Soooo, I see we've got working VSTOL and a Harrier in game…
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Anyone planning on updating or working on that Falklands theatre?
Just a thought, I’ve had my FRS.1 model sat around for ages and nowhere for it to fly…
In all seriousness though I see the PMC one never really got off the ground, although it looked like there was some work done on it by a few of our esteemed colleagues on this forum, and I can also see the Guam theatre looks like it has been relatively successful, and would be a good indicator of a small theatre being worked on by the community.
It also seems like (and I’ve only skimmed the relative threads at the moment) that carrier/naval ops are working to an extent in 4.33, and it also seems (again only to a brief glance) that the DB has been cleaned up and the general folder structures of 4.33 are more theatre friendly?
With the current unknown status of Jet Thunder, and no one else offering anything else in this specific genre of air combat, maybe there might be an interest there in the eyes of the BMS community to create this theatre and do it some justice?
I appreciate the following caveats - yes it’s an F16 sim, yes there are lots of theatres being worked on, yes there is a massive learning curve for terrain/campaign/model issues etc etc), but it’s a particular area of interest to me.
thoughts and suggestions welcome
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historical falkland dev board here…
http://tactical.nekromantix.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=37&sid=1bfc864d49d881cb37ae7a248500c501
please show your FRS1 model. i’m interested.
with new FM code, harrier should fly much better now. -
hi ccc, yes I followed the progress (or not :P) of that falklands mod with interest.
My original FRS1 model was designed for FlightGear, back in 2009ish, although (as with most things) it never got round to being finished as such, and is certainly not BMS ready by a long chalk.
moody 3ds max shots
topshot
in game (flightgear) shot - I seem to recall I’d got as far as rotating the nozzles and I’d written the FM for it - it was a lot of fun to fly (if tricky), although I’d spent so long making the VTOL aspects work, the normal flying characteristics were way off.
I’d also started work on a cockpit (which I can’t find a picture of now, typically) - I managed to get hold of a chap called Nick Greenall who has written some modelling books on the Harrier and has some extensive cockpit notes about both the FRS1 and FA2, and also was lucky enough to have some correspondence with David Morgan DSC who wrote ‘Hostile Skies’ about his experiences flying SHARs in the Falklands, who gave me some good information about the cockpit.
I’m a software developer by profession, and although I’ve not had a lot of time for sim flying recently I’d be interested in seeing what resources were available for a possible Falklands theatre and of course offering my own assistance, 3d modelling, scripting or whatever!
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FRS1 looks great.
FYI falkland theater files form PMC site or based on PMC falkland cannot be used for bms mod development…means somebody has to start from scratch.
ya’ll have to wait some capable guy take the job first. -
Thanks, I can see your FRS1 and Carrier on the low poly models thread (I’ve asked about the usefulness of the ski-ramp on the end of your carrier).
Regarding the original PMC theatre, I thought as much - I’m aware of the PMC/BMS relationship and history. Would that extend to any of your models that were/have been used in PMC theatres?
I’ve had a play in the past with the dem2terrain tools with varying levels of success. Maybe getting a falklands terrain set up would be an interesting project for me for 3-4 ‘falcon’ weeks lol
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Would that extend to any of your models that were/have been used in PMC theatres?
no.
I’ve had a play in the past with the dem2terrain tools with varying levels of success. Maybe getting a falklands terrain set up would be an interesting project for me for 3-4 ‘falcon’ weeks lol
that sounds great. shouldn’t be too hard … i knew experinced theater makers can build a basic one overnight…of course not me.
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Ranger822 over at Freefalcon had a partially working Falklands theater before FF folded.
I haven’t got any idea of how to get a hold of him at this point so unfortunately I reckon it’s a start from scratch product unless someone can track him down. I recall he had a LOT of the raw materials done for it already.
I’ve given thought to a Falklands theater but from a campaign engine standpoint I’m just not sure how well it would work. It certainly wouldn’t be very historical. It might be interesting for TE’s or multiplayer.
