Europe Theater Discussion
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From an old PMC post.
Soviet Air Force in Hungary 1987-1989
Kunmadaras, loc.: '47 ''23 N '20 ''47 E
1 squadron Su-24MR, 13 AC (recon)
1 regiment Su-17M4, ~ 20-22 ACDebrecen, loc.: '47 ''29 N '21 ''36 E
1 squadron (regiment?) Su-24 until 1988, replaced with MiG-27Tököl, loc.: '47 ''20 N '18 ''58 E
1 regiment MiG-29, ~ 20 AC
Regiment relocated in 1989 to Sármellék,Sármellék, loc.: '46 ''41 N '17 ''09 E
1 regiment MiG-23M from 1982 to 1988Kiskunlacháza, loc.: '47 ''10 N '19 ''04 E
1 regiment MIG-29, ~ 20 ACKalocsa, loc.: '46 ''33 N '18 ''56 E
1 transport helicopter regiment with Mi-17 / Mi-6Hungarian Air Force
Taszár, loc.: '46 ''23 N '17 ''55 E
2 (3?) sqadron MiG-21bis
1 squadron Su-22 (export variant of Su-17)Pápa, loc.: '47 ''21 N '17 ''30 E
1 squadron MiG-23MF
1 squadron MiG-21bisKecskemét, loc.: '46 ''55 N '19 ''45 E
2 (3?) squadron MiG-21MFSzentkirályszabadja, loc.: '47 ''04 N '17 ''58 E
1 mixed helo regiment with Mi-8/17 and Mi-24
1 air tranport squadron, 6 An-24/26Szolnok, loc 47° 7’21.34"N 20°13’53.73" E
helos and An-24Rest of airbases are not important except Ferihegy 1/2 which is civilan airport. (Budapest) Was some at least reserve airbase with no permanent unit and crew (for ex. Mezőkövesd), and were helos on non airbase objectives. Today is only Kecskemét and Pápa is active and Szolnok.
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I just finished recording the making of the 3d model of the Taszár Air Base in Hungary.
Recorded from zero to the point where I opened the LOD file to Lod Editor.
Right now I mix the 2 vids and will upload it asap. Also I will upload the files for the airbase.
Took me less then an hour to sketch the whole airport.
Now UV maping is also easy. Texturing it is the only pain.
// My squad mates will kill me for spending time to another theater… :lol:
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In the PMC theater the Netherlands were partly ‘sea’ because for that part the actual altitude is below sea level. Do we already have dykes in the current version?
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I just finished recording the making of the 3d model of the Taszár Air Base in Hungary.
Where did you get the data? Taszár is today is different from Cold War era becuse US forces used in the '90s. This era porblem is concerning the whole theater. Which era’s airbases will / should be modeled?
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In the PMC theater the Netherlands were partly ‘sea’ because for that part the actual altitude is below sea level. Do we already have dykes in the current version?
I did some experiments with terrain creation and negative elevations,
but have not tested insim yet.Cheers,
LS -
Which era’s airbases will / should be modeled?
timeframe is around 1987 for a cold war scenario.
Cheers,
LS -
Lazy and general Europe theater guys… yeap make it even harder…
well I used today’s pictures from Google Earth.
If u will ever be able to find actual data of all airports - buildings schematics pictures and etc from 1987 for the whole Europe… well… good luck with that…
Here is the video I made:
No audio, tune to your favorite radio station or play your music… for the 2 hours of boredom silence… :lol:
At some points I use notepad and text explaining what I’m doing or the process…
The whole video is in actual time… at some points I paused the recording while opening downloading etc that took time… but the whole process is recorded and displayed in actual time.
At some point where I start to split the runway I fubared. I tried to make it in Corel first (to show an alternative to 3ds cut polygon by edges) but needs another approach and at the time I was tired late at night, I got bored to actually do it… but it works as I created the model in Corel… and in Corel with the dimensions tool u can split the polygon to exactly where u want (meaning pixel exactly)… this is superb for texturing afterwards and u don’t rely on 3ds crap tools to do so.
Also as u can see the curves are just smooth as butter…
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I can try ask different Hungarian comunities to share some pictures about Cold War, but likely only a very few is available because in that time for just make one picture about military objectives was not a wise thing…
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Sadly, (for the real world) a modern conflict has become much more probable over the last 6 month.
Just to say that another Campaign with modern equipment would also fit very well on a europe theater.
hmm. 1987 - would that be Block 40 already? Block 30? Or F-16A?
Also somehow this theater would be a great reminder to the old Spektrum Holobyte Falcon - I don’t know why, though - it’s just a feeling
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Molny as I see it Google earth goes back to 2001. No previous photos.
Airport maps from that era with details I don’t know how easily they can be found if exist… but this alone will take years to gather the data.So I would suggest build with what in hand and if info will be found then adjust.
