What are the ramifications of bombing civilian cities in the BMS campaign?
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Thank you so much! Very interesting. Here’s a TL;DR of what I got from it:
Naval Units
The naval side of Falcon4 is still in a very unfinished state, though some progress has been made. There still exists a hierarchical structure for naval units, but the layers in that structure (AFAIK) isn’t defined with names. The top-level unit appears to be based around the “capital ship” which controls it.
Beach landings can also be modeled by having ground units appear as reinforcements in coastal areas. Transporting ground units over water using ships has not been coded for, even though some parts of this facility appear to be in place
HQ
It is unknown what role HQ units have in the campaign other than to provide a high value target for the enemy. As more is discovered it is hoped to update the details for this unit type along with the others.
IADS
Any modern country with an air defense system will more than likely have an Integrated Air Defense System (IADS) which basically is a countrywide network of Early Warning (EW), Surface to Air Missile (SAM) and Anti-Aircraft Artillery (AAA). Each unit in the IADS is connected by various communications methods to each other so that a radar contact picked up by a detector in the network has it’s information relayed to the other units and to Command and Control Centers (CCC) so that appropriate action can be taken. Airfields and combat aircraft can also be thought of as part of the IADS as they may have fighters scrambled to intercept any intruders.
This system is modeled in Falcon4 to a certain extent where an inbound enemy aircraft is deemed to be non-detected until it falls within the range of a detector within the theater. It is then flagged as spotted and appropriate actions are taken to shoot it down; either by vectoring in interceptors, by launching SAMs or firing AAA (or a combination of all three).
Probably the largest thing I got from the text is this:
Below is a list of objective types in rough order of priority:
CCC (Command, Control and Communication)
IADS
Airfields
Army Bases
Naval bases/docks
Bridges
Power Stations
Factories
Depots
Cities
Towns
Villages
Still not much in regards to the infrastructure itself, but this is good for overlaying the technical aspects of planning. Wish there was something that detailed factories / supply lines / nuke plants / etc and how they impact the campaign.
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Sadly supply is not modeled as level to make worth attack the power stations of any other facilities related to supply. Another problem the GUs dies very fast and they never get resupply, only squadrons. This leads alway where lots of AC hunting at the end for a very few GU.
Is is planned to change this So as long as a battalion exist IMHO should give change to be resupplied to keep fresh the war. In first step very drastic changes can be done just for testing to examine the conception.
Open falcon4.aii
At the bottom you will find the line
RelSquadBonus = 4.0
Change the value from 4.0 to say 2.0. AFAIK, this number is the squadron to ground units ressuply ratio. The default value means that squads will get ressuplied 4 times compared to ground units.
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I wish I can get a dev comment in here about the campaign’s inner workings. There’s so much unknown, and I just want some raw numbers.
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Yeah check out the extensive support links Arty has posted. Regarding the campaigns, if it’s too easy set the challenge rating higher to Veteran and then Ace. The DPRK strong campaigns offer even more non-stop red aircraft so go there too. I task solo F15C and F16 dca missions with one minute on station time and go after the reds as they come in wave after wave. There are so many of them I could not imagine it boring even for a seasoned Falconer. And again, by far the greatest challenge is to manage the ATO including moving your ground forces. For me achieving the fastest victory while minimizing my losses and utilizing all the various aircraft capabilities available is very rewarding. @ajthenoob:
Yep, I did that first in my Tiger Spirit campaign. DPRK airforce is completely destroyed, and they have no planes in the air right now. However I disregarded the bridges etc (this is my first campaign btw) and now have to play cleanup with their ground forces.
Problem is now that my forces won’t move in, they just sit there. All DPRK nuke plants are down and a considerable amount of factories are destroyed. It’s extremely annoying to have my forces sit there while the remaining DPRK tanks roll into small cities in the middle of North Korea.
This is in the morning of my second day, is progress being made?
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Think this through; what are the greatest threats? Answer is enemy airbases launching aircraft that are trying to shut down your airbases and destroy your ground forces. Next;; How do I shut them down? answer is until night arrives and you can task stealth aircraft you have to clear SAM’s from attack ingress corroders to attack the airbases and protect them from enemy fighters. You may not be able to attack the airbases as there are too many fighters in the way. So put up a stiff all hands on deck barcap first, roll back the sams covering your flot early and attrite the red airforce. If the red ground forces are 20 miles from your airbases you better hit them simultaneously too. Use each available squadron for what it’s made for and overwhelmingly you will understand why the F16 is the focus of Falcon. Adjust loadouts and altitudes of strikes etc. Labels off. Good luck.@ajthenoob:
Thank you so much! Very interesting. Here’s a TL;DR of what I got from it:
Naval Units
The naval side of Falcon4 is still in a very unfinished state, though some progress has been made. There still exists a hierarchical structure for naval units, but the layers in that structure (AFAIK) isn’t defined with names. The top-level unit appears to be based around the “capital ship” which controls it.
Beach landings can also be modeled by having ground units appear as reinforcements in coastal areas. Transporting ground units over water using ships has not been coded for, even though some parts of this facility appear to be in place
HQ
It is unknown what role HQ units have in the campaign other than to provide a high value target for the enemy. As more is discovered it is hoped to update the details for this unit type along with the others.
IADS
Any modern country with an air defense system will more than likely have an Integrated Air Defense System (IADS) which basically is a countrywide network of Early Warning (EW), Surface to Air Missile (SAM) and Anti-Aircraft Artillery (AAA). Each unit in the IADS is connected by various communications methods to each other so that a radar contact picked up by a detector in the network has it’s information relayed to the other units and to Command and Control Centers (CCC) so that appropriate action can be taken. Airfields and combat aircraft can also be thought of as part of the IADS as they may have fighters scrambled to intercept any intruders.
