EXPANSION OF DEVELOPMENT BASE PERSONNEL THROUGH EDUCATION
-
Hmm not exactly the case I have 2 say Raptor.
The beast is way alive and kicking.
Info is so scattered and some of not many are totally forgotten and never used.
Theater development is way far from structured and documented. Besides this another major issue is knowledge of third party applications specifically on falcon development.
BMS core advances by leaps where community development tools and knowledge is left alone in the dark. There is a huge gap.2 all please don’t misunderstand, this is not complaining, just how things are.
I know devs are over their head and I respect that and I’m happy with what we have more than anything in the world.sent from my mi5 using Tapatalk
Got to agree with you there, the tooling we have to mod the sim is complicated (though again it’s one of those things once you know what you’re doing, you’re solid) relatively speaking and often have many unexplained features or are not documented that well, so it would be nice if we could get some tutorials for stuff like Monster Terrian, the LOD editor, ect for others to try their hand. As it stands now, you have to really want to get into modding because the learning curve is about as steep as flying the sim in and of itself, lol.
p.s. did I also mention that sadly most of the developers who make 3rd party software for BMS almost always end up not supporting/developing it anymore and a few versions of BMS later, you get incompatibility. Vicious cycle indeed.
-
Before asking what others SHOULD do
Prove what you CAN do and HOW
…It’s always been the way the team was expanded, it’s been proven working by what the team has delivered.
and why would one change something that’s working? -
@Red:
Before asking what others SHOULD do
Prove what you CAN do and HOW
…It’s always been the way the team was expanded, it’s been proven working by what the team has delivered.
and why would one change something that’s working?I agree with you. I am not TELLING anyone to do anything. I am making a suggestion backed by points and arguments. If you want my effort here is what I can offer. I am good at working with CAD programs. Designing buildings was a small part of my workday. So if the dev. team would like to lay down specifications of what kind of work they would welcome to see incorporated in the next Falcon version, I would be quite happy to offer some of my free time towards that goal. I dont want to be paid or anything. I just dont want to do something for no reason at all. I mean, if I am to spend 5 hrs of cadwork just to have my model rejected by someone, I might as well not do anything at all. That is why I believe that the effort needs to start from the core dev. team. Specifications. Guidelines. Quality criteria. Formatting.
I believe they can only benefit from such an approach.
-
I know of at least one real world F-16 pilot that offered to help improve the avionics and bring them closer to what is actually in the jet and he was more or less ignored. To put it bluntly, they don’t want our help.
It is not because he is not yet integrated into the team with a full access of the dev forum that wasn’t provided usefull info to some of the team members … and … one do not need to be team member to be usefull to the community. Anytime he comes on the ppl forum he provides some good info that might be good for the development.
That doesn’t mean people can’t contribute in their own way. There are plenty of models in dire need of replacement, lots of textures could use an overhaul, etc.
100% …
I (we) am still waiting for someone to give love to the Tactical Reference.
https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?19669-Tactical-Reference-problem&highlight=Tacref
-
@Red:
Before asking what others SHOULD do
Prove what you CAN do and HOW
…It’s always been the way the team was expanded, it’s been proven working by what the team has delivered.
and why would one change something that’s working?It doesn’t seem to me like he’s telling anyone, just proposing the question…. If I could relate this to sales, let me tell you something, as a professional business coordinator who does B2B sales, one of the hardest things to do, if not impossible to do is impress somebody who isn’t all that intersted in you in the first place. How are you going to “wow” them when everything you bring to the table is met with skepticism and all the other things that a CEO or business owner will do during a presentation. There must be on some level an open mind (neutral or positive client) or the transaction will never occur.
It’s kind of the same, the burden to prove oneself is too great. It would make more sense with that approach, if there were regular interview periods or something to that effect so there is motivation to perform at the highest levels. I think just saying, “well prove something to us” is a little ambiguous and hard to quantify, whereas if the dev team said, “well look, we’ll give you a shot to build xxx and based on your performance of xxx we will then go from there.”