Keeping the team small with min resources well this will never end…
All ppl here knowing will contribute and data will be gathered soon…
For me I would build it with today imagery and adjust the database (weapons vehicles etc) to that era…
This gives u the opportunity to build a today campaign and an 80’s era campaign.
As I build now Araxos for IKAROS the imagery from 2001 to today is changed a lot. buildings gone, buildings added, taxiways altered, parking area changed whatever u name it… So restricting the theater to 80’s only… I don’t know… I don’t think I would fly it… maybe to explore it… but actually fly it I don’t think so…
U mean u will have only F-16 A and B’s???
hmmmm -
Molny as I see it Google earth goes back to 2001. No previous photos.
Airport maps from that era with details I don’t know how easily they can be found if exist… but this alone will take years to gather the data.So I would suggest build with what in hand and if info will be found then adjust.
Keeping the team small with min resources well this will never end…
All ppl here knowing will contribute and data will be gathered soon…
For me I would build it with today imagery and adjust the database (weapons vehicles etc) to that era…
This gives u the opportunity to build a today campaign and an 80’s era campaign.
As I build now Araxos for IKAROS the imagery from 2001 to today is changed a lot. buildings gone, buildings added, taxiways altered, parking area changed whatever u name it… So restricting the theater to 80’s only… I don’t know… I don’t think I would fly it… maybe to explore it… but actually fly it I don’t think so…
U mean u will have only F-16 A and B’s???
hmmmmLikely I can provide pictures about fences, hangars, tower and HAS. These are the main objects on airbases.
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For me I would build it with today imagery and adjust the database (weapons vehicles etc) to that era…
This gives u the opportunity to build a today campaign and an 80’s era campaign.
I agree. Aircraft are bound to F-16 block50/52 avionics anyway.
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Block 25 and 30/32 avionics is very close to Blk. 52 on Falcon level just set lower MFD res, disable the MFD colors, do not use HMCS and because lack of LGBs you do not have TGP and do not use data link or not all features. Of course the GPS coordinates regardless of drifting INS cannot be solved.
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Molny start sending material to EU guys… what r u waiting for?
Also now that u ended with your theater… watch my video and start building Hungary Airbases.
So Hungary is on Molny…
Next please…
Please don’t push get in line u all will be satisfied and get your piece…
Next.
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Block 25 and 30/32 avionics is very close to Blk. 52 on Falcon level just set lower MFD res, disable the MFD colors, do not use HMCS and because lack of LGBs you do not have TGP and do not use data link or not all features. Of course the GPS coordinates regardless of drifting INS cannot be solved.
You’re right, I had the A/B version in mind, but the upgraded cockpit with MFD’s entered service as early as 1984. Well within the '80’s.
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@molni
Thanks for your effort, though Hungary is one of the very last priorities atm.@arty this is W-Germany: http://www.mil-airfields.de/deutschland/images/bundeswehr-luftwaffe-198x.gif (only the ones used by GAF - German Navy and Army, USAFE, RAF & CAF not included)
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ok let’s say I want to build something… where do I get info - reference from 80’s to build it? and then offer it 2 EU team?
Also where do I see that xxx is wip from someone so not to reinvent the wheel?
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ok let’s say I want to build something… where do I get info - reference from 80’s to build it? and then offer it 2 EU team?
In past I got info from differently sources.
The main one is google earth, even if those info is not from around 1987,
you can often see where buildings have been, etc.Another sources are homepages of the airbase itself,
or veteran homepages where members post some old pics.And another sources are spotter forums, where members have posted a lot of pics
from aircrafts mainly, but you can always spot one or another part of a building.
Also sometimes they have already posted pics of “open days” or similar.Searching for reference pics might be time consuming and sometimes it’s really hard to find
the info you’re searching for.BUT at the end you’ll get “familar” with the airbase and it’s history,
so you’ll get a good overall picture of the AB you’re modelling.Also where do I see that xxx is wip from someone so not to reinvent the wheel?
Just ask: I want to model that tower (and surrounding (not generic) buildings) of AB x,
then Sphynx will tell you if it’s already done or WIP by anyone, … or free to do.Ohh, and Arty, Thank’s for you vid about creating AB runways, taxiways, etc. in Corel Draw.
I hope it will be usefull for one or another.Like I’ve already posted elsewhere, this could also be done in 3DSMAX itself, … IMHO more easy, … more controlled,
… you’ve just not discovered howto, … yet.
Anyway, you’ve seen how quick it can be done, but modelling and texturing the 3D buildings is not done that quickly.
… that’s why we prefer to do 3D buildings first.Cheers,
LS -
Thanks for your effort, though Hungary is one of the very last priorities atm.
Roger. If the theater is smaller I don’t dig up in forum and asking around.