Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual)
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The keyfile editing via the launcher has about a 25% success rate. After reading the manual again, I still can’t figure out a sure way to make edits to the keyfile and have it reliably work when I start BMS.
- Why is there no
Save
button in the Launcher? - Why can’t I save a keyfile (like
JstnJ - RSSB/TMThrtle
) and have it be the active profile when I go to Setup–>Controllers instead ofBMS-Auto
being the active profile every time? - Why must I mess with toggling the setup override during launch in order for certain things to work?
- Why inexplicably are all my keybinds for my RSSB cleared out simply by toggling the keyfile back and forth in the launcher?
I really enjoy the enhanced launcher being the default now, but I have never had so many keyfile issues as I do in 4.37.
Maybe I’m just dense, but as you can see, I am certainly frustrated.
I am open to any tips or tricks on how to understand what the heck is going on.
Thanks all!
- Why is there no
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@jstnj said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
The keyfile editing via the launcher has about a 25% success rate. After reading the manual again, I still can’t figure out a sure way to make edits to the keyfile and have it reliably work when I start BMS.
- Why is there no
Save
button in the Launcher? - Why can’t I save a keyfile (like
JstnJ - RSSB/TMThrtle
) and have it be the active profile when I go to Setup–>Controllers instead ofBMS-Auto
being the active profile every time? - Why must I mess with toggling the setup override during launch in order for certain things to work?
- Why inexplicably are all my keybinds for my RSSB cleared out simply by toggling the keyfile back and forth in the launcher?
I really enjoy the enhanced launcher being the default now, but I have never had so many keyfile issues as I do in 4.37.
Maybe I’m just dense, but as you can see, I am certainly frustrated.
I am open to any tips or tricks on how to understand what the heck is going on.
Thanks all!
I don’t know why when I see your profile it is a complaint for the BMS community and for the developers, I don’t know, but I want to look the other way and think differently, that you are not a troll, there is no positive post, it is as if the sun You will look for each of its spots. If you have so much power to find problems, the BMS developers would have already contacted you, but since I know they don’t, then the explanation for so many complaints is another. I am going to give you some advice from an old pilot from my land. FLY AND LET FLY
greetings and may the next pots be, thanks for existing BMS
- Why is there no
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Works fine here, couldnt be easier. Save button in keymapping also works fine on my end. No issues here.
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Not sure I understand what you are saying, but if its “you always complain” I don’t really want to engage with you because… that’s just plain false.
My post history, including minor contributions to BMS users in the form of small mods, is very supportive and in the interest of the improvement of the sim and to support collective learning of myself (when I have questions) and others (when people need help). Seems like you are trying to start something for…no reason?
I’m here asking for help with the keyfile stuff, if you don’t want to help that’s fine…but no need to come in here being accusatory and negative.
Thanks anyway.
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@Icarus said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
Works fine here, couldnt be easier. Save button in keymapping also works fine on my end. No issues here.
Hmm.
So is the order of operations:
- Make edits in Launcher
- Launch
- Immediately go to Setup–>Controllers
- Save the config
For 4 above, do I save it and overwrite
BMS - Auto
or should I be saving it as another profile? It seems if I do the latter, the profile does not load on subsequent launches. -
@jstnj said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
Why is there no Save button in the Launcher?
I’ll start by agreeing with you – I think much confusion and frustration re AL would be alleviated if it had a simple, familiar File-Open/Save metaphor, instead of trying to overwrite stuff… basically, I too really wish it was “Alternative Key/Cfg File Editor” instead of “Alternative Launcher”. (I do kinda understand the history and rationale of why it was made the way it was… needing to write the .pop file which points to the key file etc, for a seamless startup experience. So ok, it is what it is.)
Remember, you can simply choose not to use it. Or, use it as a one-time editor… Once you have all your buttons and keys the way you like, just save a backup copy of ‘BMS-Auto.key’… call it whatever, “JstnJ.key” and you can load that within BMS if you want.
