Question about the Block 52 force sensing stick which moves quite a bit
-
Thanks for the video. Wow that 1/8" movement made all the difference for the pilots complaining about the fixed stick. Unbelievable ; )
-
@TwanV:
nope, much less than that. Just found a nice video on facebook actually via vipergear. https://www.facebook.com/team.fighterjetsworld/?tn-str=k*F see video from October 25th. movement at the top of the SCC should be little less than 1/8" in all directions, so I think the FSSB movement of 3mm is OK for the 6lb force level. I seem to remember though that actual forces in the real jet are somewhat higher.
EDIT: O yes, much more http://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=212&sid=8a7f46ab2d799dcf068939a77b6a63d6&start=30 31 lbs for 9 gās!!
EDIT: anyway, that is way to much force to use your force controlled stick responsibly. :lol: Enjoy, if its as good as the FCC itās a world of difference (for the better)
Here is the video YT
-
@TwanV:
In the FCC3 we have spacers that allow you to set-up some movement, does it feature anything like that?
Twan
Interesting. I didnāt realize that there is another force sensing mod besides the FSSB mod available for the Warthog. How much does it cost?
See how the stick moves to the left in that video? Looked also very close to the amount the real stick moved in the video aboveNo. I think there is no way to customize the displacement of the FSSB
-
The FCC3 is no longer available, as itās inventor/supplier passed away last yearā¦if you want one, youāll have to find someone that wants to part with one. I had planned to get a second oneā¦but alasā¦it is a nice mod - Cougar only, but Warthog grip compatible, or for mounting on a replica SSC base - and relies on small washers to allow the 1/8" movement. Very nice deviceā¦but you still need to stabilize the grip itself against the retaining nut - the problem of the grip rocking due to wear against the stalk can spoil a force controller worse than with gimbals, IMO.
Once upon a time there was a thread over on ViperPits on scratch building/machining a 1:1 operating replica of the real SCC - complete set of drawings, which I think has been removed. All I can offer from seeing the drawings is that Hall devices/pots/etc. appeared to have nothing to do with itās operationā¦itās its own beastie.
-
Sad to hear he passed away.
When I compare how the real stick kinda āclicksā into position when pushed looks a lot more like the FCC3. The FSSB just bends but does not do āarticulatedā movements, hope you understand what I mean. My feeling is from watching the videos that the FCC3 is more realistic.
But what youāre saying is that although its built for the Cougar you could easily mount the Warthog on it as well?
-
You can mount a Warthog grip on an FCC3, but you lose itās CMS->dwn button actionā¦which is a shame, because I use that as my shift key seeing as it has no actual function in the F-16. But - even though you can mount the grip I donāt believe you can mount the FCC3 to a Warthog base without making an adapter plate for itā¦the adapter plate that comes (came) with it is made to mount to the Cougar base; on itās own it will mount to an SSC replica.
The FCC3 doesnāt do articulated movement either. The rubber grommets that mount between it and itās base fixture provide a progressive resistance into the 1/8" deflection. By adjusting the mounting screw pressure on the grommets - and/or replacing the grommets themselves - you can also affect/adjust both the amount of deflection and the progressive resistance.
It really is a slick little device/modā¦Arend was genius on this one (he developed a LOT more than just the FCC3), IMO. I never actually met him, but I still mourn his loss. He was a true asset to the community of cockpit builders.
-
This guy manipulating like mad a piece of history in a museum makes me sick
Yeah they really need to stop letting meth users sit in those cockpits. lol I think I would have punched him if I was next in line.
-
Isnāt that a bit of a pilot thing though? As far as I know the F16-pilot is a pitbuilders worst nightmare, with stories that go like:
Hobbyist prepares perfect replica of F-16 pit -> Meets an impressed pilot, let him have a go -> perfect replica pit completely ruined by military treatment of non-military grade hardware
dos gringos comes to mind. Anyway my point, that hardware should be able to withstand some abuse from kids.
