Multiplayer zoom feature request
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Is it possible to incorporate multiplayer zoom disable feature in the server hosting, whether it be TE, campaign or dogfight?
Zoom in a sense that one can zoom in from the cockpit into the outside world in an unrealistic manner.
I think it should be relatively easy and just add a rectangle to be ticked on/ off on the server side to affect all flying. -
IMO fov has to be limited depending on resolution.
ResolutonWidth(px) / HorizontalFOV(degree) should not exceed 60.
As becuse 20/20 eye vision defines 1/60 degree. -
Is it possible to incorporate multiplayer zoom disable feature in the server hosting, whether it be TE, campaign or dogfight?
Zoom in a sense that one can zoom in from the cockpit into the outside world in an unrealistic manner.
I think it should be relatively easy and just add a rectangle to be ticked on/ off on the server side to affect all flying.Why would you disable zoom when handicapped by a multiplier of 1000 when flying through a 2 D monitor?
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Why would you disable zoom when handicapped by a multiplier of 1000 when flying through a 2 D monitor?
Because zoom is being manipulated by some arcade game players to either scan the ground at high level to find targets high above or to get unrealistic distance in dogfights (be it vertical or horizontal) and then utilize tactics which can not be used in the real world.
Now, we proud ourselves on flying a study sim simulator with high fidelity and this is what I enjoy.
I don’t claim that zoom users cheat.
But, If I open a server I would like to fly with others who fly and fight with the Falcon as intended and not as manipulated. -
Because zoom is being manipulated by some arcade game players to either scan the ground at high level to find targets high above or to get unrealistic distance in dogfights (be it vertical or horizontal) and then utilize tactics which can not be used in the real world.
Now, we proud ourselves on flying a study sim simulator with high fidelity and this is what I enjoy.
I don’t claim that zoom users cheat.
But, If I open a server I would like to fly with others who fly and fight with the Falcon as intended and not as manipulated.We proud ourselves on the same thing, but personally, I would never disable zoom.
For one, not all virtual pilots are fit to meet real life standards. Many of us wear glasses, and their eyesight is nowhere near 20/20. In our squadron, we have a few 50-plussers. If we were to disable zoom, they wouldn’t see half of what they’re supposed to see.
Secondly, even if you have 20/20 vision IRL, a monitor has its drawbacks and cannot properly simulate that perfect vision. IRL, you might see an object well at ranges where it would only be a few pixels wide on an unzoomed monitor.
Thirdly, zoom is a temporary measure. You can’t fly around like that without giving up A LOT of your peripheral vision, so AFAIK, it’s most often used to look better at something you’ve already spotted anyway.I don’t know if you fly on open servers, or have a squadron of your own, but if you find likeminded people to fly with, you could suggest some sort of gentleman’s code to not use zoom, and trust everyone to respect that?
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We proud ourselves on the same thing, but personally, I would never disable zoom.
For one, not all virtual pilots are fit to meet real life standards. Many of us wear glasses, and eyesight is nowhere near 20/20. In our squadron, we have a few 50-plus sees. If we were to disable zoom, they wouldn’t see half of what they’re supposed to see.
Secondly, even if you have 20/20 vision IRL, a monitor has its drawbacks and cannot properly simulate that perfect vision. IRL, you might see an object well at ranges where it would only be a few pixels wide on an unzoomed monitor.
Thirdly, zoom is a temporary measure. You can’t fly around like that without giving up A LOT of your peripheral vision, so AFAIK, it’s most often used to look better at something you’ve already spotted anyway.I don’t know if you fly on open servers, or have a squadron of your own, but if you find likeminded people to fly with, you could suggest some sort of gentleman’s code to not use zoom, and trust everyone to respect that?
I am from the 72nd VFW.
I wear glasses and my eyes have seen more than a few decades of usage.
More than that…I do not refer to regular zoom usage by many.
I specifically refer to zoom exploitation by either scanning the ground at 15,000’ at max zoom to find targets or to fly up at high speed in a dogfight to gain vertical separation of 10,000’-20,000 while zooming in on your opponent below as a tactic and then dive at him.
Both instances are not used in our wing…but…when one flies with occasional dogfighters or pickup flights outside the wing it can be found with ease.
My request is not to disable the zoom but to have a feature enabling one to disable it when hosting, just like outside view and padlock. -
I am from the 72nd VFW.
I wear glasses and my eyes have seen more than a few decades of usage.
More than that…I do not refer to regular zoom usage by many.
I specifically refer to zoom exploitation by either scanning the ground at 15,000’ at max zoom to find targets or to fly up at high speed in a dogfight to gain vertical separation of 10,000’-20,000 while zooming in on your opponent below as a tactic and then dive at him.
Both instances are not used in our wing…but…when one flies with occasional dogfighters or pickup flights outside the wing it can be found with ease.
My request is not to disable the zoom but to have a feature enabling one to disable it when hosting, just like outside view and padlock.I’ve read somewhere that quite a few pilots bring binoculars to the cockpit in real life as well just for that purpose (easier ID of both ground and airborne targets). Why would you want to artificially limit yourself?
All the best,
Uwe
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I’ve read somewhere that quite a few pilots bring binoculars to the cockpit in real life as well just for that purpose (easier ID of both ground and airborne targets). Why would you want to artificially limit yourself?
All the best,
Uwe
I have yet to see or know of a modern jet fighter pilot to use binoculars in a dogfight.
As for ground scanning…I would appreciate to know if you know whether it’s a common trade with pilots flying modern jets equipped with both TGPs and ground radar for finding targets. -
IMO fov has to be limited depending on resolution.
