BMS 4.36 DEV SERIES - AGM 65L
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@Tumbler31 - check out the VRS Superbug (man, I hate that stupid name…) AGM-65E model. They have the best one I’ve seen so far. In fact, they are my fav Hornet overall really -
https://forums.vrsimulations.com/support/index.php/AGM-65E_Laser_Maverick
When it comes to MAVs it’s pretty much going to work the same way for all, other than for how the actual HOTAS setup is built. Look over all the sims out there, and pay more attention to function over style. Never overlook other sims as good references!
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@Stevie ah that one, had it bookmarked but forgot about it, thanks.
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Someone help me out with this, I don’t understand the useage case for this weapon. To me it’s kinda like swapping an AIM-120 for a AIM-7. You are swapping a fire and forget weapon for a guide it all the way in weapon. To be explicit your also trading off the ability to hit 2 or more targets in one pass for what exactly?
I hate to be dense but the only two potential upsides is:
- potentially a higher hit rate, I’m around a 5/6 hit rate with the D/G variants. I’m never really surprised when one of the six goes off into the wild blue, but that is still like a 80% hit rate which is way higher than our AMRAAM hit rates.
- max standoff range, I think we have to be fair, in BMS popping one off at max range is a bit of a fluke, maybe some super-sayen can do it but for myself as a normal BMS guy it’s more like 8-10 mile release.
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@Buttons - MAV is primarily a CAS weapon. The MAV E/E2/L in particular.
Firstly, you can’t hit more than one target in one pass with any MAV. That is one of the things that is totally unrealistic that has been fixed. One pass/one shot…that’s how it works in the RW.
Second - a laser MAV is your single best choice for taking out tanks from any approach aspect. You can steer it manually or let it guide using auto lock/lase…and you can also use it pretty much like you would a gun for hitting a pinpoint on a building, etc.
You also get more options for employment in more scenarios - if you are working with a ground FAC, the FAC will shine the laser, and then it is “fire and forget”. This is also the only method that might accommodate a multiple launch, but I don’t know of anyone that operates that way.
But you can also self designate, or buddy lase. -
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@Stevie
multiple launches - you could if using different laser code for every missile/bomb to different target-example , Hellfire, old one, is also this SALH , but there are 4x AH64A , close to each other , wing… and every carries 8xAGM114 SALH version … every chopper has its own laser-code … or imagine mixup when they all fire from the same direction
Same goes to FAC, TargetPOD , one target only per laser (laser-code)…
The only question how far laser(s) with the SAME code can be apart to not “cross-effect” each other… and that is affected by range and direction obviously. … and vicinity of both targets …
-eg … firing platforms are using same code but they fire from opposite directions , 90-270 , … how far TARGETS must be from each other so the weapons don’t mix themself up …
- there are few outcome of this (AND/OR) , obviously , both weapons miss , both weapons hit first target , other target , … but IMHO, 99% would be both miss as sensors would go haywire
(mil) Lasers are pretty good ranged, airborne type, moisture, atmosphere etc, … ground (FAC) are not so , ~5nm tops., not because of laser, but platform , you need excellent STABILITY, PRECISION, OPTICS, to target anything at that range, sniper stuff, move a milrad - at 10000yards move 10yards or 100? … anyway , you got the point.
Cheers
Yes, I also don’t believe that you get DLZ from anything that you didnt SELF-PAINTED , only from reflection , so range information shouldn’t be there… else then a calculated from cordinates you were given … as it is
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@white_fang Please is it possible to ripple two AGM 65L at once? Thanks
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@Sniper-0 why not ?? … perfectly, …
Ah , you mean at the SAME TIME ? … That , I don’t know. , I don’t believe so. One after other , in a second(s) apart , no problem …
But what’s the real difference between same-time and 1sec apart … so.
