Read the Manual eh?? = useless so far… because I did not look hard enough
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Just for reference then, I am a qualified bogan, beach bum and beer guzzler…
Well that’s my new word for the day :mrgreen:
Impressive qualifications; Aussie further education?
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Click here -> BMS-Secret-Knowledge-Collection
It also works nicely with your standard pdf reader
Regarding most of the settings & switches, you wont break the AC if you just play around with them. This is how I discovered difference between SPOT & SCAN for the AIM-9, for ex, or most of the DED functions. Reading the manual was useful to further my understanding, or if I did not have any clue what would happen. And even if you do break the AC, you can always start the mission again.
As DJ said, people here dont necessarily have the will and patience to answer if every single new user ask every single small question about every single setting.
As for the keyboard/joystick layout…. at first all you really need is to map the HOTAS functions (BMS-Dash1, sidestick : p50 to 52, & throttle p25 to 27), all the rest can be done by clicking around the pit. After time you will know what cockpit switch/button you will want in quick access directly on your keyboard.
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Regarding most of the settings & switches, you wont break the AC if you just play around with them. This is how I discovered difference between SPOT & SCAN for the AIM-9, for ex, or most of the DED functions. Reading the manual was useful to further my understanding, or if I did not have any clue what would happen. And even if you do break the AC, you can always start the mission again.
That’s one of the most accurate statements I’ve read in a long time. Lots of knowledge of the workings of the system comes from taking previous experience in simplified earlier sims, and a rough idea of how things might work, then seeing how they work in the BMS Falcon. The sense of achievement I feel when I discover a new feature is as big a buzz as gunning down an Ace F-16, or even better an accomplished H2H opponent such as Kid Vicious (speculation here!). Like cruz says, if it all goes tits-up after pushing buttons and you kill your chassis, no problem to start again. If you do something and are not quite sure why it did it, dig into the manual to try to find out why.
Great post l3crusader! Salute!
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Now imagine a new pilot in training sitting in a classroom and he asks a teacher a question about something…. Do you think the teacher’s standard reply is “read the manual” ???
Now imagine the new pilot was asked to read a chapter in his flight manual in preparation for the class. Do you think the teacher’s standard reply is “aw, you didn’t have time to glance at the reading material? Let me stop the entire class and catch you up.”
As someone who has spent a lot of time in classrooms learning a lot of complex stuff, I can tell you for a fact the answer is no. Teachers who “are here to help” will usually provide an answer to the question, not avoid the question with “read the manual”…
As someone who continues to spend a lot of time in the classroom, I expect my students to practice due diligence and be prepared when they enter the classroom. Now, if after they demonstrate that they have made an effort to research their question, but they still have difficulty with the concepts, then an explanation that benefits the entire class would be proffered.
So now let me say this… and this is not attitude, this is fact. When someone comes to this forum, frustrated and tired of trying to figure something out, and you tell them to “Read the Manual”, or in some other forum members language, “Read the F’ing Manual”, you are no help… in fact, at that point, you become part of the problem as a hindrance, and a hindrance with a bad attitude.
Conversely, if one comes to this forum with the attitude that they wish to be spoon fed the contents of multiple manuals, then they are a hindrance to themselves a strain on those here who wish to assist.
You could have just told me what it stands for… one single line of text… very quick, very easy, no need for childish dictionary references or comments attempting to show me how high your horse is…
As easily as one like yourself could have typed the term into Google or the search bar of the manual/manuals.
I very much appreciate those folks who provide actual help… and I don’t forget the debt I owe to those who provide help and support when needed…
Even when the best help being offered is to read the manual?
My life philosophy says “never forget where you came from and who was with you along the way” It also says “Never forget who stepped on you”
Sounds like a barren philosophy of “tit for tat” to me. Easy enough a philosophy to follow, but in my humble opinion bereft of integrity.
Please, if you don’t want to help me, don’t participate in my threads…
Perhaps private messages are best for you then, as there is no ownership of threads in the forum as far as I know.
