Target Pod use to identify air targets?
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I was wondering if it is possible to aim the target pod on locked on air targets to identify them. Does someone know if it is possible in the real F16 and maybe in BMS too?
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Yes and yes.
Put your TGP in A-A mode instead of A-G mode. Lock a target on your FCR. Zoom & set to narrow on TGP, look at target for PID. -
also for positive ID in good day light and good viz - put it in TVx4
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Why not have a look at the Targeting Pod chapter in the TO BMS1-F16CM-34-1-1 manual? You’ll find it in your \Falcon BMS 4.33 U1\Docs\Falcon BMS Manuals folder.
1.9.7.5.1 A-A Mode on page 102 might be of interest to you.
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I’ve learned that initial cadre at panther weapons school is also developing this tactic because most of the new tactics staying LO and out of the fray isn’t using the tactical fighter as the radar emitter or even the shooter. The aircraft uses a number of non radar sensors to acquire track on the airborne target and supplement the picture and asses weapon affect. In simpler terms, the panthers are the forward air controller, they supplement the awacs and have the ability to dip in, in a perfect world though they establish the shot for the raptor, the eagle, or the viper nearby.
The b-21 and the f-35 are both supposed to be able to sling an einstein box or 4 and work as super nodes in a very EWS exotic non linear war, so imagine in about 2030 people won’t be hyping the fact it can fire missiles at mach 4, it will be the fact it can cripple an economy from 60,000 without firing a shot. There are already those disney/lockheed concepts being shown at disneyworld of the superjammer variants of the f-35, which is basically what you would imagine a growler from 2050 to be and do.
murrica
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Works in the F-4 and the f-18
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Thanks people for the replies. Well, now the TGP works just fine for me. No idea why I couldn’t get it to work before.
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As said by the others, it is possible, but I have often found that visibility is very (/ too?) limited in BMS, and quite regularly, you won’t see anything on your TGP until you are within 20NM already. Switching between WHOT/BHOT/TV-mode and zoom doesn’t change anything.
At that point, using the TGP to get a VID is too little too late already, and because of issues with textures / alphas (?), you’ll see textures and especially the engines flickering through the aircraft, making it harder than necessary to see if the contact is hot or dragging.
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24NM is max range for objects AG or AA to become visible in the TGP in any mode, in my experience at least.
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As said by the others, it is possible, but I have often found that visibility is very (/ too?) limited in BMS, and quite regularly, you won’t see anything on your TGP until you are within 20NM already.
If BMS TGP camera magnification and resolution is same to RL(is it? I suppose so.), than ID might be limited to same extent in RL too.
I also found this article recently.
Even with the ability to kill other aircraft from dozens of miles away, and increasingly capable identification friend or foe (IFF) systems, visual identification has remained the standard rule of engagement for most combat environments over the last few decades. But that doesn’t mean the naked eye literally has to see the target by looking out the window.
So identify tally with TGP can be RL tactic too.
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What i do is zoom-in in tv mode and then zoom in my POV on the TGP MFD. I consistently identify contacts at 30nm’s out.
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Using the force or without?Cheers Obi1
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Using the force or without?Cheers Obi1
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If BMS TGP camera magnification and resolution is same to RL(is it? I suppose so.), than ID might be limited to same extent in RL too.
It’s not so much TGP camera magnification or resolution, as it is a limitation in BMS that visibility is a single value, regardless of altitude, cloud cover, time of day, …
@Master:
What i do is zoom-in in tv mode and then zoom in my POV on the TGP MFD. I consistently identify contacts at 30nm’s out.
It’s based entirely on the value of these visibility sliders. With the slider all the way to the right, you’re correct that you can see (not necessarily identify) the contact at approximately 30NM out.
E.g. quick test with a KC-10, for max visibility, as it’s quite a bit larger than the average jet fighter you’re generally up against.
With the default settings, any other setting than Sunny or Fair will put you in a position where you won’t be able to get a tally at proper stand-off ranges (Fair is already pushing the limit against high-threat aircraft), even if you’re way up high above the weather, which AFAIK is not realistic.
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As said by the others, it is possible, but I have often found that visibility is very (/ too?) limited in BMS, and quite regularly, you won’t see anything on your TGP until you are within 20NM already. Switching between WHOT/BHOT/TV-mode and zoom doesn’t change anything.
At that point, using the TGP to get a VID is too little too late already, and because of issues with textures / alphas (?), you’ll see textures and especially the engines flickering through the aircraft, making it harder than necessary to see if the contact is hot or dragging.
I disagree. I think it’s very useful. I don’t shoot until I’m within 20NM anyway in case of AI bandits to have a pretty good pk. Outside of 20NM you already know (or have a good idea) that your intended target is a bandit through other sources/sensors. So when you get to 20NM the TGP is an effective tool to identify your target and confirm that you are actually shooting your intended target. I never fly a CAP mission without a TGP anymore.
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I’m not saying the TGP isn’t useful, but it is limited because of the restricted visibility. Not all aircraft have NCTR, AWACS can be delayed because of other messages, … We’re lucky AI doesn’t know about NORAD intercepts yet, so we at least have the RWR to get some form of ID, because if you’re up against AA-10C/D or AA-12, going closer than 20NM to get a visual is a good way to get yourself killed.
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Yes, it is limited. But it is limited in real life too. And from what I’ve read the ranges are pretty similar to real life ranges in BMS. At least for fighter sized targets. Larger aircraft like KC10’s can be seen from farther away from what I’ve read. But for fighters it’s pretty realistic I think. And the danger in a high threat environment depends. If you cruise at 300 kts then yes, closing to within 20NM is very dangerous, but if you run an intercept with 500+ kts, then closing within 20NM is not too dangerous. Even against AA12 type threats.
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Yes, it is limited. But it is limited in real life too. And from what I’ve read the ranges are pretty similar to real life ranges in BMS. At least for fighter sized targets. Larger aircraft like KC10’s can be seen from farther away from what I’ve read. But for fighters it’s pretty realistic I think. And the danger in a high threat environment depends. If you cruise at 300 kts then yes, closing to within 20NM is very dangerous, but if you run an intercept with 500+ kts, then closing within 20NM is not too dangerous. Even against AA12 type threats.
+1, Fighters are unidentifiable over 20NM due to magnification limit, but BMS visibility limit is 30NM. So its more because of TGP limit than BMS limit. At least for fighters.
Edit: yeah and I missed about Tanker. That’s BMS limitation.
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It’s not so much TGP camera magnification or resolution, as it is a limitation in BMS that visibility is a single value, regardless of altitude, cloud cover, time of day, …
It’s based entirely on the value of these visibility sliders. With the slider all the way to the right, you’re correct that you can see (not necessarily identify) the contact at approximately 30NM out.
E.g. quick test with a KC-10, for max visibility, as it’s quite a bit larger than the average jet fighter you’re generally up against.
With the default settings, any other setting than Sunny or Fair will put you in a position where you won’t be able to get a tally at proper stand-off ranges (Fair is already pushing the limit against high-threat aircraft), even if you’re way up high above the weather, which AFAIK is not realistic.
Fully zoom in your POV towards the MFD. Makes it easier to ID and yes, on my comment i was referring to good visibility conditions.
Edit: Forgot to mention that i have smart scaling ON.
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Oh, year Smart Scaling.
IMO it’s perfect for visual identification but for TGP it might be making the ID range bit too long?