the friction for the throttle handles. In Warthog it’s a generic axis and lever friction is elsewhere in a fictional wheel. Naturally an axis can’t control landing gear without something like target.
DeviceSorting.txt simply determines which device gets which chunk of 32 button numbers (1-33, 33-64, etc). It’s the world’s simplest list and changing order is just reordering the list. If your device buttons are ever wrong by a multiple of 32 that’s why.
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Steve U, Frederf, thank you! I’ve been a bit spoilt with my Honeycomb Bravo throttle quadrant flying in FSX - a big handle and three green lights when gear is up. I think I’ll postpone having anything to do with TARGET while I get on with re-learning how to fly an F-16. I seem to recall spending more time in the olden days programming the TQS with ‘Foxy’ than actually flying…
Alan -
I’m using the grey slider on the warthog TQS for tgp zoom, works quite nicely.
All the best,
Uwe
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I’m using the grey slider on the warthog TQS for tgp zoom, works quite nicely.
All the best,
UweThat’s what I do also. BigFish, you may think Alternative Launcher adds complexity but in reality is has the opposite effect, plus it gives you shortcuts in one place for many of the important BMS add-on apps. You will need to set up each switch\button\hat BUT that also means you can do what makes sense for you rather than someone else, and it really could not be easier to do. It also gives you a very simple way (RELEASE function) to make ALL your Warthog switches have every position seen (so does BMS internally but its a bit more tedious). As has been said, you don’t need to load any “drivers”, and I only use the the TARGET GUI program to dim the LEDs on the throttle. The TARGET Script Editor is quite powerful on it’s own but also requires more time to learn than I have to bother with so I use\modify other people’s work. I do not use (or need) it in BMS, but for other sims (IL2\DCS) that can see DX33-128 a profile I have gives me a one-click solution for TARGET to load a profile that DOES give EVERY switch\hat position a DX# so for the other sims it is fantastic… Click it off, BMS/AL are back to normal… What Stick are you using, original cougar or did you buy the Warthog HOTAS set?
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Hello Icer and thanks for the encouragement re Alternative Launcher. I’ll certainly look into it. I thought I’d get up and running with the BMS basic Warthog file before I start fiddling about, but I take your point about always wanting something a bit different.
Well I have just bought both the Warthog Stick and Throttle. My Cougar radar slew controls packed up a couple of years ago and I just missed the last of Reddog’s replacement pots, and I never got an alternative organised. In any case I now realise as soon as I waggled the Warthog stick that the feel is infinitely better than my Cougar with U2nxt hall sensor conversion, which is horribly floppy and imprecise. The Warthog’s got too much deflection for an F-16 stick of course - well, it deflects, which is too much! - but I expect something can be done with calibration. I don’t think I want to get into a force-sensor base just yet. I see by the way in another thread there’s already an after-market replacement for the Warthog’s radar cursor hat!
Hoover, thanks for the tip regarding use of the throttle slider control.
Alan -
Hello Icer and thanks for the encouragement re Alternative Launcher. I’ll certainly look into it. I thought I’d get up and running with the BMS basic Warthog file before I start fiddling about, but I take your point about always wanting something a bit different.
Well I have just bought both the Warthog Stick and Throttle. My Cougar radar slew controls packed up a couple of years ago and I just missed the last of Reddog’s replacement pots, and I never got an alternative organised. In any case I now realise as soon as I waggled the Warthog stick that the feel is infinitely better than my Cougar with U2nxt hall sensor conversion, which is horribly floppy and imprecise. The Warthog’s got too much deflection for an F-16 stick of course - well, it deflects, which is too much! - but I expect something can be done with calibration. I don’t think I want to get into a force-sensor base just yet. I see by the way in another thread there’s already an after-market replacement for the Warthog’s radar cursor hat!
Hoover, thanks for the tip regarding use of the throttle slider control.
