Bullseye Calculator
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Great thread Currently, Iâm still not proficient or quick at working out bullseye positions relative to myself. I cheat by setting bullseye to a main city (PâYongâyang or Wonsan) usually and I use the HSD as SOI to find the rough location of the bullseye. The technique of using the HSI is great. I tried it the other night and it took me a while, but I understood the concept. Practice, practice, practice.
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You could also just ask AWACS for a BRAA (âvector to threatâ). They do the math for you
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@RAD:
You could also just ask AWACS for a BRAA (âvector to threatâ). They do the math for you
Yeah but isnât that only for the latest call they make? And sometimes itâs not AWACS that makes the call it could be an AI pilot or a human pilot and the issue isnât a threat but some other sort of activity?
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Great thread Currently, Iâm still not proficient or quick at working out bullseye positions relative to myself. I cheat by setting bullseye to a main city (PâYongâyang or Wonsan) usually and I use the HSD as SOI to find the rough location of the bullseye. The technique of using the HSI is great. I tried it the other night and it took me a while, but I understood the concept. Practice, practice, practice.
Looking at a Korea Navigation Training Chart from 30 years ago, on the 1:500,000 (in the vernacular a â1 to 500â map/chart) there were four Bullseye locations in the ROK. They were at Kunsan Tacan [KUZ Ch 75], in the SE at Taegu Tacan [TAG Ch 125], in the NE at Kangwon Tacan [KAE Ch 108], and in the NW at Anyang Tacan [SEL Ch 98]. On the reverse side of the chart is the 1:1,000,000 (again in the vernacular a â1 to a Milâ) map/chart. On this side there are only two Bullseyes at SEL and TAG Tacans. This side has 20 NM rings extending out 200 NM (all the way to Sinuiju/Dandong on the PRC frontier).
It was pretty easy to just glance at your map (if it wasnât stuffed in your G-suit pocket or your pubs bag). We were required to fly with a local area map in our possession. We typically covered the 1 to a Mil side of the chart with clear shelf paper and cut it down to cover between 33 and 39 north latitude and 124 to 130 latitude. The 1 to a Mil side also has the Tanker Tracks we used, Aragon, Yobo, Fishnet, South Central, Honeymoon, East Beach.
Whilst in USAFE my squadron flew with UK MoD charts. They were infinitely superior to US DoD products.
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Looking at a Korea Navigation Training Chart from 30 years ago, on the 1:500,000 (in the vernacular a â1 to 500â map/chart) there were four Bullseye locations in the ROK. They were at Kunsan Tacan [KUZ Ch 75], in the SE at Taegu Tacan [TAG Ch 125], in the NE at Kangwon Tacan [KAE Ch 108], and in the NW at Anyang Tacan [SEL Ch 98]. On the reverse side of the chart is the 1:1,000,000 (again in the vernacular a â1 to a Milâ) map/chart. On this side there are only two Bullseyes at SEL and TAG Tacans. This side has 20 NM rings extending out 200 NM (all the way to Sinuiju/Dandong on the PRC frontier).
It was pretty easy to just glance at your map (if it wasnât stuffed in your G-suit pocket or your pubs bag). We were required to fly with a local area map in our possession. We typically covered the 1 to a Mil side of the chart with clear shelf paper and cut it down to cover between 33 and 39 north latitude and 124 to 130 latitude. The 1 to a Mil side also has the Tanker Tracks we used, Aragon, Yobo, Fishnet, South Central, Honeymoon, East Beach.
Whilst in USAFE my squadron flew with UK MoD charts. They were infinitely superior to US DoD products.
Awesome thanks for the info. Are you able to elaborate on procedures for changing which bullseye is active? When would it change, how would the information be relayed across pilots in the air etc?
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Awesome thanks for the info. Are you able to elaborate on procedures for changing which bullseye is active? When would it change, how would the information be relayed across pilots in the air etc?
Having 4 Bullseye points was practical for air defense exercises or Operational Readiness Inspections (ORIs). For example when the Eagles from Kadena were having an ORI they deployed two squadrons to Kwangju. As part of the deployment they simulated having to sweep against DPRK MiGs before landing. I do not know what they used for BE or even if they had AWACS support. The 8 TFW provided adversary support for the Eagles. We used Kunsan as our BE. We had GCI BE calls, no close control. It was awesomeâŚswirling contrails high over the ROK like something from the Battle of Britain. Going forward during their ORI the Eagles flew low level escort/sweep for F-4 from Taegu. On those days we used Taegu as BE. One squadron Lt was so focused on chasing down an F-4 he briefly went supersonic at 500â AGL. Of course he was oblivious UNTIL I pointed out his error (howling laughter) whilst he was regaling us with the video of his Phantom kill. Imagine our surprise when that part of his tape mysteriously erased itself before the mass tape review.
For our pre-planned strikes against targets in the DPRK, SEL was the briefed BE. It made sense based on geography. Regarding changing BE and informing airborne pilots, I never thought about it considering how little a DPRK pilot flew in a yearâŚonce a month whether they needed to or not. It was just one of the quirks about the DPRK.
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Interesting thread. This is NOT meant as an insult, but if you were a pilot like Dee-Jay would would recognize his initial graphic explanation as how we calculate a âpoint to pointâ on the HSI. That is a basic instrument flying task in which all instrument rated or military pilots are evaluated. It is a snap shot (ballpark) solution that you continue to refine as you approach the fix. You might not want to make an effort to practice due to the lack of precision, but it is a very BASIC skill of professionals. There are times when the magic stuff quits working, or you find yourself on battery power.