-
@TwanV:
Isnāt that a bit of a pilot thing though? As far as I know the F16-pilot is a pitbuilders worst nightmare, with stories that go like:
Hobbyist prepares perfect replica of F-16 pit -> Meets an impressed pilot, let him have a go -> perfect replica pit completely ruined by military treatment of non-military grade hardware
dos gringos comes to mind. Anyway my point, that hardware should be able to withstand some abuse from kids.
Its not that it is ruff on the parts. I am building my pit to last and with all the real panels and hardware Iām not too worried about a broken switch. Its more of its a museum piece and this guy is tugging on stuff like he does at night with his porno mags. Its like take it easy Tiger.
-
Haha ok you have a point, he does seem to get a bit inappropriately switched on by all that hardware.
-
OTOHā¦if he is a real pilot heās been trained to do that. His expectations are that it is the same as what he flies, and he has little or no regard for the equipment beyond itās ability to get him home safe and/or kill an opponent no matter how much he may āloveā his airplane. Thatās the biggest diff in attitude between most of us and a real fighter pilot, IMO.
I get to work with RL trainers on occasion and one of the more interesting things to do is to accompany an aircrew (especially a combat experienced one) to a trainer sessionā¦and watch the transition from co-worker to warrior - talk about āgame faceāā¦good grief. Even just talking to Viet Nam era air combat vets, you can that it donāt wash off. Ever. So yeah - Iām also building my pit with as many metal parts as I can as far as my controllers are concernedā¦because Iām already getting requests to try it from RL pilots, and it aināt even half-built yet. Run away!..
-
OTOHā¦if he is a real pilot heās been trained to do that. His expectations are that it is the same as what he flies, and he has little or no regard for the equipment beyond itās ability to get him home safe and/or kill an opponent no matter how much he may āloveā his airplane. Thatās the biggest diff in attitude between most of us and a real fighter pilot, IMO.
I get to work with RL trainers on occasion and one of the more interesting things to do is to accompany an aircrew (especially a combat experienced one) to a trainer sessionā¦and watch the transition from co-worker to warrior - talk about āgame faceāā¦good grief. Even just talking to Viet Nam era air combat vets, you can that it donāt wash off. Ever. So yeah - Iām also building my pit with as many metal parts as I can as far as my controllers are concernedā¦because Iām already getting requests to try it from RL pilots, and it aināt even half-built yet. Run away!..
Being ex special forces and now a police officer, I have been trained to do a lot of things with guns, compared to what I do during training. My environment will dictate how I operate with a gun. I would suspect pilots are the same. Besides, he was flicking switches that I donāt think are manipulated in his line up cards. lol
-
Being ex special forces and now a police officer, I have been trained to do a lot of things with guns, compared to what I do during training. My environment will dictate how I operate with a gun. I would suspect pilots are the same. Besides, he was flicking switches that I donāt think are manipulated in his line up cards. lol
When youāre able to get yourself Court Martialed for shooting expert on a Marine Corps Rifle Range , then have your 9 inch 500 yard target spotter mounted on the Base Commanders wall with a 5 round group you could cover with a 50 cent piece and clearly see where one bullet almost went straight through a hole before it with a M-16 one shot at a time with iron sights, then come see me, I was then asked to be a instructor I turned it down I wasnāt about to train people to be as good as me, June 1984 Court House Bay Marine Corps Rifle Range NC, , hopefully you are better trained when not to use deadly force.
-
Being ex special forces and now a police officer, I have been trained to do a lot of things with guns, compared to what I do during training. My environment will dictate how I operate with a gun. I would suspect pilots are the same. Besides, he was flicking switches that I donāt think are manipulated in his line up cards. lol
In my experience pilots tend to do a lot of things in the cockpit that isnāt exactly āon scriptāā¦FOREX - there is a lexicon among crew that youāre supposed to āonly touch the shiny switchesā. I did a mod once to an jet that had a switch in it that wasnāt connected to anything before I did the modā¦and that switch was shiny (meaning it had been polished by leather gloved hands) even though it did nothing - nothing at all - before I modded the jet. And that mode was a FLeet system incorporation, so that switch did nothing across the entire Fleet until this installation and there wasnāt any ātrainingā even to be associated previously.
