Israel 1980s - UOAF edition
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Our in-game OOB now matches very closely to the real thing.
http://www.aeroflight.co.uk/waf/aa-mideast/israel/af/orbat4-10.htm
Squadrons, numbers of aircraft, and the correct bases. Pretty cool.
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Aeroflight is often a bit out of date, which isn’t too bad for this theater but my main go-to source for current ORBAT info is Scramble’s Orbat section:
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Nice. Thing is we found the Aeroflight page after everything was complete, all gathered from other sources, and what we had lined right up with their ORBAT.
Now if we could just get the AI to play out the war realistically…
For instance, in reality Israel never flew into Syrian airspace, or attacked airbases/military installations in Syria. But in BMS it’s a free-for all. I guess the player can set the PAKs and conduct the war how he chooses.
We’ll at least get the ground forces pushing toward Beirut. -
Well that’s the drawback of a dynamic campaign engine. You can put all the chess pieces in the right spots but you don’t really know or control how the game will unfold.
In order to fully re-enact the 1982 conflict, a scripted approach (e.g. DCS) would work better or otherwise set-piece TEs. But as a campaign, you’ll come to a point where you can put all the pieces in the right place and then let go and see what happens.
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Regarding fictional campaigns, have you considered a scenario that would see Iran join into the campaign against Israel, deploying their assets into Lebanon and Syria?
That would bring a lot of other interesting things into play … Not least of them Tomcats, F-5s, F-4s, Mirage F1s, etc.
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Yeah that’s a real interesting idea actually.
For the third campaign, This is what I was thinking:
In our alternate reality, the peace talks after the Yom Kippur war didn’t work out and Israel never withdrew from the Sinai. The Soviet Union continues to support Egypt.
Very soon after Israel obtains F-16’s in 1980, Egypt and Syria simultaneously surprise-attack Israel again. So you’ve got two fronts: Egypt at the Suez canal and Syria pushing through the Golan heights. Basically the October War II with more modern weapons. Not sure about the feasibility of this in BMS, but we’ll see. We need to learn alot about manipulating the trigger files first. -
I like the idea of throwing Iran into the mix. Just a whole coalition of Muslim countries trying to swallow Israel and you’ve got to fend them all off.
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If that becomes too complicated, sticking to a battle against a Soviet backed Egypt (no Egyptian F-16’s/western weapons) with the FLOT at the Suez canal.
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Guys who have tried the theater, do you have reports on performance/FPS?
We tend to use lots of units.
This would definitely have to be scaled back in a two-front war. -
if i play Israel 1980s, i will add soviet to join the war
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Yeah that’s a real interesting idea actually.
For the third campaign, This is what I was thinking:
In our alternate reality, the peace talks after the Yom Kippur war didn’t work out and Israel never withdrew from the Sinai. The Soviet Union continues to support Egypt.
Very soon after Israel obtains F-16’s in 1980, Egypt and Syria simultaneously surprise-attack Israel again. So you’ve got two fronts: Egypt at the Suez canal and Syria pushing through the Golan heights. Basically the October War II with more modern weapons. Not sure about the feasibility of this in BMS, but we’ll see. We need to learn alot about manipulating the trigger files first.Great idea!
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Hey Gas, quick thought. Not sure how much you can do about cockpits and aircraft, but it seems to me that the Kfir being a Mirage variant would be more at home with the Mirage 2000 cockpit. Given that the hardpoints are as far as I can tell the same, that would make the over the shoulder glances feel less out of place when you fly it.
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Yeah good point Tirak, will try that out
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Don’t build two-fronts cam, cam AI gets confused. We’ve learned the lesson from ITO2 mod.
Old kfir can use a10 pit. Only latest modernized model fits m2k pit.
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I’m not sure I understand, are you saying that there’s a technical limitation or that it’s not era appropriate? If it’s a technical limitation, that’s a real shame. If it has to do with era appropriateness, then I have to say I’d prefer the Mirage 2000 cockpit to the A-10 if for no other reason than when looking over my shoulder I’d see an aircraft at least vaguely resembling the Kfir i’m pretending to fly in, vs seeing the broad flat wings and top mounted engines of the Hog.
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No worry.
I mean using a10 interior main cockpit.
We’ve dedicated cockpit-wing model for kfir. -
Ah, bummer about the campaign limitation……
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I like the idea of throwing Iran into the mix. Just a whole coalition of Muslim countries trying to swallow Israel and you’ve got to fend them all off.
Iran could be like a Day 2 or Day 3 conditional add-on, deploying forces to Syria as Syria is their known ally. (In fact, Iranian forces deployed to Iraq and Syria to conduct combat operations against ISIS). It would be awesome to go toe-to-toe with Tomcats, F-5s, Phantoms…. (Mirage F1s didn’t appear of course until 1991 as they are all former Iraqi Air Force planes, the same goes for the Soviet equipment such as MiG-29s, SU-25s, Su-24s, etc.)
I’ll report on FPS later as I’ve just purchased an i7 3770 combo as upgrade for my old Q9550.
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So I downloaded the latest version and the 88 campaign no longer uses flyable F-16Cs? Only F-16D? Seems like AI can still use the C. Can you add another squadron that uses the C?
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I’m not sure about that problem, but in the current gitlab build 9a59e91b there are two F-16C squadrons in 88, the 110th and 117th, so it will be fixed soon. If you’d like it to be fixed immediately, use gitlab.