Israel 1980s - UOAF edition
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Same questions as Tazz.
why can not frag those E-2Cs in the second campaign?
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Reply to gza036’s post from 11/24/17 -
Love this theater for the low tech jets, WVR furball potential, and abundance of history to draw from. Looking forward to the next edition after the next BMS version - this period and geography has huge potential! Great job guys and please keep it up!!
There was plenty of action throughout the Sinai and into Egypt proper during the Suez Crisis a/k/a Tripartite Aggression. Why not explore that with 1985 technology?
It could go like this -
A cozy relationship with President Reagan results in Egypt’s Hosni Mubarak receiving F-14’s in return for a US Navy base near Said. Fallout from the Lebanese Civil War and “Peace for Galilee” campaign destabilizes Egypt, resulting in Mubarak fleeing into exile in the USA. The Suez canal is closed to foreign shipping. Suspicions turn to hostility as PLO guerillas begin cross-border rocket attacks into Israel’s western settlements.
After hostilities break out, Israel and USA have 5 days to achieve regime change (return Mubarak to power) in Egypt before the Soviets issue a nuclear ultimatum and land peace keeping troops at Arish and sever Israel’s supply lines.
Egypt must hold Cairo until their faithful Soviet allies return to their aid. Surviving the onslaught from the western world will elevate Egypt to regional supremacy. All western military equipment is expendable because it will be replaced by Soviet gear after the war as the Russians exit Afghanistan.
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Is this still being developed? It’s been awfully quiet?
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Is this still being developed? It’s been awfully quiet?
I think the team is holding off until the next BMS version is released.
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On my little own, I wish sincerely not, Tazz.
Sixpack’s scenario is really not too bad. Or it’s a good starting point, at least. I liked it, thanks mate.
With best regards,
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That’s not good to hear. Any idea what we need to do to get BMS to schedule AWACS flights in the 2nd campaign?
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That’s not good to hear. Any idea what we need to do to get BMS to schedule AWACS flights in the 2nd campaign?
AWACS flights will be scheduled until ground troops push west further. When my current campaign’s blue forces pushed to the location near EL Arish, E-2C took off.
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AWACS flights will be scheduled until ground troops push west further. When my current campaign’s blue forces pushed to the location near EL Arish, E-2C took off.
Can we schedule them earlier? Right now I’m taking off in the mornings without any AWACS cover whatsoever and with half the EAF already airborne and waiting for us?
When I check the E-2C squadron, it had no flights tasked whatsoever? -
Can we schedule them earlier? Right now I’m taking off in the mornings without any AWACS cover whatsoever and with half the EAF already airborne and waiting for us?
When I check the E-2C squadron, it had no flights tasked whatsoever?It seems can not schedule E-2Cs earlier because it depends on the distance from FLOT to the AWACS’ station area. If FLOT is so close to the base of E-2C squadron,AWACS flights can not be fragged. You can make a try to relocate the E-2C squadron to the northern airbases such as Ramat-David but i don’t think it can work because nearby Syria is not friendly to Israel ,so you have to change the relationship between Syria and Israel by Mission Commander before the relocation of E-2C squadron.
By the way, Air combats without AWACS is very challenging and exciting. It needs better VID or other ID techniques before engagement not simply ask AWACS for conformation. This make such a kind of combat in the BMS be very close to the real air battle especially in the 1980’s. We now play the second campaign without any AWACS most of time. it’s tough but fun!
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In the 1980s Procedural ID was possible which is not the case in BMS (insofar as it is not possible to make the AI adhere to procedures to allow for ID).
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By the way, Air combats without AWACS is very challenging and exciting. It needs better VID or other ID techniques before engagement not simply ask AWACS for conformation. This make such a kind of combat in the BMS be very close to the real air battle especially in the 1980’s. We now play the second campaign without any AWACS most of time. it’s tough but fun!
Not having AWACS available in the fictional second campaign is only more immersion breaking to me considering that the background of the campaign is that Israel is making a surprise attack against Egypt …. without AWACS support for the initial strikes?
Not to mention that the Egypt Air Force seems awfully alert and omnipresent for a country that is about to get ambushed! -
Not having AWACS available in the fictional second campaign is only more immersion breaking to me considering that the background of the campaign is that Israel is making a surprise attack against Egypt …. without AWACS support for the initial strikes?
