Lock granularity, bubbles, shaders, texture filtering
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Nothing have to be fixed. This is a feature, this is the price of dynamic campaign. Buy a supercomptuer and you can forget the bubble. Most of players do not have supercompter. In annoys you BMS4 fly DCS and do not complain…
It’s the price of Microprose coding. But not to be too hard on them, it’s one of the very first threaded games. Things are done differently nowadays, but that comes with years of experience.
We just want to avoid code leak and troublemaker.
What’s with the mindset? A “leak”? You seem to be awfully possessive of the code for little reason. It’s just a frame of mind…
Yeah, code’s yours. But that doesn’t make you any less possessive…
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It’s the price of Microprose coding. But not to be too hard on them, it’s one of the very first threaded games. Things are done differently nowadays, but that comes with years of experience.
Yo do not have to code. Change the bubble distance and be happy with the lower FPS.
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Or fix the damn thing and let everyone have proper FPS.
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I have a few observations which I’ll follow up with an idea. Please understand that these are my opinions, and I don’t suffer from the problem of thinking I’m right all the time. At least that’s what I tell everyone
First, as a professional software engineer with almost two decades of experience I can say that Falcon BMS as it stands is an outstanding sim and piece of software. I refer to the results, or end-product as I’ve never seen the actual code. Yes there are limitations, a few design mistakes, bugs, and a lot that’s out of date etc, but infinite perfection would require infinite time and infinite money. This is a niche market and so it requires the work of enthusiasts, because as a business venture this segment has never been a cash cow.
I know that without the excellent work - for free - by the BMS team, there would simply be no comparable sim. DCS is wonderful, but it doesn’t compete in the fast multi-role fighter category unless you include Flaming Cliffs which I classify as a game and not a sim. What’s more, even with steady income and a small but reliable market it’s going to take DCS a long time to release their F15/F18 alternative. They’re not even going to have their new terrain engine ready until early next year.
Right now, in my opinion and I think that of many other people, Falcon BMS is the very best fast multi-role fighter sim available. And that in my mind both stands testiment to the quality of the original code and also justifies the develeopers choices about how they handle their project and team members.
That doesn’t mean theirs is the only correct opinion though. There does seem to a growing desire to be part of this line of development by different people and for different reasons. Some are eager to contribute their knowledge from their particular field of expertise, others want to help increase the speed at which BMS improves, and yet others want to replace the aging parts of the engine with more modern and up-to-date alternatives.
So my big idea, which isn’t new or original in any way, is this: Why don’t this group gather together and start building the world’s first truly open source combat sim, modern, and from the ground up. Open source software is making huge strides these days and I personally believe it is already the dominant software platform if you consider all categories of computing. This would give the community the ability to build and contribute exactly as they desire. I myself would contribute as and when time and interest allowed. But also, and I think vitally, it would add another competator to what is still a very small market. More variety might bring more and more diverse interest. Competing or co-existing products often learn from each other and so this could create a larger pool of ideas, and finally this may yet end up in BMS. For example; if the open source sim had a new and capable world engine and licenced the source liberally with, say, the MIT licence instead of the GPL, then there would be no reason that BMS couldn’t use that very engine to upgrade Falcon.
To the BMS team: You guys are my heroes! To those who want to add-build-innovate: You guys can, if you dare to dream, rewrite the future as YOU want it to be, and be even bigger heroes. As for me, I’m just grateful I still have my Falcon 4.0 box!
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My personal opinion for those who may care to know it:
sthalik’s argument that it would be easy to fix parts of the code is undermined by his statements that the code is antiquated and inefficient with, in his words, “global variables, cross-references and other trash, a mixture of ancient kindergarten C++ and old-style non-standard C that makes Fortran programmers blush.”
I am not a programmer nor a do I understand much of how the code operates, but IMO if there are cross-references throughout the code then “fixing” a portion will no doubt impact another portion.
I have watched and appreciated sthalik’s work on the headless server as well as his work on the binary files, but I believe fixing the bubble issue would likely entail more than 10 minute’s work.
Moreover, I have a great deal of confidence in the current BMS team and their commitment to excellence and detail. Do I wish they would move more quickly? Yes. Do I understand why they do not always move quickly? Yes. Am I still frustrated? No, but to be sure, I have been around this sim for ages and have become accustomed to 3 to 4 weeks. Granted, it might be nice to see 3 to 4 days.