Having a range and bearing solution to some false precision is interesting as an exercise. But itâs not terribly useful in a dynamic environment against a moving target that was described with an approximate location in a Bullseye call. Itâs essentially measuring with a micrometer, marking with chalk, and cutting with an ax.
Assuming you have maintained some basic degree of SA (where you are in relation to BE) when the Bullseye call is made, with practice, you should know if the contact is behind or in front of your 3/9 line and the shortest direction to turn to acquire the contact with a sensor or go for separation. It is a skill once acquired you will wonder why youâve tried to make it so hard. FWIW as you gain experience in BMS you will even paint a mental picture of where friendlies are in relation to you and BE based upon their radio calls. I do this watching Youtube videos of BMS sorties.;)
RhoBee,
Is pilots such as yourself and Dee Jay that bring a bit of realism and experience to this hobby.
I thank you sir for your input.
It is really appreciated.
Pikachu -
RhoBee,
Is pilots such as yourself and Dee Jay that bring a bit of realism and experience to this hobby.
I thank you sir for your input.
It is really appreciated.
PikachuYouâre more than welcome. The USAF was very good to me. But at this point in my life I know more about flying the Airbus 319/320 or a Citabria & Super Cub. And come this April Iâll be flying a PT-22 (google it) and an L-5 for my Commemorative Air Force unit.
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Youâre more than welcome. The USAF was very good to me. But at this point in my life I know more about flying the Airbus 319/320 or a Citabria & Super Cub. And come this April Iâll be flying a PT-22 (google it) and an L-5 for my Commemorative Air Force unit.
PT-22 looks a bit more fun than an Airbus!
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PT-22 looks a bit more fun than an Airbus!
Ask Harrison Ford about it [emoji12]
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Very simple Excel tool to enable practice of bulls eye calls. Hit F9 to get the update that gives your own position and contact. You can then check your mental picture against the plot on the second sheet.
There are NO macros so it should be easy to install anywhere. It is not complex at all (and not pretty) but might be helpful to people out there.
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Works great with LibreOffice! Very cool training/testing tool!
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Very simple Excel tool to enable practice of bulls eye calls. Hit F9 to get the update that gives your own position and contact. You can then check your mental picture against the plot on the second sheet.
There are NO macros so it should be easy to install anywhere. It is not complex at all (and not pretty) but might be helpful to people out there.
RMAX,
Thanks for this useful tool!!
I am using it to practice my Bullseye proficiency
Pika -
Yeah I think that will be helpful! But let me just defend the use of computers for a moment. We rely here on computerized math, we wouldnât be chatting online without out. We wouldnât be playing a sim without it. Geez the F-16 Fighting Falcon itself relies on computerized math to the extreme (i.e. CCRP, CCIP, fly-by-wire, avionics and on and on and on). So I donât think itâs a bad idea to rely on computerized math. But I am grateful for the coaching and blank bullseye, I think it will help but I still want my computerized math. Iâll wager $50 that I can punch in four numbers quicker than you can accurately plot two contacts and figure the bearing. He who gives the range and bearing first by voice wins, because you are doing it in your head Iâll even handicap you range by 5 nm and bearing by 5 degrees whereas I must get within .1 nm and .1 degrees. The only thing is I need the formula first to prove that I can beat you to the solution
Use your HSD cursors. It SHOULD give you a bullseye readout. When youâre in cold ops and you get a new picture from Darkstar, you donât have time to use a calculator. Just DMS over to your HSD, go to centroid, and put your cursors where AWACS decs the group. Then set up your radar appropriately.
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Use your HSD cursors. It SHOULD give you a bullseye readout. When youâre in cold ops and you get a new picture from Darkstar, you donât have time to use a calculator. Just DMS over to your HSD, go to centroid, and put your cursors where AWACS decs the group. Then set up your radar appropriately.
Yeah of course if the call is out in front of you. Also if itâs very close Iâll usually know as well. The calculator I have now is friggin awesome and it doesnât take but two shakes to type in the numbers. Almost as quick as setting the QNH.
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Yeah of course if the call is out in front of you. Also if itâs very close Iâll usually know as well. The calculator I have now is friggin awesome and it doesnât take but two shakes to type in the numbers. Almost as quick as setting the QNH.
Valid itâs quicker to use a calculator, but you can see up to 160 NM behind you on the HSD in CEN.
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Valid itâs quicker to use a calculator, but you can see up to 160 NM behind you on the HSD in CEN.
Wait. Bullseye position is displayed on HSD? I better go fire up the SIM this is a revelation to me. LOL.
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Wait. Bullseye position is displayed on HSD? I better go fire up the SIM this is a revelation to me. LOL.
Out of interest back in the day how did anyone know where the hell they were in relation to Bullseye over Vietnam? Was it old school china pencil and paper? I assume so.
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Out of interest back in the day how did anyone know where the hell they were in relation to Bullseye over Vietnam? Was it old school china pencil and paper? I assume so.
Like we still do today on many a/c ⌠you have drawn chart with your track and the bulls. You know where you are ⌠you know your posit bulls.
Wait. Bullseye position is displayed on HSD? I better go fire up the SIM this is a revelation to me. LOL.
RTFM ⌠you might discover many other âgoodiesâ.
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Hey Dee-Jay. NO!!!