Not to mention that the Egypt Air Force seems awfully alert and omnipresent for a country that is about to get ambushed!That depends on what difficulty level you want. The original second campaign’s setup(weapon,equipment,support) is reasonable according to the historical research thanks to the ITO 1980’s DEV team:D
I and my friends want more challenges than the original so i add AIM-9L to the EAF’s F-16s and restrict the use of AWACS and AIM-9L in the blue side that make red force more advanced than blue. We want boost our air combat skills and get more fun :eek: The missson planner have to set up a reasonable ROE due to the lack of AWACS and plots rigorously follow that ROE. i want my teammates to play like this;)Yeah, i agree with the idea that " Egypt Air Force seems awfully alert and omnipresent for a country that is about to get ambushed in the fictional second campaign" i think you can restrict the EAF’s E-2Cs and decrease the number of SAM battalions or ground forces so as to make it less powerful than Israel if you want.
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The Mitla pass in Sinai and the nearby bridges that cross into Suez were important objectives on the Suez Crisis, but these do not exist in the theater yet. I think there is a road and maybe even a bridge, but there is no link for ground units to move across this area. Can objectives, roads and routes from Sinai into Egypt proper please be fixed as part of an update in the future?
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Not to mention that the Egypt Air Force seems awfully alert and omnipresent for a country that is about to get ambushed!
I think that boils down more to how Falcon 4’s Campaign handles ATO and the Like. It begins running the second you hit “Go”, So actually doing a First Strike Scenario might not be possible without some Mission Commander shenanigans.
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The Mitla pass in Sinai and the nearby bridges that cross into Suez were important objectives on the Suez Crisis, but these do not exist in the theater yet. I think there is a road and maybe even a bridge, but there is no link for ground units to move across this area.
You sure about that??
C9
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I could not find a Mitla Pass political objective or anything similar for ground units to move toward and hold.
Also, I’m not an expert in this area, but when I was hacking around in a TE using this theater, I could not make ground units advance East-West through this area, they wanted to go around a longer way, northward. I can look again and provide more detail if that would be helpful. Also possibly missing from Sinai is a landmark castle called “the Nakla” that might be an interesting project for someone with 3D modeling skills.
This theater still rocks, but for folks that want to explore a conflict in Sinai and Egypt proper, the Mitla pass will be pretty important. I tried to add an objective so I could offer a solution but I had to give up because I don’t have the chops yet.
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I could not find a Mitla Pass political objective or anything similar for ground units to move toward and hold.
Also, I’m not an expert in this area, but when I was hacking around in a TE using this theater, I could not make ground units advance East-West through this area, they wanted to go around a longer way, northward.
I know whats in there. Mitla Pass wouldn’t have a political object as it’s not a City, Town, or Village. It’s a a Pass through mountains. A Junction or Highway would be more proper.
The route and the bridges from the Pass to Suez you are talking about are present in the FreeFalcon version of ITO2. Why they took that route out is beyond me. There is also Bridges across the Canal to get into Suez in that version.
Above is a pic of what is in there. The lower red box is where the missing bridges should be. The upper red box is the only bridge access to Suez. The yellow lines are all the missing ground links. The black lines are the existing ground links.
The reason I asked if you were sure is because there is actually a way into Suez, but yes it is North of the Pass.
And once again not sure why they’d remove those as it was my work from FF that they used and pretty much left that stuff as it was, but after looking at it several times in the past few months, they did change some ground links that really didn’t make any sense.
Anyway, it’s easily fixable. I can fix it in a few minutes if you’re interested.
Cheers,
C9
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Very awesome and much appreciated! I’d love to have this fixed but I’m sure everyone else would also. Maybe the best way for everyone is for you to work with Krause’s team and/or anyone that is releasing a new version of ITO in the near future. That way, this can be fixed for everyone instead of just me. Many Thanks!
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It’s already fixed. I will release it in the next day or two to the public. There’s no need for anyone else to get involved!!
C9
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ITO terrain and road network are truely great job in falcon modding history.
Adding historical 1967/73 campaigns should make the most of it.