Detecting missiles & shooting it down?
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@white_fang said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@Foxtrot701 Uuuh… Good Luck catching SAM on radar from 1980’s.
You’ve opened a different can of worms.
Give it a thought first , then read some… Working principles of radar.
Start here. - then continue to a much smaller radar / much smaller target.About basics of radars.
About SAM radars and SAMs.
Soon will be a video about stealth and radar eq. to help to understand better radars. Some time in the future also will be explained the lobe forming and lobe size of the radars by their design. Also their sweep time will have some comments.
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@white_fang said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@sheref Ah , no mate. You really CAN detect cruise missiles , anti-ship missiles and shoot it down in RL.
Of course, they are really small targets so need to be kinda fast and close, but , eg. slow (subsonic) anti-ship cruise missile, (agm-84, tomahawk)… you can blast it out of sky with amraam/sidewinder/gun just nice. - why… you’re faster then them.
That was originally an idea since F-14 … of course bomber first, then “leakers” .
But launching parameters are really a bitch on missiles, especially supersonic… almost none - very small launching window - and only front quarters, intercept … from rear , would need to be right behind it , matter of seconds.
Flak barrage? Definitely not economical but my guess it’s doable. Even the kinzhal missile could be stopped this way, right.
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Sounds like land-launched AMRAAMs (NASAMS) are being deployed to Ukraine, with targeting from MPQ-64 Sentinel system. So we’ll all have a lot of hard data soon, re how they do against Kaliber cruise missiles.
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@bbostjan said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@white_fang said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@sheref Ah , no mate. You really CAN detect cruise missiles , anti-ship missiles and shoot it down in RL.
Of course, they are really small targets so need to be kinda fast and close, but , eg. slow (subsonic) anti-ship cruise missile, (agm-84, tomahawk)… you can blast it out of sky with amraam/sidewinder/gun just nice. - why… you’re faster then them.
That was originally an idea since F-14 … of course bomber first, then “leakers” .
But launching parameters are really a bitch on missiles, especially supersonic… almost none - very small launching window - and only front quarters, intercept … from rear , would need to be right behind it , matter of seconds.
> Flak barrage? Definitely not economical but my guess it’s doable. Even the kinzhal missile could be stopped this way, right.
No, and no.
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@Aragorn said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@molnibalage said:
No, and no.
By this, do you mean “yes”…?
Yes. No or no means no, no and no means yes.
No?
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@LorikEolmin That’s a hard “maybe”.
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@Aragorn said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@LorikEolmin That’s a hard “maybe”.
Nah and nah… I mean, yeah…
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@Aragorn said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@molnibalage said:
No, and no.
By this, do you mean “yes”…?
AAA is ineffective against BMs.
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@molnibalage Why? Is this just pure logic or has this somehow been proved anytime in history? I mean it would be stupid, definitely to try to stop one missile and definitely sci-fi, still if you had concentrated enough firepower there’s no way a missile could break through. It’s like anti-sub bombs, right?
I am definitely all theoretical here, not presuming I have any idea how flak works (or deep sea bombs for that matter). -
@bbostjan The most effective weapon against BM is an air defense system with a kinetic interceptor. Shrapnel and AAA are ineffective, they do not have such damage to destroy the BMs, especially their warheads.
Don’t even try to stop an APC in a civilian car.
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@bbostjan
https://www.quora.com/What-is-your-opinion-on-the-SeaRAM-missile-based-CIWS-How-does-it-compare-to-gun-based-CIWS-like-the-20mm-Phalanx-and-30mm-Goalkeeper-How-good-is-the-SeaRAM-at-shooting-down-drone-swarms-and-the-latest-anti-ship/answer/Balázs-Molnár-28?filter=5&nsrc=1&sncid=5320534987&snid3=8462810626Here it is explained shortly. The targets are simply too fast and too small.
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@Aragorn RCS/DCS - who cares , the point is “when you see the flash, it’s already too late”
@Foxtrot701 Eh, mate. RCS is whole different ballgame on aspect.
From sides, eg SA5, is a “telephone pole” … from rear, front … is a 0.5m diameter “pointed circle/ - cone”. - not much of a target in essence.
Then there’s trajectory.
When in pure ascending stage, it covers so fast so much altitude, almost vertically, that Doppler is ineffective. - mechanical antenna is just too slow.In horizontal stage it is a “cone” mentioned above, so that much RCS is like a medium drone size… even smaller.
And there is its speed… remember it is a long range missile… it’s NOT slow.
On doppler radar you could get a blip , even is … (what’s the name of the radar mode with speed in the waterfall) … but… then is gone.
If radar is not preset with right PRF it would just “filter it out” , maybe as an interference.I am not talking about awacs/sar radars , but older pulse APG series, which we have in BMS.
So detecting even a LARGE sam missile … NO - NO (maybe )
-maybe one blip before you die -
@Aragorn said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@molnibalage said:
AAA is ineffective against BMs.
Yes. But what about DCs…?
LOl…
I remember someone in DCS talking about shooting a SA-10 with guns, so, I wouldn’t bet.
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@white_fang said:
@Aragorn RCS/DCS - who cares , the point is “when you see the flash, it’s already too late”
I tear up with pride when my jokes are not quite… gotten.
My cup runneth over.
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@Aragorn I am an EXPERT in misunderstanding jokes and creating confusion
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@white_fang said:
I am an EXPERT in… creating confusion
And… making people angry…?
Yes. I have been following your posts across various contentious threads…! Hee hee.
BAD wolf…!
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@Aragorn said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@molnibalage said:
AAA is ineffective against BMs.
Yes. But what about DCs…?
DC?
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@molnibalage said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@Aragorn said in Detecting missiles & shooting it down?:
@molnibalage said:
AAA is ineffective against BMs.
Yes. But what about DCs…?
DC?
DCS. DCs. You wrote BMs.