AlanHappy to help make the curve a little smaller! I have the Deltasims cursor hat mod, hated the OEM setup from Day 1, actually was using one of my hats to control it until I got it replaced. I tried a buddy’s force sensing base, did not really like it and as I fly WWII planes also it just made no sense. I did not like the feel of the stock Warthog stick base either. Mine wasn’t really sticky/notchy but it just did not feel good and was quite a workout after flying for a couple hours. Rather than invest in a lighter spring I went for the VirPil stick base (Warthog F16 stick attaches directly) and the build quality and feel are exponentially better than TM OEM… You simply set it up with the TM PID\VID identifiers and your Win10 system (and TARGET software) sees it as a stock Warthog. I should warn you, IF you go to Alt Launcher it replaces\backs up (and requires) the BMS-Full.key file so if you are using something different you will lose your programming. Of course if you simply write down the keystrokes you use for each switch\hat\button it will take you about 5 minutes max to re-set it up in AL. I have the same as you PLUS 56 MFD buttons\rockers and 32 ICP buttons and I can do my whole setup in 10 minutes!
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Icer, thanks for that advice and at this rate I’ll be modding the Warthog before I’ve even plugged it in! I’ll check out the Deltasims cursor hat replacement and the VirPil base.
Apart from this thread being so helpful to me personally, I like to think it’s another small part of the many resources which are available through this fantastically helpful forum with so many helpful contributors - such a contrast with some of the forums for other flight simulators!
Alan -
Icer, thanks for that advice and at this rate I’ll be modding the Warthog before I’ve even plugged it in! I’ll check out the Deltasims cursor hat replacement and the VirPil base.
Apart from this thread being so helpful to me personally, I like to think it’s another small part of the many resources which are available through this fantastically helpful forum with so many helpful contributors - such a contrast with some of the forums for other flight simulators!
AlanLet me know if you need any help, happy to connect for a multiplayer “familiarization” session, you are only 1 hour off my time zone.
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Hi Icer, fantastic! Well I’ve just ordered the radar slew ‘upgrade’ from DeltaSim having watched a really good video by some Australian chap on how to instal it, looks pretty foolproof! The general build quality of the Warthog throttle is massively better than my Cougar throttle, and I’m really surprised they put in such a dumb piece of equipment for the radar slew control. But there we are. Good luck to the DeltaSim guy who clearly knows what he is doing and has made a nice little business from the opportunity.
I’ve reviewed the Virpil mods, I assume I need the VPC WarBRD Base? It looks like an impressive piece of engineering.
Alan
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Hi Icer, fantastic! Well I’ve just ordered the radar slew ‘upgrade’ from DeltaSim having watched a really good video by some Australian chap on how to instal it, looks pretty foolproof! The general build quality of the Warthog throttle is massively better than my Cougar throttle, and I’m really surprised they put in such a dumb piece of equipment for the radar slew control. But there we are. Good luck to the DeltaSim guy who clearly knows what he is doing and has made a nice little business from the opportunity.
I’ve reviewed the Virpil mods, I assume I need the VPC WarBRD Base? It looks like an impressive piece of engineering.
Alan“Need” no, but I can only say if you have the £££ budgeted it is a fantastic upgrade to the plastic ball-and-socket of the OEM stick. It comes with a set of stronger springs should you find the initially installed ones don’t give you the resistance you like (left mine as it came, love it). Changeing the VID\PID identifiers (easy, takes less than a minute) to match the OEM stick makes Win10 and TARGET see it as a TM HOTAS stick so everything stays as it was.
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Yes, quite, that will be “need” as in “investment”.
Many years ago I replaced the Cougar stick innards with a U2NXT conversion (I think that was from Australia). Here we go again then. When I get to the point, will you advise me on how to give it a Warthog ID?
Best wishes
Alan -
Yes, quite, that will be “need” as in “investment”.
Many years ago I replaced the Cougar stick innards with a U2NXT conversion (I think that was from Australia). Here we go again then. When I get to the point, will you advise me on how to give it a Warthog ID?
Best wishes
AlanAbsolutely, here is the explanation I used IIRC…
Looking at that post I checked my “VPC Configuration Tool” and it has been updated since that reddit post so looks a little different. Below are the 3 things (circled) that you need to set correctly in Virpil, and the TARGET GUI screen after you are done… the process is the same (just set it as the FA\18 stick, there is no selection for F-16 for some reason, no matter)…
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Icer, outstanding, thanks so much. I’ll let you know how I get on.
Alan -
Just checking in, how goes the battle Alan?