Stick Sensitivity
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hmm. old thread.
anyways, I just tried removing the BMS set “small” deadzone. didnt even notice it before.
I didnt really notice a difference in the minute long test flight afterwards, but I also didnt tank yet. will try that and see if there is a difference.
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you have done 6 updates and not caring to change the curve for us non-resistive joystick users. you know,it’s too sensitive in motion joysticks you need to change it. aiming a bomb and landing is too difficult, i end up using 10% of joystick motion to aim. plus you haven’t modelled the flight computer right because when i pitch up more than like 10 degrees it starts pitching up by itself and i need down input to keep straight. revise
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You should read the FLCS article before.
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plus you haven’t modelled the flight computer right because when i pitch up more than like 10 degrees it starts pitching up by itself and i need down input to keep straight. revise
like the real one……
i give you a tip
FM_developper_note_4
page 20when in pitch up situation like the third graph
An = G cos(pitchangle)…for 45 deg pitch up, An = 0.7G
under 11deg AOA (which means the FLCS is in G command mode) the FLCS ALWAYS commands 1G when stick neutral, therefore the AC is pitching up by itself to keep 1G, if you want to fly straight at 45 deg pitch up, you need to fly at 0.7G whiich means you need to push a little on the stick
this behavior is well illustred in some F16 aerobatics articles…
revise plz
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fair.i thought computer was supposed to keep flight path.
but you didn’t care about the other section of my message.do you want to help or not? -
fair.i thought computer was supposed to keep flight path.
That is why reading article first is a good idea.
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fair.i thought computer was supposed to keep flight path.
but you didn’t care about the other section of my message.do you want to help or not?To be entirely fair, the current curve for BMS replicates the response curve for the F-16 - not that you knew that I guess, its hidden away in a classified article, in the download section. If you wanr to use more of the throw on the joystick, it will always come at either the expense of fine adjustability in part of the range, or a more limited range.
For most flying, you only need to make small inputs. If you want to use the whole area of your joystick, come back after flying HARTS maneuvers. Even with the current curve you dislike, you will end up pulling that stick to the stops…
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So to make a long story short the real response curve is build in the system that is why i recommand the user to use a strict linear response in their set up. Trying to deviate from it Will provoke PIO in some flight régions .
Right on!
This is not Lockon or IL-2 where the FM (if one can call it so) was manipulative “constructed” or “compensated” with joystick curves.
Your controller input is always linear (1 - 100%) … the rest is up to the FLCS and the physics-modeling of the plane - or the transition mechanics in older planes.Lets not forget: Joystick curves have been invented to counter old dirty potis and poti-spiking and this feature is STILL inherited and misused with wrong purposes.
Many ppl have tried to change their curves to get a better “feel” or because with linear response some sims are just way to off in the handling of the craft, thus ppl are “forced” to
compensate, but joystic-curves HAVE NOTHING to do with the actuall FM. NO relation AT ALL - even if perceived often otherwise. Curves are an “excuse” for failing FM or as buffer for failing hardware (sensors), that´s it.In my personal opinion the use of joystick curves is and was inspired in many sims due to failing modeling of the “cause” of forces.
Most sims simulate the “effect” or “result” if you will (if this and that happens, do this and that as result), but not the actual “cause” of forces, like BMS does.A proper made sim has not to compensate ones feelings or habbits with curves - one has to feel and learn the FM or the nature of the plane instead.
Imagine yourself sitting in ANY real combat aircraft (old or new) …and saying: " i dont like how it feels, where can i change the curves? " Really?
A plane is not a ego-shooter barrel or a photoshop pencil which draws better with less sensitivtiy values, but a physical object which behaviour is commanded by the environmental physical forces only - and if excisting - the flight computer.Furthermore - my opinion if that counts:
Being involved in simulations for over 8 years and being interested in flight-physics aswell, and having flown almost everything what ever was simulated on PC out there… in my humble opinion
Mav-Jp created a flight-model available on a PC with BMS, which is in a quality NO other sim ever has accomplished, not x-plane, not fsx, not il-2 not FC …none of them comes even close.
I could talk hours how miserable made FMs in other sims have been deliberatly exploited to gain unrealistic advantages…but thats another story …long story short… get a proper stick and dont blame the sim
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That is why reading article first is a good idea.
shh DJ, if people read the articles first youll put yourself out of a job!
your job is to correct silly RTFM mistakes constantly, right? I just assumed cause it seems like its a pretty common occurrence…
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… I would like to go on holiday.
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you know,it’s too sensitive in motion joysticks you need to change it. aiming a bomb and landing is too difficult, i end up using 10% of joystick motion to aim.
Speak for yourself. Using a CH Fighterstick since BMS came out. No curves, no dead zone. No problems with close formation flying or A2A refuel, aerobraking… after a couple of weeks training.
Others have answered at lenght why you should not change the curves, if you cared to read. You have also the best documentation on the research of a pc simulation flight model, which you did not care to read obviously. So I’ll not go into that again.
Solutions for you:
1.Practice more
2.Buy a better joystick
3.Find a simulator “easier” to flyCheers
Tulkas
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but you didn’t care about the other section of my message.do you want to help or not?