Nobody needs a launcher, old or new… Windows is perfectly capable of launching programs [citation needed]. Just make a shortcut to ‘\Falcon BMS 4.37\Bin\x64\Falcon BMS.exe’ and be done with it.
(Why was there ever a Launcher.exe to begin with? That, I have no idea… maybe it was to enforce set some app-compat flags on the actual BMS process. Or just avoid filling desktop with half dozen shortcuts to things like RTT, IVC, Config.exe and the editor, etc)
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@jstnj said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
@Icarus said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
Works fine here, couldnt be easier. Save button in keymapping also works fine on my end. No issues here.
Hmm.
So is the order of operations:
- Make edits in Launcher
- Launch
- Immediately go to Setup–>Controllers
- Save the config
For 4 above, do I save it and overwrite
BMS - Auto
or should I be saving it as another profile? It seems if I do the latter, the profile does not load on subsequent launches.No. Dont do anything in setup>controllers. Do it all in launcher. Its actually very intuitive. Press save in launcher. Save each edit. Use autokey as keyfile is least complicated.
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@airtex2019 said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
@jstnj said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
Why is there no Save button in the Launcher?
I’ll start by agreeing with you – I think much confusion and frustration re AL would be alleviated if it had a simple, familiar File-Open/Save metaphor, instead of trying to overwrite stuff… basically, I too really wish it was “Alternative Key/Cfg File Editor” instead of “Alternative Launcher”. (I do kinda understand the history and rationale of why it was made the way it was… needing to write the .pop file which points to the key file etc, for a seamless startup experience. So ok, it is what it is.)
Remember, you can simply choose not to use it. Or, use it as a one-time editor… Once you have all your buttons and keys the way you like, just save a backup copy of ‘BMS-Auto.key’… call it whatever, “JstnJ.key” and you can load that within BMS if you want.
Nobody needs a launcher, old or new… Windows is perfectly capable of launching programs [citation needed]. Just make a shortcut to ‘\Falcon BMS 4.37\Bin\x64\Falcon BMS.exe’ and be done with it.
(Why was there ever a Launcher.exe to begin with? That, I have no idea… maybe it was to enforce set some app-compat flags on the actual BMS process. Or just avoid filling desktop with half dozen shortcuts to things like RTT, IVC, Config.exe and the editor, etc)
Well, my issue isn’t really the Launcher necessarily. I can see the use for the launcher: There are many tools, companion apps, and configuration options that can be more easily linked from the launcher.
By using the launcher you save…4 or 5 desktop shortcuts, and it also allows you to do things like change the theatre etc.
My “issue”, valid or not, is that the keyfile situation is finicky…one wrong move and it does not do what you expect. I am a product manager working in software development for a living, however, I am just one voice so, take that with a grain of salt.
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@jstnj yeah I think the “Key File Editor” should be just another app down in the tray of various ecosystem apps, that one can launch when desired. just like Config.exe for modifying the cfg file.
it might be moot… I think/hope bigger changes are in store for the entire 2d experience
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@jstnj Its quite simple.
- Set all your call-backs in the Launcher, e.g. Key-mapping
Forget about the set-up page in the UI, I think there’s only a couple settings that cannot be done via the Launcher e.g. Mirrors but I assume that will be added in due course. Compared to previous versions the Launcher is a huge improvement, no need to edit the key-files directly and potentially stuff things up with a typo.
The only criticism I had for the last update is that the updater needed to be updated first. Otherwise its as simple as hell to use. Do all your edits with the check box blank, get everything working how you want it, when you think you’re done check it again. Finally set the check box and nothing will be over-ridden.
You’re welcome!
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Base statement with New (Alternate) Launcher :
Either you do your settings* with the Launcher** or in BMS settings***, but don’t try to mix both methods.
*includes axis mapping
** you can call it “New way to configure”
*** you can call it “Legacy way to configure” -
@jstnj Do yourself a big favour, copy out regularly the …BMS437\User\Config folder, (i zip it to an online location at every machine start up using task scheduler).
