Suggestion for database, data supply
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MiG-23 and MiG-27
In database currently there is only ML variant. In RL ML did not have dispenser or just only a fraction of the fleet. Because of gamebalance I recommend to give dispenser capability for ML variant, by modeling the fuselage dispensers, 2x60 charges. MiG-27 had the same dispenser config as MiG-23MLD.
http://www.vectorsite.net/avmig23_1.html
The centerline pylon modeling is not possible, same case as Su-17 KDS-23 vs. ASO-2 modeling.
mig23.dat
Original datanChaff 30
nFlare 60New data
nChaff 60
nFlare 60
FlareSeq 0
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 4 2.2 0.9
FlarePos2 4 -2.2 0.9
FlareVec1 0 5 -85
FlareVec2 0 -5 -85
FlareCount1 30
FlareSeq 2
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 4 2.2 0.9
FlarePos2 4 -2.2 0.9
FlareVec1 0 5 -85
FlareVec2 0 -5 -85
FlareCount1 30
ChaffSeq 0
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffPos1 4 2.2 0.9
ChaffPos2 4 -2.2 0.9
ChaffVec1 0 5 -85
ChaffVec2 0 -5 -85
ChaffCount1 30
ChaffSeq 2
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffPos1 4 2.2 0.9
ChaffPos2 4 -2.2 0.9
ChaffVec1 0 5 -85
ChaffVec2 0 -5 -85
ChaffCount1 30Video.
http://www.mediafire.com/file/eklkt5j0h4biab5/MiG-23_flare.mp4mig27.dat
Original data_nChaff 30
nFlare 60FlareSeq 0
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 -6.29 0.43 -2.15
FlarePos2 -6.29 -0.43 -2.15
FlareVec1 0 30 -80
FlareVec2 0 -30 -80
FlareCount1 30
FlareSeq 2
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 -6.29 0.43 -2.15
FlarePos2 -6.29 -0.43 -2.15
FlareVec1 0 30 -80
FlareVec2 0 -30 -80
FlareCount1 30ChaffSeq 0
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffPos1 -6.29 0.43 -2.15
ChaffPos2 -6.29 -0.43 -2.15
ChaffVec1 0 30 -80
ChaffVec2 0 -30 -80
ChaffCount1 30_New data
nChaff 60
nFlare 60
FlareSeq 0
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 4 2.2 0.9
FlarePos2 4 -2.2 0.9
FlareVec1 0 5 -85
FlareVec2 0 -5 -85
FlareCount1 30
FlareSeq 2
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 4 2.2 0.9
FlarePos2 4 -2.2 0.9
FlareVec1 0 5 -85
FlareVec2 0 -5 -85
FlareCount1 30
ChaffSeq 0
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffPos1 4 2.2 0.9
ChaffPos2 4 -2.2 0.9
ChaffVec1 0 5 -85
ChaffVec2 0 -5 -85
ChaffCount1 30
ChaffSeq 2
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffPos1 4 2.2 0.9
ChaffPos2 4 -2.2 0.9
ChaffVec1 0 5 -85
ChaffVec2 0 -5 -85
ChaffCount1 30 -
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This is the problem. Do we anything besides praying…? I cannot see any reacton for BMS HQ…
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This post is deleted! -
Community wil accept your modding molnibalage if you give them the right Explanations + Changelog.
Maybe BMS not at first but community loves to tweak (and break stuff :()
i put it in the dat files. looks cool -
MiG-25.
In the '80s in USSR the PDS variant was widely used. During Desert Strom dispenser usage was confirmed by US pilots. Iraq used PD variants, likely with minor modifications.
Dispenser cartridges missing from the wing.
