Harrier Keeps Falling off of Wasp
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I understand. I spawn in on the Wasp that is available in this theatre, and just seeing if anyone else has that problem.
WASP is not ready for carrier ops
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WASP is not ready for carrier ops
Well, thanks Mav, good this too to know in advance, I guess.
With best regards.
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Sorry for necro, (not so old after all) , but…
I’m running Harrier campaign off WASP …about few months… hehe (of course , I edited ‘wasp’ feature a bit for, just little tweak of takeoff/park positions, but nevertheless it is not needed for takeoff from that LHD)
… it is not just the WASP, Harrier is also ‘problematic’ because TTW ratio , too small thrust for the model , had to increase thrust multiplier to 1.3 to have any chance of STOL takeoff
REMEMBER , WASP/Harrier don’t have catapult … so true thrust horse power.
Takeoff from station 6 or 7, end of the ship , near arresting wires , STOL !!!, so put nozzles to 40-50 , parking brake , … pedal to the metal just before 80% rpm so your brakes hold and engines have time to catch-up , when you cros >80% rpm, brakes will release automatically … full thrust
… you need to have at least 80+ kts when leaving ship, immediately gear-up , watch speed rising , and slowly raising nozzles to 0.I can takeoff with 25000+ gross , so don’t over do it …
WASP is not ready for carrier ops
Wasp is more/less ready … Harrier isn’t so much,… Please MaV . Can you look at the thrust table for the model, at thrust multiplier 1.0 there just isn’t needed power/lift even for STOL takeoff.
I’ve had to set multiplier to ~1.3 for STOL with 22-25k gross weight to work … so , … Harrier should even VSTOL with 20-22k gross… WE NEED MOER POWER
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Your technique is off - you should have nozzles full aft and then slam them down to the STO Stop on reaching the end of the takeoff roll. the jet should leap into the air, and you’ll have to stuff some forward stick to keep the nose under control. That’s how it’s done in RL.
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What do you mean OFF? … tho , it seems ‘logical’ … get the speed , then lift.
I’m not saying that you’re wrong!! Harrier has some more then 20 types of takeoff/landings , V/STOL .
That procedure is described in naval BMS manual (tho, not maybe up to standards,… today)
… and I’ve seen it on older movies/clips,… you can see nozzles some degree down when ac departs the deck, so clearly was “thrust-vectoring”Also it is even in DCS … and they swear they’ve copied from natops … see DCS av8b manual… they’ve copied 'bout 10? types.
Here’s video …
I wasn’t even that heavy, 2 mk83, 2 amraams … -
You should be able to RVTO with that load… -1 and -2 are also giving up too much of the deck launching as a four-ship, IMO. Wish that cockpit looked more like a real Harrier…F-16 HUD in an AV8…BLASPHEMY, say I! Harrier doesn’t have a DED either…and from what I’ve seen some people posting of vertical ops the BMS model is quite over-thrusted; dunno if folks have been manipulating that or not.
“OFF” as in not in accordance with RL. My description comes from having operated RL Harriers for about four years in a past life…there is no takeoff procedure as you describe in the AV8B NATOPS - for one, the jet’s brakes simply won’t hold the jet in the manner you describe. You’d slide, heat the tires, blow the fuses out of the tires and pop them.
All takeoff procedures for the AV8B involve the STO Stop, which is set based on takeoff gross, desired takeoff point, and temperature of the day. All takeoff rolls are started with nozzles full aft, and then slammed to the STO Stop on reaching a determined airspeed. What’s missing from all of our throttle is the STO Stop which stops the Nozzle Lever at a pre-set angle. Once fuvlly wing-borne the STO Stop gets moved out of the way - this is reversed on landing; the stop is set to the proper angle for landing depending on the type of landing.
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Meh , now I get it…
Yes, parking brake is my own hack … that’s really OFF , even cause those parking brakes are F16 ones, electrically driven , so that’s why it behaves like I’ve described. They release at 80% thrust or there really could get get ugly for the jet. in rl.
So STO is more like some spring loaded holder , you preset the angle before … then unlock it? or just move the nozzle lever by hand but it will stop where you preset the STO…
I’m off to see what DCS manual says bout it, so I don’t torture you.
Well , BMS Harrier is kinda hackish to the real one… (or dcs one) … but I still love to fly that bird…AAH… ! HUD … yes , but I’ve hacked it just last week, that was earlier video, now there is F18C or F18E hud … but now I miss that Vertical speed tape , cause F18’s has counter for vertical speed , above altitude reading.
And the tape is more like intuitive then the pos/neg number , for VSTOL . eg landing.You should listen those guys, dude’s privately Harrier owner and they do air-shows around the world, both of them are former Harrier flyers.(and they fly without hud , you’ll hear’em say that in podcast) … Well… they were borned in that plane … so … could be they’ve developed the feeling for her
Cheers
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The STO Stop is an actual physical detent/stop - with a spring loaded lift. There are physical holes at increments of 5 or 10 degrees (can’t recall which) that the lift knob will engage that will stop/limit the Nozzle Lever throw. This makes it possible to drop the nozzles to a pre-determined setting based on target takeoff numbers. Once airborne you move it out of the way to get full throw back.
I haven’t flown it, but the DCS Harrier looks really good from what I’ve seen…in fact, it may become a fav of mine someday. The Night Attack one anyway, because that was what I used to work on. I’m just the opposite of you - really don’t like the tapes so always I set up my HUD to have numbers in boxes. The thing that’s missing here is that a Harrier has four Master Modes - A/A, A/G, NAV, and VSTOL. In VSTOL there’s a “witches hat” that you line up to the top of the Velocity Vector…then you simply adjust throttle to set up a decent or climb. In VSTOL mode I do seem to recall that the altitude actually does transition from a number to a tape within some distance from the ground…I’ll have to get reacquainted. Your parking brake coming free at 80% is an F-16 thing…a RL Harrier doesn’t do that. Things like this always point out to someone that knows an aircraft just how much is missing from the BMS models…that’s why I stick strictly to the BMS Viper.
I’ll listen to the podcast a bit later, but if it’s the privately owned Harrier flying in/out of Maryland I know that guy - used to work with him back in the 80s when he was a USMC Harrier Test Pilot, so yeah.
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Yep, that’s the guy(s), there are 2 of them, of course one is the owner, but they both fly. Mostly interesting stuff, they talk a lot. He’s actually the only one who had that “luck” to do a flameout landing., lol, they say: it was a court marshal or commendation.
I miss that hud hover mode mnemonics very much… I recall from “Longbow 2” (ah64 sim) , something like that would be appreciated., I tell you that the tape is more intuitive then numbers, so I’ve kept it… but biggest problem is Vcas readout on hud.
…it doesn’t show for less then 50kts , so I put DED on hud , and use LIST + 6 , INS(calib) page , there’s true speed readout from 0 , but it wont show negative… its positive in all directions, even sideways. … so yeah … Hover mod hud would really be nice.Cheers
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…heh…I had to explain to a USN pilot that was off flying Vipers a bit ago that there is a way to get the tapes (and the DED) OFF the HUD and how to do it. Personally, I never put the DED on the HUD either…there isn’t one in any USN aircraft that I know of.