Cheers and best of luck learning the sim.
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Here’s a thought.
Why not focus first on flying, navigating, landing the jet?
Pete Bonanni once said learning to fly the Falcon is just your ticket to the dance, and damped if we wasn’t right.
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Here’s a thought.
Why not focus first on flying, navigating, landing the jet?
Pete Bonanni once said learning to fly the Falcon is just your ticket to the dance, and damped if we wasn’t right.
Yea just go through the training TE’s one by one, in conjunction with the tutorials made by Krause on you tube, here they are:https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL3E09AA94FF0EACEC
Also for the basic handling TE and the maneuvers such as max speed at corner you can play them in conjunction with the tutorials in your original Falcon 4 manual which is in your Docs>Falcon 4 legacy manuals>1. Falcon 4 original manual.
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@Red:
Oh, And I took the liberty to change your topic title so it is now more correct
I take it you have no idea how inappropriate your editing of my subject line is… Being that your a moderator that’s very disturbing on multiple levels. Personally, I’d be ashamed of my behavior if I did that to someone who is simply trying to learning something.
The fact is, I searched for an exact match to a specific term listed in the game and I came up with nothing. How do you expect newbies to learn if the technical terminology within the game interface does not match that within the manual?
It is unfortunate that you’re offended that your thousands of hours of work did not result in something absolutely perfect… The reality is that you could spend a million hours and it would still not be perfect… so why do you take such offense when someone has an issue finding something or understanding something? You’re obviously proud of your work, and you should be, but your expectations are unrealistic.
Here is something to think about…
How many real world F16 pilots do you think exist who simply read a manual, hopped in the aircraft, and started flying? I don’t know how much time you’ve spent in the real world learning about something technically complex but I can tell you that reading a manual to a complex piece of machinery is only about 10% of the actual educational input required to learn something of this nature.You know what’s really disturbing? Is when a moderator, and one who is directly responsible for the product in question, seems to feel the need to infer and twist the meaning of other peoples statements. I never said your thousands of hours were useless… never implied it or hinted to it. The fact that you twisted the meaning of my post, then edited the post to suit your needs says volumes.
I was reading the manual, going through the interface and searching the manual turned out to be useless in my attempt to understand something. If you’re offended by that… there’s nothing I can do… Ban me if you wish… I’ll find another game to play.
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Another way to ask (which will be probably more efficient to get a quick and good answers), saving time to ppl answering you and providing you some benefits is rather than asking : How to … What is … etc … at the first shot (of course, after reading/searching in all the available manuals and in the forum using the magic search button), ask: Please,where can I find info about …
And you will probable get some answer like: https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?22989-Unwanted-Chaff-Flare-dispensing&p=333083&viewfull=1#post333083
Advantage: you will be able to retrieve the info later, and will lean other things in the same time.
Click here -> BMS-Secret-Knowledge-Collection
If you still need explanations because you didn’t understood, of course, you are welcome here. But not every days to ask things covered by some document present in your install, and not if you didn’t made the effort to search into it carefully.
Please understand that PPL can’t spend all their free time explain things here … and maybe consider virtual squadron to find ppl to help you and teach you in live MP sessions.
And you are here since September 11th, 2015, maybe consider also that trying to know everything about combat and weapons systems in less than one month is unachievable. Take your time. It take months/years before being able to "handle F4BMS “correctly”, it is normal that you are a bit lose at the beginning.
EDIT: Additionally to manuals present into your Docs folder … here is a nice list of possible good sources of informations.
https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?5649-Articles-on-this-site
Yeah … agree … it is a lot. But who said that F4BMS is a simple shooter video game!?!
Re-Edit: Look:
https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=333137
That is the right attitude
Understood…And point taken… thank you for your response.
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…. at first all you really need is to map the HOTAS functions (BMS-Dash1, sidestick : p50 to 52, & throttle p25 to 27), all the rest can be done by clicking around the pit. After time you will know what cockpit switch/button you will want in quick access directly on your keyboard.