That way you can iterate your testing/debugging of your issues, and always get back to your best settings. Might even allow you identify what’s causing the 75% failure rate with the AL
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@Fish44 said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
@jstnj Do yourself a big favour, copy out regularly the …BMS437\User\Config folder, (i zip it to an online location at every machine start up using task scheduler).
That way you can iterate your testing/debugging of your issues, and always get back to your best settings. Might even allow you identify what’s causing the 75% failure rate with the AL
The issue I ran into already is that this didn’t work.
I backed up the entire User/Config folder and restored it during a reinstall, but because the control axes need rebinding during that process, I still lost all the non-auto bindings.
…Which is the overarching point I’m trying to make, there are competing files, the devicesorting.txt, and two “sources of truth” between the Launcher and the 2D menu…it’s hard to even troubleshoot the issue when that happens.
Secondly, editing the Launcher dropdown from
BMS - Auto
to any other starting point (likeJstnJ backup
) seems to not do…anything? the binds that I backed up do not show when I change the selection in the Launcher dropdown.It’s a collection of weird functionality that I can’t completely understand. Again, I am just one person so, ymmv.
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@jstnj said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
backed up the entire User/Config folder and restored it during a reinstall, but because the control axes need rebinding during that process, I still lost
No, the backup and restore really should have worked.
I don’t know what’s going wrong on your system. Are you saying, it’s confusing and error-prone? (I agree)
Or are you saying, it’s truly 25% / 75% nondeterministic – scrambles things at random? (That is not happening to anyone else.)
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@jstnj said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual)
- Why is there no
Save
button in the Launcher?
Because, when closing, Launcher automaticaly update & save
BMS - Auto.key
(Key bindings) &Setup.vXXX.Devices.xml
(DX bindings) files base on the settings done (in the Launcher).
Nota : seems to do it even if you close the window without launching BMS. To be confirmed.If you uncheck the “Launch without any setup overide” , it will update as well the axis mapping & calibration (
axismapping.dat
&joystick.cal
for what I understood)- Why can’t I save a keyfile (like
JstnJ - RSSB/TMThrtle
) and have it be the active profile when I go to Setup–>Controllers instead ofBMS-Auto
being the active profile every time?
Part of the answer above.
In addition if you launch with setup overide (ie decide to use the setting done in the Launcher), it will setBMS - Auto.key
as the active keyfile. This is somehow logical because it is where the key map settings have been saved (again by/through the Launcher).- Why must I mess with toggling the setup override during launch in order for certain things to work?
You shouldn’t mess with toggling the setup override :
If you launch without setup overide --> Only launcher settings will be usedIf you launch with setup overide --> Only BMS 2D settings will be used
EDIT :- If you launch with setup overide (without checking the checkbox) --> Only launcher settings will be used
- If you launch without setup overide (with checking the checkbox)–> Only BMS 2D settings will be used
- Why inexplicably are all my keybinds for my RSSB cleared out simply by toggling the keyfile back and forth in the launcher?
Because, once you use the Launcher for your settings, the keybinds are in the
BMS - Auto.key
+Setup.vXXX.Devices.xml
and no longer inJstnJ - RSSB/TMThrtle
. The latter is only the start reference for your 1st keybinding with the Launcher (and only the key, not the DX).I really enjoy the enhanced launcher being the default now, but I have never had so many keyfile issues as I do in 4.37.
So you seems to be used to Legacy settings methology (ie pre New Laucnehr, ie BMS 2D/UI Setup & Key File Editor). I you want (or need) to keep the old way (as I personnaly do), just do it (ie don’t do the settings in Launcher) and launch without setup overide.
And keep in mind : @CheckPoint said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
Base statement with New (Alternate) Launcher :
Either you do your settings* with the Launcher** or in BMS settings***, but don’t try to mix both methods.
