Question about the Block 52 force sensing stick which moves quite a bit
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Being ex special forces and now a police officer, I have been trained to do a lot of things with guns, compared to what I do during training. My environment will dictate how I operate with a gun. I would suspect pilots are the same. Besides, he was flicking switches that I don’t think are manipulated in his line up cards. lol
When you’re able to get yourself Court Martialed for shooting expert on a Marine Corps Rifle Range , then have your 9 inch 500 yard target spotter mounted on the Base Commanders wall with a 5 round group you could cover with a 50 cent piece and clearly see where one bullet almost went straight through a hole before it with a M-16 one shot at a time with iron sights, then come see me, I was then asked to be a instructor I turned it down I wasn’t about to train people to be as good as me, June 1984 Court House Bay Marine Corps Rifle Range NC, , hopefully you are better trained when not to use deadly force.
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Being ex special forces and now a police officer, I have been trained to do a lot of things with guns, compared to what I do during training. My environment will dictate how I operate with a gun. I would suspect pilots are the same. Besides, he was flicking switches that I don’t think are manipulated in his line up cards. lol
In my experience pilots tend to do a lot of things in the cockpit that isn’t exactly “on script”…FOREX - there is a lexicon among crew that you’re supposed to “only touch the shiny switches”. I did a mod once to an jet that had a switch in it that wasn’t connected to anything before I did the mod…and that switch was shiny (meaning it had been polished by leather gloved hands) even though it did nothing - nothing at all - before I modded the jet. And that mode was a FLeet system incorporation, so that switch did nothing across the entire Fleet until this installation and there wasn’t any “training” even to be associated previously.
We’ve had similar discussions over on VP about the white button on the gear lever and how pilots playing with it tends to wear out the solenoid in the gear box. So…in the cockpit, stuff happens…
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When you’re able to get yourself Court Martialed for shooting expert on a Marine Corps Rifle Range , then have your 9 inch 500 yard target spotter mounted on the Base Commanders wall with a 5 round group you could cover with a 50 cent piece and clearly see where one bullet almost went straight through a hole before it with a M-16 one shot at a time with iron sights, then come see me, I was then asked to be a instructor I turned it down I wasn’t about to train people to be as good as me, June 1984 Court House Bay Marine Corps Rifle Range NC, , hopefully you are better trained when not to use deadly force.
…I’d take lessons from ya. If you’re ever out in the high Mojave, look me up.
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…I’d take lessons from ya. If you’re ever out in the high Mojave, look me up.
It’s all in your breathing, you have 2 sight pictures the first 0ne is with your lungs full of air, and the Second is when you fully exhale, you adjust your aim after you exhale, if time permits you can take a breath but of course your sight picture will have changed not to worry when you exhale the sights will fall on to the target , and just squeeze like you are getting that last drop of water from a sponge and the shot is suppose to surprise you so you don’t flinch , my last best shot was on a coyote 375 yards out with a cheap 270 Mossberg that I didn’t know whether it was sighted for that range , the round went where the crosshairs laid. Some say to shoot between heart beats , you’ll feel your heart beat after a few moments after you exhale, give it a try. {that will be 500 dollars} LOL.
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In my experience pilots tend to do a lot of things in the cockpit that isn’t exactly “on script”…FOREX - there is a lexicon among crew that you’re supposed to “only touch the shiny switches”. I did a mod once to an jet that had a switch in it that wasn’t connected to anything before I did the mod…and that switch was shiny (meaning it had been polished by leather gloved hands) even though it did nothing - nothing at all - before I modded the jet. And that mode was a FLeet system incorporation, so that switch did nothing across the entire Fleet until this installation and there wasn’t any “training” even to be associated previously.
We’ve had similar discussions over on VP about the white button on the gear lever and how pilots playing with it tends to wear out the solenoid in the gear box. So…in the cockpit, stuff happens…
Ha ha ha so true. This conversation is getting stupid. lol Let it be known that I don’t think you need to jump in a museum artifact and start torquing on everything. Agree to disagree.