This!! Start here. It’s what I and several others have been saying for DAYS!! Adapt the RL HOTAS controls as closely as possible to your Saitek. Make compromises judiciously …. thoughtfully.
Also, learn to Ramp Start. There is benefit to learning where and what some of the non-HOTAS systems are. Use Reddog’s Checklists and YouTube instructional videos to help get you through developing an effective Ramp Start procedure (you can do as per Reddog’s manual alone, but you may find that other descriptions or guides offer additional explanation or clarity).
C:\Falcon BMS 4.32\Docs\Checklists & Cockpit Diagrams\F-16 Checklists\Main Checklists.pdf
That, eventually evolved to this (which was very much keyboard based), which eventually evolved to understanding and using the 3D cockpit to click the buttons and turn the knobs.
I’m not saying you should do exactly that. I’m saying learn the HOTAS and learn the Ramp Start, using the resources available and in a way that works for you, then go from there.
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I take it ……
What we have (good, bad or ugly) exists due to efforts of volunteers. If a community member finds some aspect lacking, nothing keeps them from improving it. Need a glossary of terminology or acronyms, for example? I’m sure the community would be grateful if you built one and shared it. We all contribute (or not), less or more, in ways that we find convenient to our personal circumstances. Endless complaining benefits no one.
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Sorry, but I’m with Murpy and I’m sad because of this.
When BMS4 was released I printed many docs and read it through hours. In late 2009 I was master of FF but even today I did not learned to use BMS4. Why? Because the manuals are simply terrible.
I’m not joking, the basics are better even in AF manual, and what a luck BMS4 still strongly based of RP5/SP3 times so you can use it. I still can’t recall from my mind how I can tune my radio to talk with tower and simply I have no idea where should I start to look because the totally non logical structure.
This is why I made long time ago Hungarian manual* for FF and HUN/ENG training videos.** The manual was 180 pages long but what concerned on flying, system, the cockpit were only about 100 pages and most of Hungarian users learned form that. It was very “dense” but at least had logicat structure and was supported with videos.
The structure of shipped manual(s) from my aspect simply do not fit for new players, even and old Falconer cannot use it sometimes. (At least me…)
IMHO a manual should be built that explains tha AC as a newbie would meet things. Even it is Hungarian you can see this, the manual is linked below.
1. Install & game settings
2. Basic config of game (config of HOTAS out of scope it is not for newbies who first meet with a FS, a newbie very likely does not have such serious stuff)
3. Description of the cockpit according to panels (from left to right and finally the HUD) and main instruments. Yes, as a newbie you do not have to use all of them from 0, but you always know where to look for help.
4. Takeoff, fuel management, navigation and landing and padlock in differnt modes + orientation. (+ startup)
5. Explaining the MDFs, mastermodes and override modes-
6. Basics of radar, only AA modes then using AA missiles and gun and because yo do not fly alone basic wingman commands.
7. Basic of radar, AGM modes and strike weapon usage.
8. Defensive manovers and basics how thins works in Falcon. (Do not telling anything deeply about the engine, just what a user should know about modeling what is pointless to do.)Where is this structure in manuals? I cannot see anywhere… Also you have to keep the balance between “way too deep” or way to HC. Is somwhere about a 100 pages long manual about navigation. It is far too more detailed than sohuld be. Explaing thins as way which do not exist in Falcon. As many times said Dee Jay, big part of realism depend on player. But for many players describing things as you would sit on an airliner or real F-16 is simply not useful…
Long time ago I planned to reworks for BMS4, but HUN comm. now is so small that I felt pointless and do it in ENG? I never will have time for it I have not learned BMS4… When I will learn fly well with BMS4 - God knows when…- I will use YT traning vidoes because of this. I have to rely on training videos for Krause. He talks way too late to my taste but a video can be rewinded or jumped to a point anytime and I can see how it works, at least on basic level.
