Do we develop the F-35
-
@Migbuster said in Do we develop the F-35:
I will have to check later - seems strange that they were developed and tested before the CD came about. I think Israeli ABs could carry them but will have to check.
I checked about 11 years ago. I found the same info that Israelis modified some (?) their F-15A/Bs. But they were the exceptions. The fuel system diagrams come from FMs which were released in 1984.
-
I’m curious how CFT’s and drag relate in ventral arrangements like the Viper and Super Hornet. What I’ve read indicates that in the SH it decreases drag, compared to drop tanks.
While the US Navy has shelved (or so it seems) CFT’s on the Block III SH, that was due to sustainability issues and not performance“The particular design of the CFTs that conform well into the Rhino’s center “barrel” fuselage section and leading-edge root extension (LERX) high-lift device also reduces interference drag that is quite ubiquitous to be found around the strike fighter’s design alongside other features that generate wave drag, this is primarily attributed to the design philosophy of the F/A-18 series that prioritizes “high angles” maneuverability rather than speed. Hence the aircraft is not area ruled unlike its contemporary rival the General Dynamics / Lockheed Martin F-16 Fighting Falcon which can penetrate the sound barrier easier. One of the most visible locations where interference drag is prevalent on the F/A-18 series is the “crease” between the fuselage “barrel” and the LERX-es where these two airframe features meet. The reduction of interference drag by the CFTs means that its installation increases subsonic speeds acceleration of the aircraft and also increases fuel efficiency”. Source-https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/fa-18ef-super-hornet-why-its-conformal-fuel-tanks-muhammad-faza
-
@Radium - coolness…I figured I was probably wrong. Interesting to note in this pic that these don’t have all of the hard points that the ones on a typical E model do… it’s a retrofit job to plumb these in for an A or C, or even an early E, so it’s possible.
-
@drtbkj - like most things aero it’s all a matter of the shape, and where/how they are mounted. In the case of the Eagle the squareness of the jet factors as Interference Drag, and the Conformals help blend that out a bit.
I would expect that the Viper and the Super Hornet Conformals are or of similar in effect to each other, in that the top sides of both of those jets are fairly blended. I used to work with the Test Pilot that did a lot of the flying for the Super Hornet Conformals, but I didn’t spend any time talking to him about them, really.
As for “sustainability” in the case of the Super Hornet - it was really more of a matter of maintainability. There is a lot of equipment located in the LEXs and under the spine that requires access for maintenance, and having to remove the Conformals to get to those bays - particularly at sea - was deemed to be an inefficiency in contrast to how much fuel those tanks actually hold - and it’s not nearly as much as the fraction for the Eagle ones. With a single engine the Viper is far more efficient in its burn down, and so its Conformals make a far bigger contribution, I should think.
Plus I’ve had the chance to stand in a RL Vipers empty engine bay and note that there’s no way anything but fuel bags could located be beneath those Conformals!
-
@molnibalage, you see, I have no issue to admit when I am wrong in my judgement (private message).
Just found this :
F-15Es of the 48th Fighter Wing based at RAF Lakenheath, England, have traditionally had their CFTs removed for the long ferry flight back to the U.S. for scheduled depot-level maintenance at Warner-Robins Air Logistics Center. The CFTs are removed because they have a fairly high drag coefficient, with the reduced fuel capacity offset by the use of dedicated inflight refueling tanker aircraft for the long flights. One pilot said: “When you are sky-hopping somewhere, you can fly much higher and burn less fuel without the CFTs fitted.”
Source : Click here
I take this source pretty legit, and the whole article is very interesting and well documented.
Radium
-
Okay maybe that was what I was thinking of…I have more than one photo of Israeli F-15A and B in a book with CFTs but they are not dated so presumably these were modified at some point and are a unique case.
-
@Stevie said in Do we develop the F-35:
Interesting to note in this pic that these don’t have all of the hard points that the ones on a typical E model do
The articles I have discuss there being different versions. States -2 and -3 were used by the F-15CDs in the 80s and “All F-15Es will be equipped with the latest version the -4 with tangential weapons carriage in the near future” Which is also shown in the manual charts above.
-
@Migbuster - That’s perfectly believable/understandable. And as such they all have differing performance impact…so there are several answers, and not just one.
-
@Radium - I’ll believe this too…and I’ll also believe that these are all ones with hard points on them.
-
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/no-conformal-fuel-tanks-for-first-f-15ex-operational-units
They just don’t like CFT’s on F-15C’s
-
@spectrclaw said in Do we develop the F-35:
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/no-conformal-fuel-tanks-for-first-f-15ex-operational-units
They just don’t like CFT’s on F-15C’s
Later they can get it. Last time I read somewhere in 2024.
