How long did it take you to learn AAR?
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Years.
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This Picturesaving mentioned by Lazy is very very effective. I just had problems with the KC-135 after I always trained with the KC-10.
Another Tip, Dee-Jay gave me once: Turn off your HUD and join the Tanker from an echelon left position after that get to precontact and contact. Turning off the HUD helps a lot and encreases the “feeling” for formation flying a lot, as you focus at your relative positon to the tanker and not to the speed/pitch/alt indications. Will help you in normal formation flying too.
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I have found AAR to be difficult with keeping an eye on the tanker and boom at the same time. Also the jet wash from the tanker makes things a bit tricky with regards to stick input. I do have a suggestion. Perhaps have a “padlock” feature for refueling. The “padlock” focus is on the boom with retrospect to the underside of the tanker. You can keep an eye on the boom and the director lights simultaneously. Just a suggestion.
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I’ve been practicing this everyday for 2 weeks now dedicating an hour or 2 just to this TE and I still haven’t made a single successful contact. I’ve gotten the boom operator to like my pre-contact position a couple of times and granting me permission to push into position though. It’s still a battle to get there and admittedly it still seems more like luck than skill at this point. Your videos all make it look so easy of getting up to the boom and then flying in. I have gotten quite adept at “kissing my career goodbye” in a variety of fashions however just before I flameout On the upside that’s A-A weapons employment training right there!
Practice as they say but how much practice does it generally require before one is behind the curve? What was the average, from when you first started trying, it took you to get your first successful refuel and then get good at it? 10 hours? 50 hours? 100 hours of practice?
Two hours over two weeks definitely not enough! Recommend you watch utube videos repeatedly to pick up the nuances and practice/learn with the HUD turned off. Just keep at it, you’ll eventually get it. The hook ups will become routine and you’ll have also mastered following the tanker around while its in a turn.
Next…flying ILS landing heads down instruments only and/or in bad weather!
F1
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The biggest thing to remember that around the tanker EVERYTHING is relative to what you’re doing. He’s flying a known variable – 300 knots. From there all we need to do is fly relative airspeeds to position ourself around the tanker. 305 knots we are closing and 295 knots we increase spacing. Approx 2 knots closure is really all you need to safely move from pre-contact to contact. Follow the director lights forward and finally once they go blank you are in position. Hold position and fly smoothly. The hard part is now over.
Now all you have to do is let the boomer connect to you!! This is the most important part. Most think of AAR in terms of connecting to the boom when the reality is the boom connects to you! So once you’re in position stay there and let the boomer do his job.
If you flip your mindset in this regard you’ll find that refueling the F-16 aerially is ultimately really not that hard. Finally there is no replacement for stick time so get out there and keeping practicing! Falcon is a marathon not a race. Savor the learning it’s so rewarding.
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I do AAR less these days since the code is pretty stable at this point and I haven’t messed with it for a while (hmm, perhaps I should just to give all the experts some new challenge ;)). Nonetheless, I still think I probably have more AAR hours in Falcon than anyone else on the planet. Giving tips is hard though…what works for some doesn’t work for others judging by my conversations with people working on AAR proficiency.
FWIW, the things that help me most are: ignoring the boom completely once past clearance to contact and trying to stay relaxed and trusting my eyes will translate to what my hands do. I maintain soft focus on the tanker fuselage, engine nacelles and the PDI lights and just try to keep the overall picture I see of these relative to each other the same once in position. If you don’t know what that should look like, let CombatAP fly an AAR for you – it does a pretty good job of driving you to all the right places for AAR and you can memorize and try to replicate what it does when you are in control…master that and AAR is a snap. Best tip I got on staying relaxed was from a USAF pilot with actual AAR experience: wiggle fingers and toes regularly throughout the evolution…it’s practically impossible to have your arms and hands be tense if you do that and relaxed shoulders, arms and hands let your eyes be in charge of inputs to throttle and stick.
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just try to remember the closure speed difference that is mentioned on the AAR manual(bms/docs) and will get easy peasy
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I do AAR less these days since the code is pretty stable at this point and I haven’t messed with it for a while (hmm, perhaps I should just to give all the experts some new challenge ;)).
Probe-and-drogue air-to-air refueling system including wind/turbulence effects on the basket ?
Mark, do you remember when you told me to thank you later for the new (4.32) AAR code?
Like I said above, I still love it , so thank you for rewriting it.
Cheers,
LS -
Takes continual practice to minimise hook up time - as has been mentioned in other texts, Korea theatre does not always necessitate tanking so perhaps needs Training TE regularly instead of relying on it may come up in Mission TE or Campaign. What comes up time and again though is SMALL adjustment of joystick and throttle - perhaps try using fingertips only for movement instead of grasping with hand - smaller movements become easier that way.