That would give those who actually do have the ability and talent to produce, something to grab on to and actually impress the team. It will be far more impressive to the team if they say “make this” and that person excels than randomly making a feature that the dev team may or may not have an interest in. That risk to reward ratio is too great and unconscionable, meaning no reasonable person would enter into that undertaking because it would be foolish to do so.
Just some constructive feedback to your position, Red Dog.
-
Why do you all bother trying to get in “dev team”? It is their “ball”, their “courtyard”, the point was made clear in the past they are no interested.
Have fun with what you have in your HD and let them play the way they want. -
Naysayer
-
Why do you all bother trying to get in “dev team”? It is their “ball”, their “courtyard”, the point was made clear in the past they are no interested.
Have fun with what you have in your HD and let them play the way they want.I am not asking to be on any team dev. or otherwise. I am asking for a better terrain to fly over. Period. If that requires work on my behalf, so be it. But that would be anarchy if everyone of us just chose to start making buildings, tiles, structures etc. Look at all the side projects.
In my opinion HIGH QUALITY work is needed. And to get high quality work done, you need to think and answer the following two questions: a) what do you want to get out of your pipeline in the future? b) How do you get that out of it? You could probably also answer while at it “what is the most efficient way of getting that out of my pipeline?” or “do I anticipate future changes?” or “what are my inherent limitations I will always be carrying along with me?”.
Those are questions that can’t be answered by me. But that doesn’t mean I am dictating what people should do.
There is also the matter of continuity. Having a version 1.0 is good, but having a single version out every year is even better. Right now effort is scattered in various directions. I feel - and this is only my opinion - that if those efforts were centralised we would be enjoying a far better sim experience. All of us.
-
I (we) am still waiting for someone to give love to the Tactical Reference.
BAH…lol
Exactly what needs to be done?? Just updated info and/or missing info???
C9
-
You got too late for the match, the kids have already a ball and got the team set. Sorry. But we can surely enjoy watching they playing….;)
Edit: was a reply for the atreides, not you cloud.
-
@Cloud:
BAH…lol
Exactly what needs to be done?? Just updated info and/or missing info???
C9
BOOM! See that’s what I’m talking about. A “mission” if you will describing perfectly what would improve the simulator for the dev team and save their time!
Now they have time to work on Link-16! juuuuuuuust kiddin’ don’t beat me up guys
-
Monster Terrian, the LOD editor
LOD Editor comes with a user manual. And Jan Has has put out and made public a LOT of info on how to use LE also, here and on his website.
Monsters TE, is an intuitive application. It’s not hard at all, you just have to play around with it and learn how it works. If you have questions, then ask them here on the Forums and you’ll most likely get the answer you need.
The problem I see is everyone want’s to be spoon feed everything…AND I mean everything. Most of us old Devs have learned ourselves with very little “being taught” or “having instructions” from anyone. We studied the tools and figured out how to use them basically on our own.
No one want’s to do this anymore. But then again that’s just a sign of the times we live in now a days, as everyone seems to feel they are entitled to be given everything they want/request!!!
C9
-
You got too late for the match, the kids have already a ball and got the team set. Sorry. But we can surely enjoy watching they playing….;)
Edit: was a reply for the atreides, not you cloud.
Thats fine if thats how they want to keep things. I can only make suggestions. From my POV my suggestion makes sense. Perhaps I am not taking into consideration factors that only they know of. For whatever reason - my offer stands. I thnk that if they focused on creating/maintaining pipelines (e.g. cockpits, terrain, 3D objects, weather etc), higher quality and a greater volume of work would get done.
-
You got too late for the match, the kids have already a ball and got the team set. Sorry. But we can surely enjoy watching they playing….;)
Edit: was a reply for the atreides, not you cloud.
I know. I love your analogy!!!
It’s my ball and I’M taking it and going home!! LOL
C9
-
@Cloud:
LOD Editor comes with a user manual. And Jan Has has put out and made public a LOT of info on how to use LE also, here and on his website.