–actually , now I recalled, you can with the D version , but every sensor on its missile have to have a target locked in advance… , then you can ripple-fire them … it is somewhat hollywood style … but what the heck
– I mean, so technically (in theory) you COULD’ve do it with E/L version on to the same spot, but what ripple means exactly ?? AUTO 1-2 , or IN-PAIRS ?
-I’ve never seen that, sorry. -
@white_fang - yes, but a single laser can only use a single code. So unless you are have done and are doing some pretty strong pre-coordination and using multiple lasers, you are not going to be able to do this - particularly in an on-call CAS scenario.
Yes - every chopper has it’s own code, and every chopper fires ONE Hellfire at a time…and that brings up another hazard - Hellfire is usually fired into a “basket” sort of like lofting an LGB. I know of one RL instance where a Hellfire was lofted during a training exercise and locked the wrong end of the laser - the muzzle end of an F/A-18D laser - vise the target, as it crested the toss. Fortunately the weapon didn’t fuse…but it took out a chunk of the Hornet’s left Stab passing by…it was night, so nobody even realized what had happened until the Hornet was taxiing in. Lucky…VERY lucky…
…and MAVs don’t have/use a DLZ as we’d think of one. None of them, in any case. So the model is ok there.
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@Stevie Exactly. Only one weapon was what I’ve seen. … Technically (in theory) it should be possible more then one , why not 4-5 … but they’ll end up in the same spot…
And of course, as your cute story, direction , you don’t want to be on the other side of a barrelThan Hellfire lobbing shot is LOAL-style (know from Longbow2) - it came from Lock-on-after-launch , gave you the range AND is fired blindly, Laser painting is done afterwards, last few seconds , … so no laser ranging or painting in-front as to not “disturb” the target tank , so no counter measures or minimum reaction time is given … if he deploys smoke/water/mist , laser is pretty much … ***ed
In this case F18D pod was first to “shine” - on the wrong end, BUT! , with the correct code
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@white_fang - all correct. In the case I site it was determined that the shot geometry was just plain wrong for an airborne buddy, aggravated by the fact that it was a night op.
…and because they’d all end up in the same hole on a single code/spot, I’ve oft suggested building laser guided Zuni rockets…talk about ripple on steroids!
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@Stevie Aye, those laser zuni’s have a name… can’t fetch it right now. Russian’s adopted them also, since they’re motherland of rockets…
Really, on steroids is the right word, just you don’t get area coverage anymore… but punch … more of a kick
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@white_fang - yup. I’ve also heard that laser MAV has become a big deal in urban warfare because of the ability to place it, and limit collateral damage. I love MAVs…and laser ones in particular.
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@Stevie Sure. That limited deployment ways is only “curse” for laser weapons. Easily jammed, essentially only with water
That;s why they turned to jdam - gps/rf . … almost all weapons today have secondary guidance. … even Harm have a millimeter wave radar.
But from precision standpoint , laser will always be top notch.
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@white_fang - there’s a laser JDAM now too…so you can not only drop it where you think it should go, you can steer it as well.
MAVG is over-modeled in BMS too. But what’s been done is pretty well done. Just get rid of those triple racks and pesky dome covers!
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@Stevie Correct, uuf, since 4.34/4.35?? … It’s GBU54 and I just love those babies , dropping them like flies. . Even effective little bastards.
It is the only LGB which laser-code can be changed in flight, via sms-ctrl page.Btw… they … THE BMS TEAM , (they know who they are) … unfortunately bugged AGM123 “Skipper” in 4.36 … I’ve tried,… even fixed’em… so.
Pretty decent standoff weapon , 1000lb bomb from cca10nm , laser guided. Marvelous for FAC/JTAC… as they do painting., fire and forget … with style
Agm123.dat need a sensor replacement … type 5-0 , so it behaves just like LMAV, and in database remove the flag gps-guided , “skipper” just misses everytime.
BUT!, for AI that may not be the case , so maybe they won’t know how to use it properly… still need to test try that .