*http://www.mediafire.com/view/71l2abxdhy9fejt/FreeFalcon5_magyar_2011_06_27.pdf
**A part of them is still useful for BMS4.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL485D1BC9820873D7 -
Then you might be pleased when the next version is released
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Then even you might be pleased when the next version is released
Roger. In fact I alway love at least make a quick check in Docs before I launch anything.
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Well that’s my new word for the day :mrgreen:
Impressive qualifications; Aussie further education?
Darkman, I made the honour role
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As a newbie lurker, let me chime in. I really disagree Molni. Less than a year ago, I had never flown a sim in my life. I had a general interest in military aviation, and spotted aircraft in my teens.
I started with just reading through the available manuals, like the dashes etc. Watched a few youtube videos. Just reading through the forum posts here is also very helpful (there are many very knowledgeable, constructive and instructive people around here) And than I just started flying around, tryin some buttons.
After 2 months I joined a VFS (the 31st), and this really makes a world of difference. Nothing like other people in realtime teaching you stuff. Also a great motivator for additional studying, as you don’t want to let your teammates down.
Looooong way before ever getting close to being an expert, but after half a year I was pretty confident around the jet.
Nope, there is no recipe style manual, but for me that is part of the accuracy of the sim. Or did I miss the RL learn-to-fly-a-viper cookbook?
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Bottom line is there ain’t no shortcuts to learning this sim…gawd I love it as it’s an excellent community vetting system.
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As a newbie lurker, let me chime in. I really disagree Molni. Less than a year ago, I had never flown a sim in my life. I had a general interest in military aviation, and spotted aircraft in my teens.
I started with just reading through the available manuals, like the dashes etc. Watched a few youtube videos. Just reading through the forum posts here is also very helpful (there are many very knowledgeable, constructive and instructive people around here) And than I just started flying around, tryin some buttons.
After 2 months I joined a VFS (the 31st), and this really makes a world of difference. Nothing like other people in realtime teaching you stuff. Also a great motivator for additional studying, as you don’t want to let your teammates down.
Looooong way before ever getting close to being an expert, but after half a year I was pretty confident around the jet.
Nope, there is no recipe style manual, but for me that is part of the accuracy of the sim. Or did I miss the RL learn-to-fly-a-viper cookbook?
You mentioned and “underlined” the VFS and YT videos. From your post I see just what I said. Stange. Not manual was your first information and traning source. I have so long flight sim experience that I literally jump into old HC flight sim and more or less I can fly with them after 1-2 hours….
…and yet I do not find useful manuals what I got in \docs.
I also trained for some hours a Hungarian guy, how had past flight sim experience with FF. He said the FF’s Compainion was garbage, he labelled as in a “colorful magazin” but not a useful manual. I have to say for beginners SP3 manual is also not so bad. Not as long as AF but it is very, very dense.
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Understood…And point taken… thank you for your response.
You are welcome mate. And remember … in case of big pain, do not hesitate to ask … on my side I will do my best to tell you where to find the info, or, if I have the time and if there is nothing in manuals, I will try to give you a more or less detailed answer.
Non talking about other friendsCheers!
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Bottom line is there ain’t no shortcuts to learning this sim…gawd I love it as it’s an excellent community vetting system.
I agree Mower. You honestly have to put in the time to read the manuals. If you don’t like reading the manual then do a training video search on youtube. With future iterations of this sim, the complexity is going to get more difficult.
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When BMS4 was released I printed many docs and read it through hours. In late 2009 I was master of FF but even today I did not learned to use BMS4. Why? Because the manuals are simply terrible.
Where is this structure in manuals? I cannot see anywhere…
Where is the community? Rather than starting hundreds of (never finished never ending) theaters, … where are ppl for that kind of task? Same apply to the TacRef … !
Except the F4AF conversion manual … do the community waiting for Red Dog to do the job?
Ok too late now … job is done and about to be release (3 - 4 weeks) but we are four years after the first official release. So … the entire community is guilty about the lack of proper learning/training material. Not only BMS.
EDIT: Not against you Molni, I think we are sharing the same point.