Landing…F-16 feels really unstable...
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I am wondering if it might have been a fuel imbalance issue? I remember seeing a pretty decent red area on the fuel gauge, but didn’t know how to fix it (I do now). Since this was the second TE (navigation), is this relevant to the a/c used, which I think is the Block 15?
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It could also be landing gear gain. FLCS changes gains when landing gear is deployed. Check this post (and the whole thread if you can disregard the silliness). https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?6987-Slow-Flight-Flight-model-question&p=84638&viewfull=1#post84638
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Thanks guys!
@Frederf I really appreciate you providing that info. I have a lot of homework.
@Blu3wolf I am not sure if sluggish best describes what i experienced, but some of this stuff is hard to put into words. On TE Training 02 everything felt normal, and the F-16 flew straight. When i started dropping altitude and began lining up my approach, the entire behavior on the plane changed. The nose seemed to be bouncing all over the place, and i needed almost full left stick to keep it even remotely level. The tower instructed 220 kt, but i was fighting it so hard i am not sure if i was 250 or 200. I drop the gear and it is completely normal and smooth again. I did not use the speed breaks to slow down.
I am going to do it a bunch more times, so i will report back once i have tried it using the procedure Frederf kindly provided.
what are your weather settings ?
are you flying over water ? city ? fields ?
i put my bet on mechanical turbulence, though it does not require Full stick ….actually even in haevy turbulences, the best thing is to do nothing…
A video would help
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It could also be landing gear gain. FLCS changes gains when landing gear is deployed. Check this post (and the whole thread if you can disregard the silliness). https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?6987-Slow-Flight-Flight-model-question&p=84638&viewfull=1#post84638
nope he said after Gear down, problem stops
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what are your weather settings ?
are you flying over water ? city ? fields ?
i put my bet on mechanical turbulence, though it does not require Full stick ….actually even in haevy turbulences, the best thing is to do nothing…
A video would help
It was the Training TE (#2 on navigation). I believe it started happening as I turned into the final steer point, which I believe was over water.
Guys, I really appreciate all the help. Just keep in mind that I am on Training Mission #2, so I probably have a ton of other things going on that could be a factor. I don’t know what I don’t know, but I am really enjoying the journey!
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Speedbreaks are usually open all the way out during approach,
if not, open them as you touch down, to help aerobreaking as much as you can. no point in opening them at 90 knots or so.Actually full speedbrakes are 60 degrees open. When landing gear switch is moved to the Down position, speedbrakes automatically retract to 43 degrees unless you override that.
You should not do this until 3-pt braking, because in the 2-pt aerodynamic phase, speedbrakes of 43 degrees or greater can contact the runway if you exceed 15 degrees pitch.
To summarize: only fully open your speedbrakes (beyond 43 degrees) once all 3 wheels are on the ground, and not before then.
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Sadly in BMS the speedbrakes have no collision box, and opening them fully at 13 degrees aerobraking will not cause a scrape (it should).
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Sadly in BMS the speedbrakes have no collision box, and opening them fully at 13 degrees aerobraking will not cause a scrape (it should).
Try scraping the hook.
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Sadly in BMS the speedbrakes have no collision box, and opening them fully at 13 degrees aerobraking will not cause a scrape (it should).
Try scraping the hook.
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Give us a BAK-12 for the hook [emoji14]
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I am not sure if this is a feature or not, but on approach to land the F-16 felt really sluggish, and i had a hard time keeping it aligned with the runway. As soon as i dropped the landing gear, it smoothed right out. Was my speed just too slow, or is some other forces being simulated? This was training TE 2, but i landed it as well. Stuck it too!
I’ve felt it, too, subjectively perhaps more then 4.32. Blue and Frederf are exactly right about the landing gains, and I almost feel like that modelling got tweaked a bit for 4.33?
Basically, I feel like FLCS acts exactly like I think it should, though I bow to the experts on that. What was your speed before you put the gear down? I like to keep my energy up and drop gear at 260-270 kt.(and would be interested in the pros’ opinion on that). Could you have slowed too much, the been “saved” by the FLCS landing gains? -
When deploying the gear in the 200-250KT range I never notice any upset in flying characteristics. I noticed speedbrakes have a pitch up moment even though the -1 says they are neutral. The 1993 Code One “Semper Viper” article by Dryden has more details.
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When deploying the gear in the 200-250KT range I never notice any upset in flying characteristics. I noticed speedbrakes have a pitch up moment even though the -1 says they are neutral. The 1993 Code One “Semper Viper” article by Dryden has more details.
be careful this can have different interpretation.
speedbrakes are indeed neutral, just extend them and you will see that there is NO Permanent pitch up…. there is a very slight pitch up catched by flcs which result in no significant pitch up and not permanent
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I’ve felt it, too, subjectively perhaps more then 4.32. Blue and Frederf are exactly right about the landing gains, and I almost feel like that modelling got tweaked a bit for 4.33?
Basically, I feel like FLCS acts exactly like I think it should, though I bow to the experts on that. What was your speed before you put the gear down? I like to keep my energy up and drop gear at 260-270 kt.(and would be interested in the pros’ opinion on that). Could you have slowed too much, the been “saved” by the FLCS landing gains?first how many times will i have to repeat
the only change of 4.33 vs 4.32 is the TEF modelization. no change in other areas and specially not FLCS since the real FLCS has already been included in 4.32.and if you read the OT the problem stopped after LG not during LG
i think he just experienced mechanical turbulences
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first how many times will i have to repeat
the only change of 4.33 vs 4.32 is the TEF modelization. no change in other areas and specially not FLCS since the real FLCS has already been included in 4.32.and if you read the OT the problem stopped after LG not during LG
i think he just experienced mechanical turbulences
Well, first Mav, I wasn’t complaining, just observing. I think the jet is doing exactly what it would do in RL. Also, I did say “subjectively”. Thirdly, I did see, and agree with the after LG comment. That IS when the landing gains are in play, after all.
Turbulence is of course always a possibility. However, I can routinely replicate what I believe he is describing, if I let the speed drop too much before the gear comes down. -
Well, first Mav, I wasn’t complaining, just observing. I think the jet is doing exactly what it would do in RL. Also, I did say “subjectively”. Thirdly, I did see, and agree with the after LG comment. That IS when the landing gains are in play, after all.
Turbulence is of course always a possibility. However, I can routinely replicate what I believe he is describing, if I let the speed drop too much before the gear comes down.please make a video