Because of gambalance - and we have olny one MiG-25 DB entry - I recommend to model 2 x KDS-155 dispenser on wings. Only problem hard to find exact data about the dispenser. I recommend to 60/60, its size is similar to BVP-50-60 that was used on MiG-23MLD.
mig25.dat
Old data
nChaff 30
nFlare 60New data
nChaff 60
nFlare 60
FlareSeq 0
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 -5 12 -4
FlarePos2 -5 -12 -4
FlareVec1 0 5 -85
FlareVec2 0 -5 -85
FlareCount1 30
FlareSeq 2
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 -5 12 -4
FlarePos2 -5 -12 -4
FlareVec1 0 5 -85
FlareVec2 0 -5 -85
FlareCount1 30
ChaffSeq 0
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffPos1 -5 12 -4
ChaffPos2 -5 -12 -4
ChaffVec1 0 5 -85
ChaffVec2 0 -5 -85
ChaffCount1 30
ChaffSeq 2
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffPos1 -5 12 -4
ChaffPos2 -5 -12 -4
ChaffVec1 0 5 -85
ChaffVec2 0 -5 -85
ChaffCount1 30Video
http://www.mediafire.com/file/yjrd5rgo862638c/MiG-25_flare.mp4 -
MiG-31
http://www.ordtech-industries.com/2products/FlaresIR/FlaresIR.html
3x8 is so few that is hard to model. Maybe 12/12 with single dispensers.
_Old data
nChaff 30
nFlare 60_
New datanChaff 12
nFlare 12It is not required to define release angle and position, default is good.
It is not dispenser related but HMS flag shold be disabled. MiG-31 never had HMS, it is not a dogfighter. Most of currently used MiG-31 do not have R-73 launch capability. MiG-31BM never entered into service, it is still only in prototype phase.
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MiG-29
The current qty. is good. (30/30). Dispensers are integrated the forward section of vertical stabilizer.
Two different model is possible. One chaff / flare for each release (version A), swapping release. Other other model is double chaff or flare release for each release command. ‘Version A’ means 30 release - close to F-16C capability - ‘version B’ means 15 double release.mig29a.dat
mig29c.dat
mig29g.dat
mig29m.dat
mig29s.datOld data
FlareDispensers 1
FlareSeq 0
FlarePos1 -7.1 -2.0 -1.5
FlareVec1 0 0 -100
FlareCount1 30
FlarePos10 0 0 0
FlareVec10 0 0 200
FlareCount10 30
ChaffDispensers 1
ChaffSeq 0
ChaffPos1 7.1 -2.0 -1.5
ChaffVec1 0 0 -100
ChaffCount1 30
ChaffPos10 0 0 0
ChaffVec10 0 0 200
ChaffCount10 30New data
Version A
FlareDispensers 2
FlareSeq 0
FlarePos1 -7.1 -7.0 -1.5
FlarePos2 -7.1 7.0 -1.5
FlareVec1 0 -5 -100
FlareVec2 0 5 -100
FlareCount1 30
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffSeq 0
ChaffPos1 7.1 -7.0 -1.5
ChaffPos2 7.1 2.0 -1.5
ChaffVec1 0 0 -100
ChaffVec2 0 0 -100
ChaffCount1 30
Version BFlareDispensers 2
FlareSeq 0
FlarePos1 -7.1 -7.0 -1.5
FlarePos2 -7.1 7.0 -1.5
FlareVec1 0 -5 -100
FlareVec2 0 5 -100
FlareCount1 30
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffSeq 0
ChaffPos1 7.1 -7.0 -1.5
ChaffPos2 7.1 2.0 -1.5
ChaffVec1 0 0 -100
ChaffVec2 0 0 -100
ChaffCount1 30Video
http://www.mediafire.com/file/jsy574a9e0lqhvg/MiG-29_flare.mp4
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Su-27, Su-30, Su-33.
They have three cartridges, each with 32 APP-50 decoy, totaly qty is 96.
[http://books.google.hu/books?id=Y8kePYFK1L8C&pg=PA92&lpg=PA92&dq=su-27+26mm+flare&source=bl&ots=hNBbCQtcq3&sig=_vyb0hdfO5Z8cARPlNF_uli7X4s&hl=hu&sa=X&ei=IoIET67dBuiN4gSxw9XrDw&ved=0CCQQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=su-27 26mm flare&f=false](http://books.google.hu/books?id=Y8kePYFK1L8C&pg=PA92&lpg=PA92&dq=su-27+26mm+flare&source=bl&ots=hNBbCQtcq3&sig=_vyb0hdfO5Z8cARPlNF_uli7X4s&hl=hu&sa=X&ei=IoIET67dBuiN4gSxw9XrDw&ved=0CCQQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=su-27 26mm flare&f=false)
This is the only source which is mentioning 8 cartirdges, I have never seen any picture about any Su-27 variant with 8 cartridges.