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I do AAR less these days since the code is pretty stable at this point and I haven’t messed with it for a while (hmm, perhaps I should just to give all the experts some new challenge ;)). Nonetheless, I still think I probably have more AAR hours in Falcon than anyone else on the planet. Giving tips is hard though…what works for some doesn’t work for others judging by my conversations with people working on AAR proficiency.
FWIW, the things that help me most are: ignoring the boom completely once past clearance to contact and trying to stay relaxed and trusting my eyes will translate to what my hands do. I maintain soft focus on the tanker fuselage, engine nacelles and the PDI lights and just try to keep the overall picture I see of these relative to each other the same once in position. If you don’t know what that should look like, let CombatAP fly an AAR for you – it does a pretty good job of driving you to all the right places for AAR and you can memorize and try to replicate what it does when you are in control…master that and AAR is a snap. Best tip I got on staying relaxed was from a USAF pilot with actual AAR experience: wiggle fingers and toes regularly throughout the evolution…it’s practically impossible to have your arms and hands be tense if you do that and relaxed shoulders, arms and hands let your eyes be in charge of inputs to throttle and stick.
well if you claim to be in first place for hours logged, i certainly get the second place
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well if you claim to be in first place for hours logged, i certainly get the second place
No argument from me, Mr. Torsor!
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(hmm, perhaps I should just to give all the experts some new challenge ;)).
The only way from here is FWD
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The boom is childs play compared to the basket…hope one day we can have that challenge.
BMS looks unlikely for now and I know its alot of work. Next in line might be DCSW Bug and CV ops bringing us the challenge of the basket.
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The boom is childs play compared to the basket…hope one day we can have that challenge.
BMS looks unlikely for now and I know its alot of work. Next in line might be DCSW Bug and CV ops bringing us the challenge of the basket.
dont tease me.
dcs is for babys -
I recommend first mastering flying solo but at 300 kts, 20,000ft on a fixed heading say 000 degs to get a feel for managing the jet in the fwd/back, up/down planes of geometry. Get familiar with adjusting engine power so you can add or subtract a knot or 2, and if you go up/down see how you have to compensate for gain/loss of speed as you do with slight power adjustments.
Once you can keep all 3 parameters in check, force small changes in say speed or height, and then quickly correct with slight adjustments and you’ll nail AAR.
Keep a ‘picture’ of the tanker in view and adjust power and controls so the ‘picture’ stays the same. Don’t focus on the boom.
BTW took me years
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It took me several weeks of practice each night after work to be able to hook up. I found it helped to keep flying in formation with the tanker off to each side too while the AI took their turns hooking up. i still have to practice regularly or I get rusty.
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You must do something wrong mate.
My two cents advices are (I don’t think they are worth more
1. Don’t fly formation with the boom in pre contact but with the tanker.
2. Remeber the mental picture of how the engines and wing look like when you are approved for contact.
3. Don’t look at the HUD and especially not at the FPM…watch the tanker the whole time.
4. Fix and relate the tanker to your cocpit and watch if it move around and at what rate…fix it where it should be.
5. Fly with someone…if you want just PM me and I’ll be more than glad to guide you through…for all it needs is just some good advices from some good mates…
6. If push comes to shove you can do one of two last options:
a. Shoot the bugger (it’s such a pleasure when you think that it’s doing it on purpose).
b. Close your eyes. -
I have always told people who are having a hard time refueling that it isn’t that you can’t refuel. You haven’t mastered your stick and throttle. All the tricks in the book will not help you, but make it more confusing. If you want to learn, do it with all visual ques. Learn how your jet responds to your inputs, and watch for your momentum change. Learn to anticipate when to reverse or slow your momentum. Use your fingertips on the stick and throttle and make very small inputs. Give it time to react. Don’t be in a rush. And then after you feel comfortable you hear “Heads up, Tanker entering turn” And that’s the next challenge. Keep practicing, you will get it.
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Thank you all for the advice! Hearing from your experience it’s refreshing to know I’m not retarted and that it really can take so long. I’ve read many times it’s not easy and I expected it not to be a cake walk. But maaaannnn it’s no exaggeration how hard it can be just to get to a point where it all clicks. I thought in days of practice after work and not weeks. I won’t quit. I don’t think I’ve had as much difficulty (but fun difficulty!) or spent as long a time in achieving even just the first steps of a skill as I have on this but it’s good effort and the challenge is the fun.
I wonder IRL when pilots learn to refuel how do they do it without endangering themselves and the crew? Its a given they’re already good at their stick and throttle but I Imagine the fine micro adjustments and micromanagement to keep it from all going away from you from second to second within such small tolerances takes more than basic skill and experience. I can say I’ve had good approaches where everything looks great and then things get away and I clipped through the boom/tanker many times when I was first trying it which can’t happen in real life. do they spend hundreds of hours learning close formation flying before attempting their first refuel and if they don’t get good at close formation flying within say 2 months of time they get washed out of training? Then they spend even more time in a sim to check if they can consistently hook up before going up for real?