*includes axis mapping
** you can call it “New way to configure”
*** you can call it “Legacy way to configure” - Why is there no
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@jstnj said
The issue I ran into already is that this didn’t work.
Sorry i can’t help you any further. I don’t use the AL, and have no knowledge of what it does. What i do know is the files containing your game settings, video etct, and joystick mapping, and key mappings are all in the config folder. If you are having issues with those backed up files, either 1. they are broken to start with, or 2. AL is breaking them.
If 2 is the answer, then restoring, and running BMS from the .exe should give you good settings. (if you have a good set of files in that backup)
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@CheckPoint said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
@jstnj said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual)
- Why is there no
Save
button in the Launcher?
Because, when closing, Launcher automaticaly update & save
BMS - Auto.key
(Key bindings) &Setup.vXXX.Devices.xml
(DX bindings) files base on the settings done (in the Launcher).
Nota : seems to do it even if you close the window without launching BMS. To be confirmed.If you uncheck the “Launch without any setup overide” , it will update as well the axis mapping & calibration (
axismapping.dat
&joystick.cal
for what I understood)- Why can’t I save a keyfile (like
JstnJ - RSSB/TMThrtle
) and have it be the active profile when I go to Setup–>Controllers instead ofBMS-Auto
being the active profile every time?
Part of the answer above.
In addition if you launch with setup overide (ie decide to use the setting done in the Launcher), it will setBMS - Auto.key
as the active keyfile. This is somehow logical because it is where the key map settings have been saved (again by/through the Launcher).- Why must I mess with toggling the setup override during launch in order for certain things to work?
You shouldn’t mess with toggling the setup override :
- If you launch without setup overide --> Only launcher settings will be used
- If you launch with setup overide --> Only BMS 2D settings will be used
- Why inexplicably are all my keybinds for my RSSB cleared out simply by toggling the keyfile back and forth in the launcher?
Because, once you use the Launcher for your settings, the keybinds are in the
BMS - Auto.key
+Setup.vXXX.Devices.xml
and no longer inJstnJ - RSSB/TMThrtle
. The latter is only the start reference for your 1st keybinding with the Launcher (and only the key, not the DX).I really enjoy the enhanced launcher being the default now, but I have never had so many keyfile issues as I do in 4.37.
So you seems to be used to Legacy settings methology (ie pre New Laucnehr, ie BMS 2D/UI Setup & Key File Editor). I you want (or need) to keep the old way (as I personnaly do), just do it (ie don’t do the settings in Launcher) and launch without setup overide.
And keep in mind : @CheckPoint said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
Base statement with New (Alternate) Launcher :
Either you do your settings* with the Launcher** or in BMS settings***, but don’t try to mix both methods.
*includes axis mapping
** you can call it “New way to configure”
*** you can call it “Legacy way to configure”This is exactly the explanation I needed. Thanks for the clarifications.
It’s still unintuitive but, at least I understand some of the peculiarities a little better now.
Thank you!
- Why is there no
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See it’s confusing!
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@airtex2019 said in Keyfile loading/saving is unintuitive (yes, i read the manual):
See it’s confusing!
Wait, is this correct? I thought the “setup override” boolean decides whether the
Falcon BMS User.cfg
gets loaded atop theFalcon BMS.cfg
.If so, I guess I misunderstood some verbiage again.
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@jstnj It was worded backward. It’s like a double-negative… I think meant “if you launch without checking the box to launch without overrides” - vs - “if you launch with checking the box to launch without overrides”.
And no it has nothing to do with BMS loading the cfg files the way it does. BMS does what BMS does, even if you never run the Alt Launcher.
AL will append some stuff to your user.cfg file (the lines that are tagged with // SETUP OVERRIDE) when you first launch with overrides, but it never removes those, even if you subsequently set the checkbox…
Also be aware there are things like pilot-model and smart-scaling which are in the binary pop files, not the cfg files. Same rules apply.