(If you ask me, the whole F-15EX project is simply funny, and especially the reasoning which many ppl. are saying to justify the acquisition.)
-
@molnibalage said in Do we develop the F-35:
@spectrclaw said in Do we develop the F-35:
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/no-conformal-fuel-tanks-for-first-f-15ex-operational-units
They just don’t like CFT’s on F-15C’s
Later they can get it. Last time I read somewhere in 2024.
(If you ask me, the whole F-15EX project is simply funny, and especially the reasoning which many ppl. are saying to justify the acquisition.)
Meme stolen from pantherdrivermemes on Instagram…F-15EXs are missile trucks, decoys, in theory cheaper to operate 4.5 gen and less wear and tear on the fragile 5th gens. Hi-Low mix kinda like what the original intent of the Viper was. Unfortunately, Vipers don’t have the missile load out and the size of the F-15 nose means its always going to have more powerful radar, so it was really the best pick for the USAF. I’m also really interested as IRST and other things become more and more capable how 5th Gen stays stealthy because they do not have the built IR shielding like the F-117 does for instance. But maybe that’s the “chromed” surfaces we are seeing on F-22/F-35/and even F-117s
-
@spectrclaw - actually, what you don’t want on you at the merge is 5 extra tons of anything…so if your primary mission is A/A, you’re going to leave them on the deck.
-
@Snake122 said in Do we develop the F-35:
@molnibalage said in Do we develop the F-35:
@spectrclaw said in Do we develop the F-35:
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/no-conformal-fuel-tanks-for-first-f-15ex-operational-units
They just don’t like CFT’s on F-15C’s
Later they can get it. Last time I read somewhere in 2024.
(If you ask me, the whole F-15EX project is simply funny, and especially the reasoning which many ppl. are saying to justify the acquisition.)
Meme stolen from pantherdrivermemes on Instagram…F-15EXs are missile trucks, decoys, in theory cheaper to operate 4.5 gen and less wear and tear on the fragile 5th gens. Hi-Low mix kinda like what the original intent of the Viper was. Unfortunately, Vipers don’t have the missile load out and the size of the F-15 nose means its always going to have more powerful radar, so it was really the best pick for the USAF. I’m also really interested as IRST and other things become more and more capable how 5th Gen stays stealthy because they do not have the built IR shielding like the F-117 does for instance. But maybe that’s the “chromed” surfaces we are seeing on F-22/F-35/and even F-117s
This meme is utterly stupid.
A non stealth plane does not enable anything for stealth plane.
The reality is just the opposite… -
Hey y’all. Been hearing about the F-35 forum for months now and it’s still in my head, not letting me to look at other aircraft except the F-35(for me it’s the only fighter I love in the world). I have a few questions about the development of the F-35A and what features will be included in the near future. The first question I’d like to ask is, will there be liveries for the current air forces and for the air forces that will require them in the upcoming years(like the HAF)?
-
@LIGHTNING35 it can only exist as a 3D shell with f-16 systems for now…
BMS is a 2000 era game and will stay
-
@MaxWaldorf That’s fine. Irl, the F-35 had used F-16 systems for testing in the early block stages. I think.
-
@LIGHTNING35 said in Do we develop the F-35:
Hey y’all. Been hearing about the F-35 forum for months now and it’s still in my head, not letting me to look at other aircraft except the F-35(for me it’s the only fighter I love in the world). I have a few questions about the development of the F-35A and what features will be included in the near future. The first question I’d like to ask is, will there be liveries for the current air forces and for the air forces that will require them in the upcoming years(like the HAF)?
Hi, Lightning. In the OFM Family of Theaters we’ve focused a bit more on the F-35C, but hopefully that can trickle down to the A. We are looking at it as we suspect the A may be involved in some stability issues we’ve seen. Meanwhile, we invite you to check out the A and give us your feedback.
As for skins, go over to the Community Mods sections, skins and textures and see what’s there. You can request skins there, as well. -
A f-35 pit (rather than the f-22) would be awesome! Helipack with heli pits and/or Gripen would be great too:) It doesn’t matter if everything doesn’t work (all the buttons) to begin with…
Thanks for all your great work, I’m happy with what I got:)
But, yeah, I sometimes play BMS 4.33, just for the sake of Gripen (with a Viggen pit). -
@AKH said in Do we develop the F-35:
A f-35 pit (rather than the f-22) would be awesome! Helipack with heli pits and/or Gripen would be great too:) It doesn’t matter if everything doesn’t work (all the buttons) to begin with…
Thanks for all your great work, I’m happy with what I got:)
But, yeah, I sometimes play BMS 4.33, just for the sake of Gripen (with a Viggen pit).Hi, AKH, I’m with you, Brother. It would be an amazing present if a good cockpit builder(s) would " join the Mob". We could do a lot with a lot of jets.