Sadly, I think there are better theater candidates for Falcon than Falklands.
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I would completely agree regarding a campaign - as far as I’m aware there is no way of achieving amphibious landings, but as you say interesting TE’s would be possible, and having VTOL in 4.33 just adds that element of ‘wouldn’t it be nice if…’
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I would completely agree regarding a campaign - as far as I’m aware there is no way of achieving amphibious landings, but as you say interesting TE’s would be possible, and having VTOL in 4.33 just adds that element of ‘wouldn’t it be nice if…’
Not true.
As well, I put out a STOVL mod for the F35 for Open Falcon (It was a little tricky to fly, it was based on the little bit of Helo code that was working ). I don’t remember applying it to the Harriers. BUT if the Harrier is now working in 4.33……hmmmm!!!
As far as building the theater from scratch:
4 Falcon minutes……LOL
demer
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Thanx D, you know I’m calling you LOL!
Btw, please create new islands with airbase at left upper and right upper corners, to provide operation bases for Argentina AF and RAF Vulcan.
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Interesting addition
As far as a campaign would go, the early part of the war the Argentinian forces had control of the islands, launched long range missions from Rio Grande, the task force were stationed ostensibly outside max exocet range of an Etendard, and SHARs from 800 and 801 NAS launched CAPs over Stanley and carried out some bombing of argentinian troop positions around the airport.
I was thinking about how a Campaign objective that didn’t involve land forces, could involve getting air superiority in order to allow British forces to land on the islands - destroy x enemy aircraft and remove the enemy carrier from the game - for the Argentinian forces the campaign objective would be to destroy one of the two carriers of the task force - that way there wouldn’t actually be any ground v ground battles going on, it would be a primarily air battle between land based argentinian forces, an argentinian carrier force south west of the islands and the british fleet to the east.
Doable? You would, as ccc suggests, need to include at least some of the east coast of Argentina - I would have thought to make a flyable Vulcan mission (that wasn’t 24 hours long) you could possibly script a TE starting on the east of the map, but wouldn’t be possible as part of a campaign.
I had a play with dem2terrain and monsters terrain editor last night, but with mixed results I’ll crack on tonight with it.
about this size?
that’s about what I was working towards last night.
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various campaign settings have been considered in past years…
of course, end game condition could be set as blue or red air force(or land, sea force) lower then 50% or so. IIRC in F4AF carrier ships can be set as a target, destroyed and game over.
BUT… after so many years… i favored a small map coverage as Demer posted. more fun comes from ground war… and three key obj are St. Carlos, Goose green, and Stanley/Stanley airport/Stanley port. if campaign maker could set ground war limited to east falkland, ground units moving along the three key obj… i’d say it’s a big success.
PMC has a 128 mod as you posted… just too big and boring to fly.
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various campaign settings have been considered in past years…
of course, end game condition could be set as blue or red air force(or land, sea force) lower then 50% or so. IIRC in F4AF carrier ships can be set as a target, destroyed and game over.
BUT… after so many years… i favored a small map coverage as Demer posted. more fun comes from ground war… and three key obj are St. Carlos, Goose green, and Stanley/Stanley airport/Stanley port. if campaign maker could set ground war limited to east falkland, ground units moving along the three key obj… i’d say it’s a big success.
PMC has a 128 mod as you posted… just too big and boring to fly.
Well hold on there a dang minute Chang.
An amphib unit set as Armoured can control\own an Objective in a campaign, that would satisfy the .Tri. Remember that ONLY armoured units can do this per Code.
As well, re-typing the LAV’s and then putting them up against an M1A1 tank battalion is NOT going to work……LOL!!!
BUT, putting them up against a CAV Unit re-type as armoured does…;)To get them to move from sea to land is the easy part.
We have demonstrated this same concept in GUAM a year or so ago…it works
(The PATH as a Dot on the tile wireframe)demer
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Well, I think the war should focus on ground fighting. The climax should be capturing Stanley.
