Block 52+ Advanced moving digital map
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Let me put my two cents. We have larger MFDs called MPDs in the 64. Block II aircraft with later Lot software series have moving map displays. It was painful to use them. You always had to declutter MPDs, zoom in zoom out to see clearly what’s on the map, green lines always blurred in with yellowish maps, constantly adjusted brightness. I always ended up turning the map overlay off. Never used VFR cross sectionals as overlays anyways, you’d need tactical maps. So as far realism goes, don’t implement maps don’t exist in the real thing just for the sake of having a map.
+1
If you want digital moving maps go buy an iPad for a kneepad and a GPS for your canopy, install Jeppesen stuff anf you are ready for fun.
So, how many in here have experience with this specific HSD digital map? Please raise your hands.
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So, how many in here have experience with this specific HSD digital map? Please raise your hands.
Yes, I have experience with the TAD from the A10C-sim and the Abris from the Ka-50 but I dont miss a moving map in the F-16.
95% of the A2G missions for the F-16 are preplanned therefore we should already know where we will fly etc.
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2¢ - the Hornet’s digital moving map on the MPCD is very user friendly and easy to read. The HSI format is mainly used for navigation and the SA format is mainly used in the tactical enviroment. Biggest issue is that the map is bright at night but you can turn it off to help alleviate that issue.
I can see how making a digital moving map work on a computer monitor would require a high resolution though.
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2¢ - the Hornet’s digital moving map on the MPCD is very user friendly and easy to read. The HSI format is mainly used for navigation and the SA format is mainly used in the tactical enviroment. Biggest issue is that the map is bright at night but you can turn it off to help alleviate that issue.
I can see how making a digital moving map work on a computer monitor would require a high resolution though.
I’m thinking the software should be very similar since we both have experience in Boeing aircraft so that makes me think maybe I just didn’t like the presentation. Turning down the brightness of the overlay made it useless at times. If symbology was darker or at least adjustable maybe that would have helped. But yeah sometimes you had to look at the map since we didn’t carry print maps like other guys. My point stands, BMS should implement it as it’s in the real thing.
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95% of the A2G missions for the F-16 are preplanned therefore we should already know where we will fly etc.
Small correction, 100% of all missions in all aircraft IRL are very thoroughly planned. Now if someone does not want to prepare at all before a BMS mission that’s another story. The map will still not help you IMO.
I’ve also used the map in A-10C, I usually ended up turning it off so I could actually read the symbology and even when I left it on I didn’t actually use it for anything.
My point stands, BMS should implement it as it’s in the real thing.
Can’t argue with that, the question is, which one of all the variants of the real thing? At least until we have block/country specific avionics if ever.
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USAF F-16CJ of course what else is out there … LOL LOL:D
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Hi all,
Just adding pics and info to thread!
The Benefits
Situational awareness, relative information, colored identified objects, and specific symbols, visible airbases, real-time information, visible mountain terrain elevation for defensive masking, targets relative to ground view or terrain, proper route or alternate route steer point and visible roads especially whilst flying at night.
What it is
The Horizontal Situation Display (HSD) is one of the most important pages available on your MFD. It is a moving-map display of the current horizontal situation around you, showing friendly and enemy aircraft, the route you are flying, the area being scanned by your radar, and many other useful pieces of information. The HSD is used to maintain situational awareness of your present location and of what is happening around you in the air and on the ground.
Basic Symbology
You can imagine the HSD as what you would see if you were directly above your aircraft, looking straight down. There are three range rings, each representing one third of the currently selected display range (so for example, if you have selected 15 miles, each ring is another increment of 5 miles. If you have selected 60 miles, each ring is another increment of 20 miles). Your aircraft is in the center of these range rings, and the map is oriented so that your aircraft’s heading is straight up. Each range ring has four spokes, representing north, east, west, and south. The north spoke on the innermost range ring is replaced with a solid white triangle, to show you what your heading is.
Your navigational course is displayed on the HSD. Each steerpoint is displayed as white shape, with the currently selected steerpoint flashing. The shape of the steerpoint symbol depends on the type of steerpoint - normal steerpoints are circles, insertion points are squares, and target/CAP steerpoints are triangles. A white line is drawn between each steerpoint, giving you a birds-eye view of your complete flight path. You can navigate to a particular steerpoint simply by turning so that the steerpoint is located directly above your aircraft on the HSD, and then flying that heading.