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Ha ha ha so true. This conversation is getting stupid. lol Let it be known that I don’t think you need to jump in a museum artifact and start torquing on everything. Agree to disagree.
how about this,
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Ha ha ha so true. This conversation is getting stupid. lol Let it be known that I don’t think you need to jump in a museum artifact and start torquing on everything. Agree to disagree.
…just to pile on the stupid wagon…this is a real, airworthy P-40, owned by Rudy Frasca of Urbana, Illinois.
http://www.frasca.com/frasca-history/
I happened to be attending the University there when the parts of this scene with Belushi in the cockpit were shot, on deck in Frasca’s hangar at his airfield…lots of reports of Frasca standing there in agony as Belushi was smashing bottles all over his aircraft and in the cockpit (over several takes, likely). But I suppose he got paid - well - for that! And the airplane went on to continue flying.
Not really agreeing or disagreeing…just pointing out the diversity in the spectrum…
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people are so dumb, the YT crowd at the viper demo and the museum plebs. makes me nauseous.
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…just to pile on the stupid wagon…this is a real, airworthy P-40, owned by Rudy Frasca of Urbana, Illinois.
http://www.frasca.com/frasca-history/
I happened to be attending the University there when the parts of this scene with Belushi in the cockpit were shot, on deck in Frasca’s hangar at his airfield…lots of reports of Frasca standing there in agony as Belushi was smashing bottles all over his aircraft and in the cockpit (over several takes, likely). But I suppose he got paid - well - for that! And the airplane went on to continue flying.
Not really agreeing or disagreeing…just pointing out the diversity in the spectrum…
Ha ha ha that’s funny… But like you said I’m sure they got paid well and it was worth it. I have a friend that has a lot of surplus military equipment and he rents them out to movies all the time and gets paid quiet well. I specifically remember a $5000 bonus just to put one of the Humvee’s upside down.
That’s a different though when you have a contract with someone that spells out what is going to be done with someone’s equipment and with them close by monitoring. This is more out of respect for museum equipment or the fact when you are guest and invited with an opportunity to sit in a jet. There are quite a few videos out there were guys are in cockpits and just cranking on the stuff. lol
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Agreed. When I was in high school there was a guy out at our local airport that owned a P-38 Lightning…he use to hire high schoolers to come out and keep it polished over the summer, and I became a P-38 groupie - that was my first encounter with a real warbird (after which there were to be many more, but I was young and didn’t know that then, still…). Got to know his chief mechanic pretty well - talk about an IMMACULATE airplane…full complement of guns onboard, too.
One afternoon the chief allowed me to climb up the ladder and into the cockpit…of a real, flyable, P-38 Lightning. I treated it like I was walking into church. Just thinking now of the feelings I got sitting there, yoke and throttles in hand…I still get the tingles just recalling it.
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Agreed. When I was in high school there was a guy out at our local airport that owned a P-38 Lightning…he use to hire high schoolers to come out and keep it polished over the summer, and I became a P-38 groupie - that was my first encounter with a real warbird (after which there were to be many more, but I was young and didn’t know that then, still…). Got to know his chief mechanic pretty well - talk about an IMMACULATE airplane…full complement of guns onboard, too.
One afternoon the chief allowed me to climb up the ladder and into the cockpit…of a real, flyable, P-38 Lightning. I treated it like I was walking into church. Just thinking now of the feelings I got sitting there, yoke and throttles in hand…I still get the tingles just recalling it.
That’s cool, I got one like that or so, I at one time I had family so far up in the Air Force, at the SAC Base where he was at ,I got a first class tour of that Base, Museum and Hangars and in one of those hangars was Looking Glass it was one of the 707s jobs was able to board walk the full length and sit in the pilot’s seat what a hell of a 16th Birthday present, and what I do, join the Marine Corps a few years later.
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If I go all the way back to the beginning, when I was a small kid, my grandfather took me to the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry to see a mock-up of a Gemini space capsule that was on tour/display there. He then stood in line with me until I got to take a seat (the left one, if I recall) in the capsule beside a dummy astronaut!
Much later on, I’m pretty sure I re-encountered that very same Gemini in the McDonnell Douglas Prologue room, during a plant tour there…
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If I go all the way back to the beginning, when I was a small kid, my grandfather took me to the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry to see a mock-up of a Gemini space capsule that was on tour/display there. He then stood in line with me until I got to take a seat (the left one, if I recall) in the capsule beside a dummy astronaut!