This system is modeled in Falcon4 to a certain extent where an inbound enemy aircraft is deemed to be non-detected until it falls within the range of a detector within the theater. It is then flagged as spotted and appropriate actions are taken to shoot it down; either by vectoring in interceptors, by launching SAMs or firing AAA (or a combination of all three).
Probably the largest thing I got from the text is this:
Below is a list of objective types in rough order of priority:
CCC (Command, Control and Communication)
IADS
Airfields
Army Bases
Naval bases/docks
Bridges
Power Stations
Factories
Depots
Cities
Towns
Villages
Still not much in regards to the infrastructure itself, but this is good for overlaying the technical aspects of planning. Wish there was something that detailed factories / supply lines / nuke plants / etc and how they impact the campaign.
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@Arty If you have any of those discussions let me know. I also remember in the AF campaigns there was extra info like “Initiative” and “Player Rating” as well as “helo count” and “APCs” whereas BMS groups it all together in “ground forces” and “Air”
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I wish I can get a dev comment in here about the campaign’s inner workings. There’s so much unknown, and I just want some raw numbers.
It’s actually quite complicated. And don’t doubt for a moment, even though Falcon has been around since Dec 1998, that there are still things that are in the gray area and still not completely known at this time.
I understand your wanting to know and to gain the knowledge of all the inner workings, but I wouldn’t worry about that and all the raw numbers.
I doubt very much you’re gonna get a definitive answer to your questions on these specific subjects. That’s not a knock on the devs, it’s just they have a LOT other things to do and pay attention to.
C9
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@Cloud:
It’s actually quite complicated. And don’t doubt for a moment, even though Falcon has been around since Dec 1998, that there are still things that are in the gray area and still not completely known at this time.
I understand your wanting to know and to gain the knowledge of all the inner workings, but I wouldn’t worry about that and all the raw numbers.
I doubt very much you’re gonna get a definitive answer to your questions on these specific subjects. That’s not a knock on the devs, it’s just they have a LOT other things to do and pay attention to.
C9
Yeah I heard the maker of the dynamic campaign say something like he’d never do it again it was that hard. However with all the changes in the code, and tweaks to the campaign system I’m sure someone knows something about how the intricacies work in BMS campaign.
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The very very best thing about the CP is the Dynamic part. Totally unscripted. Not sure what you will get from raw numbers, and like C9 said, your probably not going to get that.
Not sure what you need this for other than to satisfy curiosity. Knowing the intricacies of the CP would be a spoiler to me.
I don’t think you are going to find an answer here, but I wish you the best of luck in your quest.
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Knowing the intricacies of the CP would be a spoiler to me.
Not really. It’s better than being left in the dark not knowing if nuke plants do anything at all, or how impactful CCC centers have on the enemy’s knowledge, etc
I don’t NEED exact numbers, just an idea of how things fit together. Coming from a strategy game background its important to know exact details just for knowing them too. I remember in Allied Force there were many more graphs showing numbers of each vehicle for both sides, etc and it was really cool just to see how you are turning the tide of battle.
It’s good to know how well the battle is doing.
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I wish I can get a dev comment in here about the campaign’s inner workings. There’s so much unknown, and I just want some raw numbers.
raw numbers on what?
About campaign and how all they interact - interconnect is a totally hive of percentages and links.
This links to this to that etc this is affected by x% so the rest in hierarchy alsoAbout the discussions well they are from the Frugals days back to Open Falcon many in FreeFalcon forum all scattered…
Some are also scattered here: http://tactical.nekromantix.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=63
knock your self out with Tons of reading.
Oh sorry I forgot. You can always get the old code and read the AI IIRC section.
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Huh. Looks like most of them don’t know either. Thanks for the links, I’ll dig there.
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Sure they don’t. Only the code knows.
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Shame. I guess since you are experienced in F4 may I ask which Korea campaign scenario is your favorite? And how do you tackle it?
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Shame. I guess since you are experienced in F4 may I ask which Korea campaign scenario is your favorite? And how do you tackle it?
Ask that question to Cptmtge. He’s a veteran flyer and was a beta tester with FreeFalcon. He’s very knowledgeable about tackling the different Korean campaigns.
C9
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First thanx for your kind words but am not that experienced as you might think. Many here confuse this and some are irritated by my behavior and posts. I just recall things up and try to contribute where ever I can not so successfully many times, not to prove I know all but to reply to others or make others that know more or the right thing to correct me and contribute to the questions.
Many many things in Falcon are buried and many guys that know hold that knowledge and don’t contribute it, I’m not saying they do it on purpose but this is how it is… so the one interested must go search in the dark and get burn just in searching.
This forum is and should be the common ground for our quests in falcon… so here information should be released and published so all have the chance to take the baton and continue the race of the never dying falcon…So after this short Robin Hoods message… :lol:
Well KTO haven’t flawn for years now. So I will not be a good judge of it.
Also never went that much to how it works cause something like that would look like a hack - cheat for my standards.
Since I started Online I never got back.
At some point Korea campaigns seemed boring. BMS team changed that.In my lonewolf days I enjoyed very much the ITO campaigns. The action and the challenge was way high and demanding for my experience. Have in mind i’m not that skilled.
The only tactic that worked for me was hit the dirt. -
Start with the 3 stock Korean campaigns. So much to learn I cannot adequately explain it all now. Many players here also learn from joining online wings that fly against each other here and there is an incredible wealth of knowledge available if you use your search button. Once I learned by trial and error how to manage the ATO, and ground units to a lesser degree, the sim became incredibly fun for me.@Cloud:
Ask that question to Cptmtge. He’s a veteran flyer and was a beta tester with FreeFalcon. He’s very knowledgeable about tackling the different Korean campaigns.
C9