The area that your radar is scanning is displayed using a cyan box, taking into account your sweep angle, selected range, and antenna orientation. A “ghost cursor” is also displayed, which shows the geographical area that your radar cursor is currently in. This is useful for getting a sense of what area your radar is looking at, and can also be used to help identify targets (if you have a radar spike in a portion of the radar scan area that is over known enemy locations, it’s probably an enemy). Note that the scan area can extend further than the HSD displays, in which case the cyan lines will simply continue off the HSD.
Known enemy positions are uploaded into your aircraft’s computer before you take off - these are displayed in yellow. Some threats have a circle around them representing the effective range of the threat (for example, SAM sites will show the maximum range the missile can hit). The circle and thread will turn red once you enter this range. The positions of your wingmen are also displayed in teal.
The following diagram from the F-16 MLU avionics manual describes the basic symbology used by the HSD. Some items also apply to the FCR display.
Some more Examples
Some screen shot Examples from FF5
The F18 Cockpit
The JAS39 Gripen
Nice ha!
Cheers,
:drink:
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PERFECT Skyknight!
And now… tell me what will be the interest if this map is not readable on your 23" screen using 1920*1080 resolution without TrackIR …?
(Expected answer: It’s fun! It look good.)
That IS the point for BMS team.
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PERFECT Skyknight!
And now… tell me what will be the interest if this map is not readable on your 23" screen using 1920*1080 resolution without TrackIR …?
(Expected answer: It’s fun! It look good.)
That IS the point for BMS team.
Hi Deejay,
Well all that stuff you mention I cant answer because Deejay I have stated many times I dont know about coding, modding or skinning or simply creating games, but simply willing to discuss, share, propose and suggest something in a good discussion to the best of my ability.
What I do know is DCS-A10C has this please watch and many guys use the benefits it privides…. please watch and enjoy:-
You might simply invite a DEV to post here more info on how it could be implemented up to you.
But I’m sure if DCS can do this than BMS definitely can implement this!;):p
Cheers,
:drink:
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Small correction, 100% of all missions in all aircraft IRL are very thoroughly planned.
Hm, I guess with an A10C pilot there can happen everything while he is on station over Afghanistan for 6 hours.
I’ve also used the map in A-10C, I usually ended up turning it off so I could actually read the symbology and even when I left it on I didn’t actually use it for anything.
Yes, the TAD also doesnt show tactical maps etc. So in most cases the moving map is not relevant for mission success.
The only helpful moving map I know is from the Ka-50. But IMHO there is no need to have something like this in the F-16. -
Nice
Cheers,
:drink:
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You might simply invite a DEV to post here more info on how it could be implemented up to you.
What do you thing I’m doing here…?! … I told you MANY times that most subjects has been already discussed internal. Should I post it in “size7” ?
Please, understand that DEVs has better to do than answering to posts and requests on public forum. There are only 24H on a day
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@SkyKnight:
What I do know is DCS-A10C has this please watch and many guys use the benefits it privides…. please watch and enjoy:-
I have flown A-10C and it’s eye candy. Useful? Only if you zoom in on it so the whole damn MFD takes up the screen.
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Skyknight:
The point is even not if it’s useful or not. The point is “is the block 50/52 have it?” (I remember to you that is the objective of BMS). The answers is “NO”!.
Only the greek block 52+ and the block 30/32 above SCU5 or 6 (I don’t remember well). As soon Falcon can’t give external avionics for different aircraft, it will be stupid to code a map if the real block 50/52 USAF don’t have it. That’s all. End of story.
But of course, the other point about the MFD resolution still valid too. Falcon don’t have MFD resolution enough to give readable map. The only things you will see is a bunch of pixel. -
Skyknight:
The point is even not if it’s useful or not. The point is “is the block 50/52 have it?” (I remember to you that is the objective of BMS). The answers is “NO”!.
Only the greek block 52+ and the block 30/32 above SCU5 or 6 (I don’t remember well). As soon Falcon can’t give external avionics for different aircraft, it will be stupid to code a map if the real block 50/52 USAF don’t have it. That’s all. End of story.