Much later on, I’m pretty sure I re-encountered that very same Gemini in the McDonnell Douglas Prologue room, during a plant tour there…
Coool, This last veterans day,https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=youtube+tico+warbird+museum&&view=detail∣=4451FB76BDE8DEC603034451FB76BDE8DEC60303&&FORM=VDRVRV and 5 miles south of the Space Center you should come visit.
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Nice collection - really nice Phantom!
The last T-2 Buckeye I saw that made an impression on me was a mishap at NAS Kingsville, TX. I was standing on the ramp watching the training jets bounce, and I looked to the approach end of the runway just in time to see the student eject, and the jet nose into the dirt…big 60 foot fireball, just short of the runway end. The student survived…but I think his career as a Naval Aviator ended. Only one of those I’ve actually witnessed…knock-knock…
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Well that thread seemed to escalate quickly But let me come back to the initial question. Using the FSSB mod for quite a while now, and comparing it with the footage of the real F16 stick, can someone comfirm what I think I see as the biggest difference between the FSSB and the real thing. It seems like in the real stick you can feel when you have reached the limit of how much Gs you can request from the flight computer. Thats the point when the stick does not move any more, which would resemble to a tradition stick (using gimbals) reaching its limit. Is that the case? Or can you just pull the stick to the maximum physical possible displacement but still pull even more, even though its not moving any more and get even more Gs requested? In the FSSB mod there is no point when you can feel the displacement reached the limit but the input it gives is already is being cut off.
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I don’t think you can feel it in the stick, but you can feel it on your body…the stick limits out t 25 lbf of pull, if I recall, and anything greater than that is flatlined. So when you reach the endpoint of all the G you can feel, that’s all you get.
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Well that thread seemed to escalate quickly But let me come back to the initial question. Using the FSSB mod for quite a while now, and comparing it with the footage of the real F16 stick, can someone comfirm what I think I see as the biggest difference between the FSSB and the real thing. It seems like in the real stick you can feel when you have reached the limit of how much Gs you can request from the flight computer. Thats the point when the stick does not move any more, which would resemble to a tradition stick (using gimbals) reaching its limit. Is that the case? Or can you just pull the stick to the maximum physical possible displacement but still pull even more, even though its not moving any more and get even more Gs requested? In the FSSB mod there is no point when you can feel the displacement reached the limit but the input it gives is already is being cut off.
I’m not sure you’ll be satisfied with it, but there’s a very useful feature on the latest software from Real Simulator.
The continuous beep sound tells you that you’ve reached to the limit of axis input. (or at any level of input, the value of lbs is configurable)
The manual tells that there’s a similar function in RL Gripen simulator.
I think that is a good supplement function for 1G fixed simulator environment.
Cons? It’s bit noisy actually :lol: -
Yes PeCa_Chuck. I use that beeping feature for quite some time now. Its really helpful to get used to where the limits of the input is. What I also use is the
NASA Feature to use assymetrical forces. More for pulling than for pushing, more forces to roll left, less to roll right, with the values described in the manual. I would really love to see a video of an F16 Stick being pulled and what it actually outputs to the flight computer. -
The FCC3 is no longer available, as it’s inventor/supplier passed away last year…if you want one, you’ll have to find someone that wants to part with one. I had planned to get a second one…but alas…it is a nice mod - Cougar only, but Warthog grip compatible, or for mounting on a replica SSC base - and relies on small washers to allow the 1/8" movement. Very nice device…but you still need to stabilize the grip itself against the retaining nut - the problem of the grip rocking due to wear against the stalk can spoil a force controller worse than with gimbals, IMO.
Once upon a time there was a thread over on ViperPits on scratch building/machining a 1:1 operating replica of the real SCC - complete set of drawings, which I think has been removed. All I can offer from seeing the drawings is that Hall devices/pots/etc. appeared to have nothing to do with it’s operation…it’s its own beastie.
OMG…So sorry to hear that!The FCC3 has became a history now,no any other choice except FSSB …
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A new and affordable force sensor is comming guys. Vipergear is building one that is in release candidate state at this time