Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR
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Hi all
I was just flying along on a DEAD at about 1500ft and had a A with two small dots under it showing on the RWR.
I knew it was triple A and started to jink a bit but had to visual on tracers being fired at me. I resumed my course towards the SA2 site and after a min of flying fairly straight and level, all my instruments went out and the engine began to spool down along with several warnings.
I knew I had been hit and the debrief confirmed it. I had no warnings per say, just all of a sudden, nothing.
Any ideas as to what may have happened and why I was shot down so quickly? May I should have jinked more and kept the A symbol on the the left or right of the RWR circle?
Thanks
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@CaptCanada
At low altitude, in 99 percent of the cases, it’s a portable manpad.
They have infrared aquisition, so you won’t get a warning before the hit.
Whenever there are units or troops around, expect manpads.
They fit in any VW beetle trunk. -
What shot you was NOT AAA it was an SA-19. Deadliest SHORAD EVER
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@CaptCanada said in Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR:
I knew I had been hit and the debrief confirmed it. I had no warnings per say, just all of a sudden, nothing.
What exactly did the debrief say?
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Sometimes, the pea shooters just get lucky. There is no RWR warning associated with bullets flying at Mach 2+. And remember… incoming fire has right of way. Record your flights. ACMI reveals all.
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@AviationPlus Thanks for the info. I’ll look it up in the threat guide. I just assumed that since it was A, it was anti aircraft guns.
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@Atlas Here is the debrief.txt file, appended
Not sure why it shows as a training mission, when it was a campaign mission I flew?
RECORD BEGIN TIMESTAMP 3/19/2024 16:57:06.
Game is Campaign type Local
Mission name: TR_BMS_12_HarmMission Type: DEAD
Flight Unique Id: Bulldog5
2 Ship Flight
Ac type: F-16CM-50
Contry: U.S.FLIGHT EVENTS
Event RattleHead joined as Bulldog51 at 10:34:00
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:03
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:03
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:03
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:03
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:04
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:04
Event Bulldog52 ejected at 11:12:04
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:04
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:04
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:05
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:05
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:05
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:05
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:06
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:06
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:06
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:06
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:07
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:07
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:07
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:07
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:08
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:08
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:08
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:08
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:09
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:09
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:09
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:09
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:10
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:10
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:10
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:10
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:11
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:11
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:11
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:11
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:12
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:12
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:12
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:12
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:13
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:13
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:13
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:13
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:14
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:14
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:14
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:14
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:15
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:15
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:15
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:15
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:16
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:16
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:16
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:16
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:17
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:17
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:17
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:17
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:18
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:18
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:18
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:19
Event RattleHead ejected at 11:12:19
Event RattleHead exited from Bulldog51 at 11:12:26
PILOT SLOT 1:
Human Player: 2Lt. Don Cathcart
Callsign: RattleHead
Pilot status - MIA
Aircraft status - DESTROYED
AA Kills 0
AG Kills 0
AS Kills 0
AN Kills 0
Shoot At 64
Other Player Kills 0WEAPON DATA
LOADOUT 0: 20mm M61
Starting Load 510
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0LOADOUT 1: AIM-120B AMRAAM
Starting Load 2
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0LOADOUT 2: AIM-9X Sidewinder
Starting Load 2
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0LOADOUT 3: AGM-88 HARM
Starting Load 2
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0LOADOUT 4: Tank 370gal
Starting Load 2
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0LOADOUT 5: AN/ALQ-184
Starting Load 1
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0LOADOUT 6: AN/ASQ-213 HTS
Starting Load 1
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0 -
This post is deleted! -
@CaptCanada
Looks like a ZSU-23 got you before any MANPAD. Low flying is always extremely dangerous. -
@CaptCanada said in Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR:
Hi all
I was just flying along on a DEAD at about 1500ft and had a A with two small dots under it showing on the RWR.
I knew it was triple A and started to jink a bit but had to visual on tracers being fired at me. I resumed my course towards the SA2 site and after a min of flying fairly straight and level, all my instruments went out and the engine began to spool down along with several warnings.
I knew I had been hit and the debrief confirmed it. I had no warnings per say, just all of a sudden, nothing.
Any ideas as to what may have happened and why I was shot down so quickly? May I should have jinked more and kept the A symbol on the the left or right of the RWR circle?
Thanks
RWR is not a 100% accurate tool and also can have delay. As I know this is modeled in BMS4.37.
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@molnibalage said in Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR:
@CaptCanada said in Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR:
Hi all
I was just flying along on a DEAD at about 1500ft and had a A with two small dots under it showing on the RWR.
I knew it was triple A and started to jink a bit but had to visual on tracers being fired at me. I resumed my course towards the SA2 site and after a min of flying fairly straight and level, all my instruments went out and the engine began to spool down along with several warnings.
I knew I had been hit and the debrief confirmed it. I had no warnings per say, just all of a sudden, nothing.
Any ideas as to what may have happened and why I was shot down so quickly? May I should have jinked more and kept the A symbol on the the left or right of the RWR circle?
Thanks
RWR is not a 100% accurate tool and also can have delay. As I know this is modeled in BMS4.37.
And should you have a “launch warning” with a ZSU at all? I don’t really remember because I always fly high. I thought the A @CaptCanada mentions is all you get.
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@Atze-0 said in Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR:
@molnibalage said in Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR:
@CaptCanada said in Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR:
Hi all
I was just flying along on a DEAD at about 1500ft and had a A with two small dots under it showing on the RWR.
I knew it was triple A and started to jink a bit but had to visual on tracers being fired at me. I resumed my course towards the SA2 site and after a min of flying fairly straight and level, all my instruments went out and the engine began to spool down along with several warnings.
I knew I had been hit and the debrief confirmed it. I had no warnings per say, just all of a sudden, nothing.
Any ideas as to what may have happened and why I was shot down so quickly? May I should have jinked more and kept the A symbol on the the left or right of the RWR circle?
Thanks
RWR is not a 100% accurate tool and also can have delay. As I know this is modeled in BMS4.37.
And should you have a “launch warning” with a ZSU at all? I don’t really remember because I always fly high. I thought the A @CaptCanada mentions is all you get.
In RL optical target tracking is also possible. Of course it is far more inaccurate but the system has this feature. I do not know how is modeled the AAA in BMS4.37.
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@CaptCanada said in Shot down by AAA without any warning, other than A on RWR:
Event 23mm AAA launched at RattleHead 11:12:04
Event Bulldog52 ejected at 11:12:04Looks like it was indeed AAA and not MANPADs or other threats as some have suggested.
Having said that, do you not use TacView?
Even for successful missions, reviewing your ACMI via TacView can show you things you’ve never thought of, like that IR missile fired at you just as you were doing your low pass or when exactly that A-A missile broke lock. Well worth the price of admission and a lot of learning to be had just by reviewing your ACMIs. -
The A with two dots is the only warning you’ll get. It tells you that there is a ZSU in a certain direction and that you’re being tracked, but doesn’t give you information about distance and there’s no RWR indication that you’re being fired at either.
The ZU-23 doesn’t even have a radar and can kill you out of complete nowhere, though it’s also less accturate.
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I guess someone hasn’t watched “Flight of the Intruder” for quite a long time …
Do not mess with Shilkas or you gonna end up being messed up badly …