*But!! , if they (AI) know how to use MAV-E/L … there is still hope -
@white_fang - I’m not reading much of anything I agree with that they’ve done to AIM-120 in 4.36…got me thinking about doing some hacking. For the first time. Or rolling back…
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@Stevie Look, what can you break ?? , I mean, just make a copy of a theater and that’s it.
You still have original for MP… , since its probably the best where to keep stuff exactly the same, as they are , for compatibility purposes.
But with local stuff… dissect it , butcher it … i don’t know what not, find a way to kill it if you can… only then you can find how it works, where it breaks. What’s the worst thing it can happen… break your installation … make copy , reinstall if needed.
What I want to say, you don’t have to be mad scientist at all … just look at Rick and Morty -
@white_fang - that’s what I was thinking…that mainly I’d break Multi-player, and mainly because what I’d hack would be armament or related. And I’d prefer those hacks to be universal, so…I’d have to give somethings up. Time will tell…once I have time on my hands!
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@Stevie Here you are. Quick-fix for AGM 123.
For anyone who is “in-love” enough to try it. - since that rocket bomb can be carried by F18 family but is not using new 4.36 SALH possibility.What is edited , is explosive type, range , laser guidance and loftable , few flags only.
For vehicle file it was more stuff, sensor , deployable wings time, guidance time (was set too low) … etc , you can compare files to have full picture. NOTHING too COMPLICATED especially if you did something similar before.- I still need to test wingman , can AI use it , IF you’re Human … then no problem … walk in the park.
- edit: AI wingman tested OK , … actually enjoyed it - now, only if he/she would learn buddy lasing one day …
When you open agm123 in database editor you will see on picture what has been changed in respect to original entry. - it was originally just for anti-ship use , which is… yes and no , … it was used more for anti-land then anti-ship, if ever.
You might want to BACKUP some stuff, not much, specifically:
- FALCON4_SWD.XML and FALCON4_WCD.XML for object directory (database)
- AGM-123.dat in sim/misdata , vehicle db
That’s it , no big deal. edit database, … copy “code” to favorite text editor and save it as AGM-123.dat , put that file in vehicle database.
Try it , I had pretty good results… it is 1000lb bomb … duh
HOPE guys, BSM TEAM … will make this weapon available officially in some subsequent update , not as this hackety hack., the real thing.
Cheers.
# Title: AGM-123 Skipper II # Author: BMS # Revision: Missile Data Manager ver:1.2.3.0 Date: 5/21/2016 7:17:16 PM #----------------------------------------------------- # Comments #----------------------------------------------------- #----------------------------------------------------- # INPUT DATA #----------------------------------------------------- # # Final Time (sec) 400.000000 # Pk (0.0-1.0) 0.800000 # Weight of missile (lbs) 1001.22 # Weight of propellant (lbs) 90.00 # Motor Impulse (lb-sec) 30000.00 # Reference Area (ft*ft) 0.348400 # Nozzle Exit Area (ft*ft) 0.200000 # Length (ft) 10.010000 # AOA max (deg) 12.0 # AOA min (deg) -12.0 # Beta max (deg) 12.0 # Beta min (deg) -12.0 # Velocity min (mach) 0.000000 # Gimbal Angle Limit (deg) 55.0 # Gimbl Ang Rate Lim (deg/sec) 12.0 # Field of View (deg) 10.0 # Guidance Delay (sec) 0.50 # Lofting Bias (Gs) 0.40 # Proportional nav gain 1.40 # Autopilot Bandwidth 0.00 # Time To Go Active (sec) -1.00 # Seeker Type 5 # Seeker Version 0 # Display 1 # Missile loft time 10.000000 # boostguidesec 0.500000 # terminalguiderange 24250.000000 # boostguideSensorPrecision 5.000000 # sustainguideSensorPrecision 4.300000 # terminalguideSensorPrecision 2.900000 # boostguideLead 2.000000 # sustainguideLead 1.000000 # terminalguideLead 1.000000 # boostguideGnav 1.000000 # sustainguideGnav 1.500000 # terminalguideGnav 1.800000 # boostguideBwap 0.090000 # sustainguideBwap 0.090000 # terminalguideBwap 0.090000 #----------------------------------------------------- # AERO DATA #----------------------------------------------------- # #----------------------------------------------------- # MACH BREAKPOINTS #----------------------------------------------------- # MACH 2 +0.000000 +4.000000 # #----------------------------------------------------- # ALPHA BREAKPOINTS #----------------------------------------------------- # ALPHA 21 +0.000000 +4.000000 +8.000000 +12.000000 +16.000000 +20.000000 +24.000000 +28.000000 +32.000000 +36.000000 +40.000000 +44.000000 +48.000000 +52.000000 +56.000000 +60.000000 +64.000000 +68.000000 +72.000000 +76.000000 +90.000000 # #----------------------------------------------------- # NORMAL FORCE COEFFICIENT CZ (SYMMETRIC ABOUT ALPHA = 0) #----------------------------------------------------- # # Normal Multiplier 0.950000 # # Mach: 0.0 +0.000000 -2.800000 -7.200000 -12.000000 -16.800000 -21.200000 -24.000000 -28.000000 -30.400000 -34.400000 -37.600000 -40.000000 -42.400000 -44.800000 -47.200000 -49.600000 -50.400000 -51.200000 -52.000000 -52.800000 -54.400000 # # Mach: 4.0 +0.000000 -3.500000 -9.000000 -15.000000 -21.000000 -26.500000 -30.000000 -35.000000 -38.000000 -43.000000 -47.000000 -50.000000 -53.000000 -56.000000 -59.000000 -62.000000 -63.000000 -64.000000 -65.000000 -66.000000 -68.000000 # # #----------------------------------------------------- # AXIAL FORCE COEFFICIENT CX (SYMMETRIC ABOUT ALPHA = 0) #----------------------------------------------------- # # Axial Multiplier 0.800000 # # Mach: 0.0 -1.120000 -1.040000 -0.960000 -0.880000 -0.800000 -0.720000 -0.640000 -0.580000 -0.540000 -0.490000 -0.450000 -0.420000 -0.380000 -0.320000 -0.280000 -0.220000 -0.160000 -0.120000 -0.080000 -0.040000 +0.000000 # # Mach: 4.0 -1.400000 -1.300000 -1.200000 -1.100000 -1.000000 -0.900000 -0.800000 -0.730000 -0.680000 -0.610000 -0.560000 -0.520000 -0.470000 -0.400000 -0.350000 -0.280000 -0.200000 -0.150000 -0.100000 -0.050000 +0.000000 # # #----------------------------------------------------- # Rocket SOLID ROCKET ENGINE DATA #----------------------------------------------------- # #----------------------------------------------------- # BURN TIME BREAKPOINTS #----------------------------------------------------- # BRNTIME 8 +0.000000 +0.025000 +3.100000 +3.200000 +3.500000 +4.000000 +4.800000 +5.000000 # #----------------------------------------------------- # ENGINE THRUST (LBS) #----------------------------------------------------- # +0.000000 +8000.000000 +8000.000000 +4000.000000 +1600.000000 +400.000000 +80.000000 +0.000000 # #----------------------------------------------------- # Range Data #----------------------------------------------------- # #Table Multiplier 1.00 # #----------------------------------------------------- # Number of Altitude Breakpoints #----------------------------------------------------- # 6 +0.000000 +10000.000000 +20000.000000 +30000.000000 +40000.000000 +50000.000000 # #----------------------------------------------------- # number of ownship vel breakpoints #----------------------------------------------------- # 2 +0.000000 +1181.490000 # #----------------------------------------------------- # number of aspect breakpoints #----------------------------------------------------- # 3 +0.000000 +1.570800 +3.141600 # # Alt = 0.0 # Vel = 0.0 +20000.000000 +20000.000000 +20000.000000 # # Alt = 0.0 # Vel = 