Monsters TE, is an intuitive application. It’s not hard at all, you just have to play around with it and learn how it works. If you have questions, then ask them here on the Forums and you’ll most likely get the answer you need.
The problem I see is everyone want’s to be spoon feed everything…AND I mean everything. Most of us old Devs have learned ourselves with very little “being taught” or “having instructions” from anyone. We studied the tools and figured out how to use them basically on our own.
No one want’s to do this anymore. But then again that’s just a sign of the times we live in now a days, as everyone seems to feel they are entitled to be given everything they want/request!!!
C9
Not my stance cloud 9. I am willing to do work and read / learn whats needed to do that work. COORDINATION is what is missing from the picture. How helpful would it be if 70 out of 100 devs are working on the same tile? Does that sound productive? If you feel that anyone that puts in the time to figure out how the tools work and what exactly to get out of them will achieve the required results, I will take your word for it.
But the next time you find 40~50 iterations of the same “thing” in a folder, you will eventually ask yourself if this could be avoided.
-
@Cloud:
LOD Editor comes with a user manual. And Jan Has has put out and made public a LOT of info on how to use LE also, here and on his website.
Monsters TE, is an intuitive application. It’s not hard at all, you just have to play around with it and learn how it works. If you have questions, then ask them here on the Forums and you’ll most likely get the answer you need.
The problem I see is everyone want’s to be spoon feed everything…AND I mean everything. Most of us old Devs have learned ourselves with very little “being taught” or “having instructions” from anyone. We studied the tools and figured out how to use them basically on our own.
No one want’s to do this anymore. But then again that’s just a sign of the times we live in now a days, as everyone seems to feel they are entitled to be given everything they want/request!!!
C9
I don’t know man, I don’t think it’s so much about giving everything to people or spoon feeding, because it would be pretty hard to still not study whatever tutorial or videos they would make and be successful. There’s got to be some modder out there with enough zeal for what he does to share that knowledge with others.
It’s just part of being a member of a community imho, the human experience, sharing with others. Now if someone is definitely taking advantage of you, then you stop, but sharing knowledge, ideas, technical know how is how we all get better as a whole and is not just giving away everything at anothers request.
I agree that the tools aren’t hard after studying them, which I have to an extent, but I’m not primarily a modder I can do simple stuff, but otherwise I leave it up to another person in my team, Flogger (Rybo) to do what I am not able to do. We all can do more by networking with others that have the skills we don’t. Another part of the human experience in this world.
-
Not my stance cloud 9.
No, No, sorry Atreides, that post WAS NOT directed at you in any way!!
Sorry if you thought that.
C9
-
@Cloud:
No, No, sorry Atreides, that post WAS NOT directed at you in any way!!
Sorry if you thought that.
C9
Thats ok. I am not easily offended anyway. As I said earlier, I think that keeping the dev. team “tight” or “closed” is probably a good thing as it limits anarchy. Organize us. I am only suggesting that the team sits down and has scope for even just one single thing (lets say buildings in general for the sake of an example). And once they define what would be GREAT to have concerning buildings in Falcon, to figure out what needs to be done to get them.
If you say that the tools are intuitive, I believe you. I am self taught in many ways myself. I would never fork out for CAD lessons anyway and some CAD techniques can be frustrating to say the least. Similarly, there are self taught people out there on e.g. photoshop, Paint.NET, etc. Those tools produce BMP and raster images. Whats missing from the picture is the common goal of the scope I just mentioned.
We all need to know what we are making if we are to contribute and help. Organize us.
-
This post is deleted! -
@Cloud:
BAH…lol
Exactly what needs to be done?? Just updated info and/or missing info???
C9
BOOM! See that’s what I’m talking about. A “mission” if you will describing perfectly what would improve the simulator for the dev team and save their time!
Now they have time to work on Link-16! juuuuuuuust kiddin’ don’t beat me up guys
Both. Just ensure that each “entities” is present & up to date in TacRef … Remove what is wrong/outdated.