For Su-27 main question what the goal is. Better BVR or better dogfigt protection? Becaues it has ECM by pod, my recommendation is more flares than chaff, double flare release and single chaff.su27.dat
su27ub.dat
su30m.dat
su30mkk.dat
su33.datOriginal data
_nChaff 30
nFlare 60FlareSeq 0
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 -24.8 1 0.14
FlarePos2 -24.8 -1 0.14
FlareVec1 0 30 -80
FlareVec2 0 -30 -80
FlareCount1 30
FlareSeq 2
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 -24.8 1 0.14
FlarePos2 -24.8 -1 0.14
FlareVec1 0 30 -80
FlareVec2 0 -30 -80
FlareCount1 30ChaffSeq 0
ChaffDispensers 2
ChaffPos1 -24.8 1 0.14
ChaffPos2 -24.8 -1 0.14
ChaffVec1 0 30 -80
ChaffVec2 0 -30 -80
ChaffCount1 30_New data
**nChaff 32
nFlare 64FlareSeq 2
FlareDispensers 2
FlarePos1 -24.8 1 0.14
FlarePos2 -24.8 -1 0.14
FlareVec1 0 30 -80
FlareVec2 0 -30 -80
FlareCount1 30ChaffSeq 0
ChaffDispensers 1
ChaffPos1 -24.8 1 0.14
ChaffVec1 0 30 -80
ChaffCount1 30** -
AIM-9L/M.
Reference, for thrust and weight.
http://www.alternatewars.com/SAC/AIM-9L_Sidewinder_SMC_-_November_1974.pdfTest results.
http://www.mediafire.com/?69njllinjo9jqqj
My conclusion; the drag coefficients maybe should be tweked. By using the RL weight, thrust, burn time resulted very high speed at high altitude. I know that burnout time and thrust are not static but in data you can define only one value, exe take care the rest of work. Even at ~10 km (33k feet) burnout speed should be about M3.0-3.2.
Video with new data. All test performed by this way. Same launch speed, level flight.
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Good info.
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could you upload your vids to youtube? I hate downloading vids, especially from free hosting providers such as mediafire :F
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I do not want to mess my Youtube account with “temporary videos”.
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I do not want to mess my Youtube account with “temporary videos”.
You may put “unreferenced videos”
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Ok, I added the video.
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Devs? Are you here? Any comment about data supply? Is it enoght detailed?
(Not all stuff is downloaded the link that I provide you.)
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AIM-54.
Some RL video.
1:15
3:34
Missile is “dropped” and not launched “from rail”. Moreover, the initial accelaration is quite small comparing with current flight model.
Data suggetions and videos comes soon.
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Link for files. You can find vhs files about test, you can see these also on the test video. The new thrust char. is shown in Excel table.
http://www.mediafire.com/?qd6epocb3vjfd
Video about test.
The propellant and empty weights were changed to RL weight. Because of smaller weight the thrust characteristics was canged to keeps similar to current top speeds and counting RL data.
Lofting bias was also changed to modeling the traveling stage of AIM-54.
Boostgide value increased to 5 sec to modeling the weakier initial maneuvering capability.
aim54.dat
aim54a.datOriginal data
_1020.74 # Weight of Missile (lbs)
400 # Weight of propellant (lbs)
1 # Lofting Bias
1 # Seconds we are in boostguide mode12 # Number of Time Breaks
#BURN TIMES
0 0.025 1 2.5
4 5 5.2 16 16.5
16.6 16.8 17ENGINE THRUST (LBS)
THRUST
0 22000 17000 18000
20000 5000 3000 3200 2400
1200 600 0_New data
**734 # Weight of Missile (lbs)
288 # Weight of propellant (lbs)
2 # Lofting Bias
5 # Seconds we are in boostguide mode9 # Number of Time Breaks
#BURN TIMES
0 1 4 6
10 10.2 10.5 20 21ENGINE THRUST (LBS)
##THRUST
0 0 4000 7500
9000 7000 3500 3000 0** -
I like that.
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The effect of lofting bias.
Orginial flight path.
New flight path.
The different peak altitude and profile is clearly visible.