Ok … I’m gonna try.
plus you haven’t modelled the flight computer right because when i pitch up more than like 10 degrees it starts pitching up by itself and i need down input to keep straight. revise
As you know, you’ve fail. So … in order to help you, my advice is: Help you first -> read manuals and articles explaining how things are working and why applying curves is not a good idea… be curious, do not entirely rely on others ppl to find answers… there are a lot of documents providing helpful informations.
you know,it’s too sensitive in motion joysticks you need to change it. aiming a bomb and landing is too difficult
First … what model of joystick are you using?
Do not expect good results with a 10€ joystick… and I would even say, since BMS is an high end simulator, do not expect perfect results if you are not using force sensors joystick (like COUGAR FSSB, COUGAR FCC, WARTHOG FSSB etc…)
This is also the price to pay for a semi-professional simulator (same story than for graphic card and graphism quality … if you want good result, you will have to spend money… no secret here.)
But some cheaper solutions exist : LOW COST FORCE SENSING
Note also that RL pilot are flying their jet by acting VERY smoothly on their stick…
, stick travel is no more than on a 5 penny coin. Quite the same for landing… … that’s all.i end up using 10% of joystick motion to aim.
This is 100% normal.
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So … you just need more practice … maybe you will have to purchase a better joystick … but nothing is unusual here.
EDIT: I did not paid attention to Tulkas post! … I’m sorry.
So as you can see, we are giving you the same advices. -
Excuse me for the intrusion… this attempt on the
scenario, was recorded back in August 2012, with a Saitek X52.The point isn’t the landing, which by all accounts, was the clumsy result of a total amateur. I’m the worst example of a virtual aviator wannabe. The point, is that it was done with a stick, equipped with Hall Effect sensors. If the OP has to use 10% of stick movement, I have to use less than 5% -and I could still do it.
If there is one, ONE thing I can offer as advice, is eyes on the bird -not the stick.
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Excuse me for the intrusion… this attempt on the
scenario, was recorded back in August 2012, with a Saitek X52.The point isn’t the landing, which by all accounts, was the clumsy result of a total amateur. I’m the worst example of a virtual aviator wannabe. The point, is that it was done with a stick, equipped with Hall Effect sensors. If the OP has to use 10% of stick movement, I have to use less than 5% -and I could still do it.
If there is one, ONE thing I can offer as advice, is eyes the bird -not the stick.
Note to yourself, next time use proper aerobraking
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Note to yourself, next time use proper aerobraking
I would -if I hadn’t spent half the runway, trying to bring her down
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In no other sim did i need to use just 10% of motion to land. i won’t buy a 300$ force joystick to be able to fly only in this game. this is a sim and you try to overrate it.if i was a freak i would join the air force and not play this sim. most of us are just enthousiasts not professionals. i won’t kill myself if the curve isn’t the x^1/58 expo the real thing has. the geeks can still buy fancy equipment to experience this curve.
You’ve already inserted simplified flight options. Why not add this? I’ve already been told that it’s difficult to add but seems like you’re mainly too proud of the original setting -
In no other sim did i need to use just 10% of motion to land. i won’t buy a 300$ force joystick to be able to fly only in this game. this is a sim and you try to overrate it.if i was a freak i would join the air force and not play this sim. most of us are just enthousiasts not professionals. i won’t kill myself if the curve isn’t the x^1/58 expo the real thing has. the geeks can still buy fancy equipment to experience this curve.
You’ve already inserted simplified flight options. Why not add this? I’ve already been told that it’s difficult to add but seems like you’re mainly too proud of the original settingForce sensor or classic joystick, you will have the same issue. As long you as your brain attempt desesperatly to resist to learning how to fly the f16 properly you will fail.
Changing the curve like you wanted to do like flaten the 1 - 3 G area will result in incontroleable AC in the 4- 7 G area where very high precidion t is needed for proper dogfight aiming
Stop fighting the flcs, fly it. Best and only advice i can give you. 99.99% of people have had the same feeling than you at first, 99.99% will now never be back to another joystick curve. You and you only make the choice to remain in the 0.01% not accepting the flcs ….
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In no other sim did i need to use just 10% of motion to land. i won’t buy a 300$ force joystick to be able to fly only in this game. this is a sim and you try to overrate it.if i was a freak i would join the air force and not play this sim. most of us are just enthousiasts not professionals. i won’t kill myself if the curve isn’t the x^1/58 expo the real thing has. the geeks can still buy fancy equipment to experience this curve.
You’ve already inserted simplified flight options. Why not add this? I’ve already been told that it’s difficult to add but seems like you’re mainly too proud of the original settingYou still don’t understand that changing the curve will provoke PIO, engineers have spent months to define and test the best curve to use for this FLCS, you will not find a better curve.
You still don’t understand that no other sim has a real FLCS built in … that is why you can change the curve at will in those…
And i have nothing to be proud about as i am not part of original general dynamics engineer…
If you don’t want to fly this FLCS, just fly simplified model where FLCS is more arcadish …it seems it is more suitable for you
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In no other sim did i need to use just 10% of motion to land. i won’t buy a 300$ force joystick to be able to fly only in this game.
So … if fully satified with other sim. Play it and give up this game.
We will not spend any seconds for you… especially when asked like this. This crappy game is unplayable! Don’t play it!
No big deal my friend.:) -
lol don’t bite!