But of course, the other point about the MFD resolution still valid too. Falcon don’t have MFD resolution enough to give readable map. The only things you will see is a bunch of pixel.Amraam correct the point that the USAF does not have them YET!! , but be in mind that not only USA people fly that sim… and it is healthy from people to ask for specific tapes(avionics) since that keep users to fly with that specific simulator …
the deference with all other sims are random deferents thaters which are many in WIP and random avionics for each country which are WIP …
do not tell me that the F-16 we are flying now is a block 50 !!!, it is little block 40 , little block 50 tape 2 and little block 52 tape 3 avionics … so to codeing requests for people is not stupid idea , since from that people you would get the reference you may need to create that avionics…
->so two options , in order to be clear …
Or the dev team make only one tape e.g USAF F-16 BLOCK 50/52 as close to real as free availiable reference can provided ? and none USAF users stops to requests specific imlementations!!!
Or make many deferent types of F-16 via configuration manager for most common F-16 users and community flyers , look HAF , IAF , THK , PAK , NoAF e.t.c in order to keep that people also interesting more and more but that need a huge amount of time and references which could be not availiable for deferent tapes…
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Moving map works fine in DCS A10C for no appreciable FPS hit, not in the block 52 okay, just saying it works fine when coded in.
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Amraam correct the point that the USAF does not have them YET!! , but be in mind that not only USA people fly that sim… and it is healthy from people to ask for specific tapes(avionics) since that keep users to fly with that specific simulator …
the deference with all other sims are random deferents thaters which are many in WIP and random avionics for each country which are WIP …
do not tell me that the F-16 we are flying now is a block 50 !!!, it is little block 40 , little block 50 tape 2 and little block 52 tape 3 avionics … so to codeing requests for people is not stupid idea , since from that people you would get the reference you may need to create that avionics…
->so two options , in order to be clear …
Or the dev team make only one tape e.g USAF F-16 BLOCK 50/52 as close to real as free availiable reference can provided ? and none USAF users stops to requests specific imlementations!!!
Or make many deferent types of F-16 via configuration manager for most common F-16 users and community flyers , look HAF , IAF , THK , PAK , NoAF e.t.c in order to keep that people also interesting more and more but that need a huge amount of time and references which could be not availiable for deferent tapes…
I know that they are not only USA people. Me too, I preferred to have some particular MLU things. But the current idea is the block 50. In the futures maybe we will have different avionics for different aircraft, with different cockpit. But for the moment, just think if somebody want a Carapace RWR with Color MAP of the 52+ and the FLIR of the block 40, and, oh yeah why not a little bit of avionics of block 30 on a single aircraft? I think you will find if crazy too ;).
Process step by step. For the moment i can confirm that the F-16 in BMS is a little bit of different tape (in fact, some is M2, but the DLZ and the Sniper comes to a M4), but all the last implemented avionics can be found in the block 50 ;).Just wait until the possibility to have different avionics for different F-16, each F-16 independent of a another. Then, maybe the time will comes to think about special avionics tapes.
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Or the dev team make only one tape e.g USAF F-16 BLOCK 50/52 as close to real as free availiable reference can provided ? and none USAF users stops to requests specific imlementations!!!
Or make many deferent types of F-16 via configuration manager for most common F-16 users and community flyers , look HAF , IAF , THK , PAK , NoAF e.t.c in order to keep that people also interesting more and more but that need a huge amount of time and references which could be not availiable for deferent tapes……
or
The DEV team make what they want or think is good/achievable etc…
That make sense for you?
I know that they are not only USA people. Me too, I preferred to have some particular MLU things. But the current idea is the block 50. In the futures maybe we will have different avionics for different aircraft, with different cockpit. But for the moment, just think if somebody want a Carapace RWR with Color MAP of the 52+ and the FLIR of the block 40, and, oh yeah why not a little bit of avionics of block 30 on a single aircraft? I think you will find if crazy too ;).
Process step by step. For the moment i can confirm that the F-16 in BMS is a little bit of different tape (in fact, some is M2, but the DLZ and the Sniper comes to a M4), but all the last implemented avionics can be found in the block 50 ;).Just wait until the possibility to have different avionics for different F-16, each F-16 independent of a another. Then, maybe the time will comes to think about special avionics tapes.
Great explanations!
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@Dee-jay
Perfect sense my friend I know exactly what are you talking about…. we can not have every one everything requests, we can not satisfy all…AT THE MOMENT
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Someone read the useful info on the right MFD to me, what SA can you get out of it? When flying BMS, you are going to do neck in neck out exercises, that is all.