Weāve had similar discussions over on VP about the white button on the gear lever and how pilots playing with it tends to wear out the solenoid in the gear box. Soā¦in the cockpit, stuff happensā¦
-
When youāre able to get yourself Court Martialed for shooting expert on a Marine Corps Rifle Range , then have your 9 inch 500 yard target spotter mounted on the Base Commanders wall with a 5 round group you could cover with a 50 cent piece and clearly see where one bullet almost went straight through a hole before it with a M-16 one shot at a time with iron sights, then come see me, I was then asked to be a instructor I turned it down I wasnāt about to train people to be as good as me, June 1984 Court House Bay Marine Corps Rifle Range NC, , hopefully you are better trained when not to use deadly force.
ā¦Iād take lessons from ya. If youāre ever out in the high Mojave, look me up.
-
ā¦Iād take lessons from ya. If youāre ever out in the high Mojave, look me up.
Itās all in your breathing, you have 2 sight pictures the first 0ne is with your lungs full of air, and the Second is when you fully exhale, you adjust your aim after you exhale, if time permits you can take a breath but of course your sight picture will have changed not to worry when you exhale the sights will fall on to the target , and just squeeze like you are getting that last drop of water from a sponge and the shot is suppose to surprise you so you donāt flinch , my last best shot was on a coyote 375 yards out with a cheap 270 Mossberg that I didnāt know whether it was sighted for that range , the round went where the crosshairs laid. Some say to shoot between heart beats , youāll feel your heart beat after a few moments after you exhale, give it a try. {that will be 500 dollars} LOL.
-
In my experience pilots tend to do a lot of things in the cockpit that isnāt exactly āon scriptāā¦FOREX - there is a lexicon among crew that youāre supposed to āonly touch the shiny switchesā. I did a mod once to an jet that had a switch in it that wasnāt connected to anything before I did the modā¦and that switch was shiny (meaning it had been polished by leather gloved hands) even though it did nothing - nothing at all - before I modded the jet. And that mode was a FLeet system incorporation, so that switch did nothing across the entire Fleet until this installation and there wasnāt any ātrainingā even to be associated previously.
Weāve had similar discussions over on VP about the white button on the gear lever and how pilots playing with it tends to wear out the solenoid in the gear box. Soā¦in the cockpit, stuff happensā¦
Ha ha ha so true. This conversation is getting stupid. lol Let it be known that I donāt think you need to jump in a museum artifact and start torquing on everything. Agree to disagree.
-
Ha ha ha so true. This conversation is getting stupid. lol Let it be known that I donāt think you need to jump in a museum artifact and start torquing on everything. Agree to disagree.
how about this,
-
Ha ha ha so true. This conversation is getting stupid. lol Let it be known that I donāt think you need to jump in a museum artifact and start torquing on everything. Agree to disagree.
ā¦just to pile on the stupid wagonā¦this is a real, airworthy P-40, owned by Rudy Frasca of Urbana, Illinois.
http://www.frasca.com/frasca-history/
I happened to be attending the University there when the parts of this scene with Belushi in the cockpit were shot, on deck in Frascaās hangar at his airfieldā¦lots of reports of Frasca standing there in agony as Belushi was smashing bottles all over his aircraft and in the cockpit (over several takes, likely). But I suppose he got paid - well - for that! And the airplane went on to continue flying.
Not really agreeing or disagreeingā¦just pointing out the diversity in the spectrumā¦
-
people are so dumb, the YT crowd at the viper demo and the museum plebs. makes me nauseous.