1181.5 +30381.010000 +30381.010000 +30381.010000 # # # Alt = 10000.0 # Vel = 0.0 +36000.000000 +36000.000000 +36000.000000 # # Alt = 10000.0 # Vel = 1181.5 +46000.000000 +46000.000000 +46000.000000 # # # Alt = 20000.0 # Vel = 0.0 +57000.000000 +57000.000000 +57000.000000 # # Alt = 20000.0 # Vel = 1181.5 +64000.000000 +64000.000000 +64000.000000 # # # Alt = 30000.0 # Vel = 0.0 +63000.000000 +63000.000000 +63000.000000 # # Alt = 30000.0 # Vel = 1181.5 +72000.000000 +72000.000000 +72000.000000 # # # Alt = 40000.0 # Vel = 0.0 +65000.000000 +65000.000000 +65000.000000 # # Alt = 40000.0 # Vel = 1181.5 +73000.000000 +73000.000000 +73000.000000 # # # Alt = 50000.0 # Vel = 0.0 +70000.000000 +70000.000000 +70000.000000 # # Alt = 50000.0 # Vel = 1181.5 +80000.000000 +80000.000000 +80000.000000 # # #----------------------------------------------------- # Aux Data #----------------------------------------------------- # #----------------------------------------------------- # Type and Misc #----------------------------------------------------- maxToe 0 foxType 0 maxspeed 0 correctedWeigthCode 0 deployableWingsTime 5 errorfromparrent 0 pickleTimeDelay 200 AspectSelectorSize 50 #----------------------------------------------------- # Engine #----------------------------------------------------- engLocation 0.00 0.00 0.00 EngineSound 266 hasGasDynamicManeuvering 0 mistrail 45 contrail 49 misengGlowBSP 0 #----------------------------------------------------- # Rocket #----------------------------------------------------- rocketDispersionConeAngle 0 rocketSalvoSize -1 #----------------------------------------------------- # SecondStage #----------------------------------------------------- SecondStageTimer 0 SecondStageWeight 0 SecondStageOffset 0 #----------------------------------------------------- # Guidance #----------------------------------------------------- OpticalEyeOffset 5 hasInertialGuidance 0 InsDrift 0.0 AntiRadSensorPrecision 0.0 TerminalStageDist 7.0 dataLinkPodType 0 #----------------------------------------------------- # Range #----------------------------------------------------- MinEngagementRange 0 MinEngagementAlt -1 miniaerorange 0 #----------------------------------------------------- # Loft #----------------------------------------------------- loftTableFilename RMaxTableType 0 #----------------------------------------------------- # Gs #----------------------------------------------------- maxGTerminal 16 maxGNormal 16 RaeroTerminalGmax 8 RaeroTerminalGmin 2 #----------------------------------------------------- # Fuse #----------------------------------------------------- ProximityfuseChange 75 proximityfuserange 0 #----------------------------------------------------- # AIM-9 Sounds #----------------------------------------------------- sndAim9Growl 6 sndAim9GrowlLock 0 sndAim9Uncaged 7 sndAim9EnviroSky 186 sndAim9EnviroGround 187 #----------------------------------------------------- # Particle sys files #----------------------------------------------------- psGroundImpact _GP1000lb psMissileKill _GP1000lb psFeatureImpact _GP1000lb psBombImpact _GP1000lb psArmingDelay psExceedFOV psRocketBurst #----------------------------------------------------- # Counter #----------------------------------------------------- ChaffBurstChances 2 ChaffBurstResetInterval 2000 ClutterFactorHeight 4000 ChaffClutterFactor 1.1 BeamScanRatioForSearch 2 # #----------------------------------------------------- # Additionals that are not included in MDM. #-----------------------------------------------------
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I see there have been a great update for the durandals. the crater is bigger , CCRP works much better and for the durandals the flashing reticle doesn’t show anymore.