ResolutonWidth(px) / HorizontalFOV(degree) should not exceed 60.
As becuse 20/20 eye vision defines 1/60 degree.FOV and resolution should have no correlation. FOV depends on monitor size and distance from the eye, ie, how many degrees of your vision does it take up.
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I have yet to see or know of a modern jet fighter pilot to use binoculars in a dogfight.
Not for dogfight because this has obvious consequences like tunnel vision which is going to backfire in your face in a dogfight.
But on CAS and air to ground mission, it has some huge advantages and quite a few pilots did it. you can read about it in many books.So in a sense, for AG mission, zoom is not quite a cheat
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@Red:
So in a sense, for AG mission, zoom is not quite a cheat
Copy that.
I know of Hog drivers who use it or slow speed attack jets…but never heard of F/A modern jets who use it, though I might be wrong on that regard.
And…I never implied that zoom users cheat for it is there as a feature of the sim and there are no rules against using it.
So maybe as a feature option for dogfight if binoculars are bring used by Falcon/ Hornet/ Eurofighter etc pilots… -
They are. Stories of Rafale pilots using it during Harmattan.
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the platform is irrelevant, the tasking is relevant.
From the moment you do CAS (or ground attack in support of TICs in a F-16, rafale, F18 or A-10, the same tools in the cockpit will be relevant
IMHO -
I can’t speak for anyone but myself, but using zoom while manoeuvreing or even just looking out the side window is very jerky and if I do spot something I lose it pretty quick.
I actually limit my own min and max FOV as to not get lost in the zoom or have to large a FOV.
Having actually experienced people using exploits my reaction was to use there behavior to develop tactics to negate their advantage rather then try to call them out or demand sweepings changes that would or might remove worthy features.
If they need to cheat it only hurts their own development & character.
PS: And I have a long memory.
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IHaving actually experienced people using exploits my reaction was to use there behavior to develop tactics to negate their advantage rather then try to call them out or demand sweepings changes that would or might remove worthy features.
If they need to cheat it only hurts their own development & character.
It is possible to develop negating tactics…but it takes all the high fidelity dogfight sim flying fun.
I would rather and have been disengaging a DF in which it is done.
Neither am I calling anyone out nor am I asking for sweeping changes.
Simply another line in the DF options screen to able/ disable outside zoom.Again…zoom exploiters do not cheat.
They simply use a software available legal feature.
The fact that I do not like it doesn’t mean they can not use it if they so wish.
By disabling the zoom during a certain match I make sure I’m having my kind of match that is only decided by flight skills.As for A-G zoom…as mentioned…there is no need to implement in TE or campaign for A-G operations…though it leaves the A-A open for exploitations.
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I would rather and have been disengaging a DF in which it is done.
Neither am I calling anyone out nor am I asking for sweeping changes.Genuine question, as I’m really curious about the part in bold: how do you know if the other person has used zoom? Which manoeuvre is a telltale sign of using zoom, that makes you decide you no longer want to continue the fight?
The fact that I do not like it doesn’t mean they can not use it if they so wish.
That you want an option to remove it, would qualify as “they cannot use it if they so wish”, though.
By disabling the zoom during a certain match I make sure I’m having my kind of match that is only decided by flight skills.
Not entirely. There are so many more factors than FOV / zoom that can decide if you win or not.
POV Hat vs Head-tracking
1080p vs 4K
21" vs 55"
Single or multi-monitor setup
15fps vs 150fps
Low vs high graphics settings
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Genuine question, as I’m really curious about the part in bold: how do you know if the other person has used zoom? Which manoeuvre is a telltale sign of using zoom, that makes you decide you no longer want to continue the fight?
That you want an option to remove it, would qualify as “they cannot use it if they so wish”, though.
Not entirely. There are so many more factors than FOV / zoom that can decide if you win or not.
POV Hat vs Head-tracking
1080p vs 4K
21" vs 55"
Single or multi-monitor setup
15fps vs 150fps
Low vs high graphics settings
…1. Several ways, one of which is when your opponent passes you at 800kts and go straight up while you disengage down at full AB nape of earth and he finds you and locks on you 10-20 Angels above you without a problem.
2. Since it’s an option for the server for a certain match it doesn’t disable their ability to use it any other place but for that specific online match.
3. Yes, there are many graphic settings which can also influence visibility, some of which you mentioned are done in DCS, but in BMS their influence is not as important as zooming.
I’m not saying it’s a cure it all solution…but…it will take out a major tool of exploitation, of which you can find quite a few examples on youtube, by a simple option.
You don’t like it don’t use it.
You like it then tick it. -
Thats only a few miles… quite frankly, a fast moving bug out aircraft below with planform aspect SHOULD be quite visible in that scenario.
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Thats only a few miles… quite frankly, a fast moving bug out aircraft below with planform aspect SHOULD be quite visible in that scenario.
Please test it if you think so.
In reality, in BMS DF, you lose tally quicker than you anticipate, much quicker. -
Please test it if you think so.
In reality, in BMS DF, you lose tally quicker than you anticipate, much quicker.Which one? test in reality? or in BMS DF?
You already know how it goes in BMS DF and are complaining about it, so clearly thats not what you want me to test. I regret that I dont have access to a fast jet to just do a quick dogfight in, sadly.
What I am pointing out is that IRL you should be quite visible with only a couple miles separation, a planform aspect and a high LOS rate… my point is that while the technique may not be realistic, the result (tally) probably is.