As for GU crossing the sea, I’ve demonstrated sea-texture-with-path data tile in PMC kurile board…yes GU can move on water from kurile to Japan Hokkaido. Just looks odd.
Another idea is, moving-DPRK bunker. In Korea DMZ, big bunker holds lots GU…if bunker could move, or show up at some beachheads, with 3d model of LCMS/LCU…should look better.
Anyway, I’d suggest work on east falkland ground war first. If Brits GU can fight along the single route st Carlos-goose green-Stanley, that’s more than enough.
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Hello all.
Been having a play with dem2terrain and Monsters excellent TerrainEditor, but I’m struggling to get my l2 theatres into the Add On folder I’ve created in the Data directory.
All tdf files correct, theater.lst has added Falklands so I can select it in the Theater selection, but when it loads the terrain I get a crash. Crash log tells me -
================================== CRASHLOG =====================================
Falcon BMS.exe caused an EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION in:
0000000004531E4C Falcon BMS.exe, TerrainLevel::Setup()+332 byte(s), d:\wip\bms\svn\source\releases-4.33\graphics\bluebox\terrain\terrainlevel.cpp, line 53
Exception handler called in UnhandledExceptionHandler.
Write to location 0000000000000003 caused an access violation.
Bytes at CS:RIP: C7 04 25 03 00 00 00 03 00 00 00 33 D2 44 8D 42SO I think it’s something to do with the way I’ve created the terrain originally. I’ve searched on here and on PMC and I’m pretty sure I’m missing a simple step. Is this crash to do with the creation of those other terrain files like the ones that appear in the terrain folder in the Israel Theatre (which is the structure I’m using as a template).
When creating a new theatre, I should use the l2 and o2 and mea files that have been created by dem2Terrain and overwrite the existing l2 o2 files, delete the other terrain files and then this should enable me to launch the theatre, create a TE and overfly the terrain, shouldn’t it? Regardless of Campaign folder or map file?
Apologies if I’m missing something obvious.
edit - is there a naming convention I’m missing? If I name my files ‘falklands.l2’ instead of ‘theater.l2’ does that make a difference?
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The name should be theater.L2/O2/MEA/map.
It seems that you deleted (or not added) theater.map file.
You can copy and paste from Korea then edit in Terrain Editor.Your terrain folder should include:
theater.l2
theater.o2
theater.mea
theater.map
The rest is automatically generating at boot Falcon. -
Thanks Eghi for the swift reply.
creating the map file from dem2terrain (and ignoring the palette file issue) I’m now getting the crash on, surprise surprise,
================================== CRASHLOG =====================================
Falcon BMS.exe caused an EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION in:
0000000004556611 Falcon BMS.exe, TMap::LoadColorTable()+177 byte(s), d:\wip\bms\svn\source\releases-4.33\graphics\terrain\tmap.cpp, line 266+33 byte(s)
Exception handler called in UnhandledExceptionHandler.
Write to location 0000000000000003 caused an access violation.
Bytes at CS:RIP: C7 04 25 03 00 00 00 03 00 00 00 F3 0F 10 15 6CSo it seems, unlike the PMC tutorial and forums, you do need a valid pal file when you create the map file?
TerrainEditor export pal file from default korea folder does not seem to create a valid ‘pal’ file that I can use with dem2Terrain when creating a theater.map
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Did anyone make an attempt to contact Ranger822 regarding what was already accomplished on Falklands. He was heavy involved in building this theater and I think got it pretty far. Why to waste all that Dev work or why not try to invite him in?
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Did anyone make an attempt to contact Ranger822 regarding what was already accomplished on Falklands. He was heavy involved in building this theater and I think got it pretty far. Why to waste all that Dev work or why not try to invite him in?
Don’t think so, can you???
I’ll try his tele tonite.
In any event I will upload a starter for us, in case we cannot obtain his workdemer
Starter in and flying -
Once I saw the Harrier I was wondering where this theater was… I am watching…