Regarding the code being “guarded” by a chosen few:
This is (again IMO) an example of good work ethics. Opening the code to everyone would only cause confusion and mayhem. One would have multiple code lines being developed that would quickly become incompatible with one another. One group may solve the bubble problem, but find it would not work with another group’s shader fix, etc…
Yes, Falcon is an odd and old and tired beast. BMS has their vision and philosophy. Consider that maybe that philosophy is the reason why BMS is still around.
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Maybe sthalik can use the code from https://github.com/FreeFalcon/ to show some of his ideas in case the bms team doesn’t recruit him.
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Dee-Jay, please note that my previous post was not meant to contain any hostility
No prob mate … we are just discussing …
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BMS is closed for the very reason we see in this forum.
Yes, we are all good friends who trust and respect each other. Some of us have known each other for years and some for just a few months. We do not always agree on things but I’ve rarely seen heated or disrespectful discussions in BMS, and that is the key. Argumentative people, such as some we see posting here (on this forum and speaking in a general sense) do not fit well in BMS. Skills are important but skills do not buy you entry into the team. Its attitude and then skills, and the opinion of all BMS members that gets you in. You can be the best and most efficient programer, artist, data editor, or tester in the world but if your attitude is disrespectful you will never get in. BMS is a team and it functions very well.
For those who feel they can do better the F4 source code is out there. If you’re that good grab it and develop it and you should surpass where we are within a few months based on what I’m reading.
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What do you mean “headless BMS”??
BMS server without a graphics card, running at 100+ FPS on ramp.
lol I would love to see this… The only way it could be achieved it could be if bms team does some code work and we can have 2d running server… then we might be able too…
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That’s why is better to keep the code for people have experience with Falcon code, sometimes the solution is not the more easy to have.
hmmm r u obselutely sure? This means falcon dies with them? And how does one gains falcon code experience if the code is for a few? I’m not saying give it away but what u state says to me no more new guys… stays with us - dies with us.
Unless u consider the leaked internet circulating and the recent freefalcon code Falcon code…On the other hand all those sound pointless generalities. In my understanding and POV all those sound like:
I don’t want to say it clear, but FF dev’s if u want there is an opening for u… or hey guys create a new team develop something like competitive to us to gain experience and then we will let u join our team. In other words reinvent the wheel…
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hmmm r u obselutely sure? This means falcon dies with them? And how does one gains falcon code experience if the code is for a few? …
Not necessarily; FF’s code didn’t die with them. Learn to code F4? If you can code in C you’re good to go.
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Not necessarily; FF’s code didn’t die with them. Learn to code F4? If you can code in C you’re good to go.
Nononono m8… those split S don’t work with me… :lol: he was specific: “experienced with Falcon code”… not C code in general…
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If the code was released you would no longer have a community. Look at the divergence with AF, FF and OF. Image if 4, 5, or 6+ groups had the code. Which install would you fly? The endless debates about whose install is better would never end.
In order to have a stable community we need to have single install that brings everyone together. A single platform for community developers to create mods for, and a single platform for multiplayer events. In a word we have that now. Most of FF’s coders are part of BMS. Many of FF’s data folks are working on mods and some even assist BMS devs behind closed doors. If someone can code shaders then code it and pass it to BMS. I’m sure we can make work in F4.
Leaking the BMS code would be the death of this community, and yes, if you can program in C, C++ etc you can code in BMS. Seeing the BMS code is not going to help you.
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Nononono m8… those split S don’t work with me… :lol: he was specific: “experienced with Falcon code”… not C code in general…
Arty… C’omon buddy! seriously?? I think you are reading too much into the words… I mean, how long you have been here? you must already know that if someone is serious and really wants to contribute, he will find the way to get positive attention from the Dev team. Maybe not everyone from Dev team is posting much in public forums, but at least some of us do read the forums and most do read the important threads. So the chances that someone with serious attentions will be missed are next to 0.
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Look at all the “new” theaters being WIP. Flare. New 3D-Models. Lot of Modding. Huge number of bms-squadrons. Force-on-Force servers running great with lot of clients on it. Endless fun. (Best conditions to wait for next bms with new features and improvements.)
Seems there is nothing wrong with bms policy.
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If the code was released you would no longer have a community. Look at the divergence with AF, FF and OF. Image if 4, 5, or 6+ groups had the code. Which install would you fly? The endless debates about whose install is better would never end.
In order to have a stable community we need to have single install that brings everyone together. A single platform for community developers to create mods for, and a single platform for multiplayer events. In a word we have that now. Most of FF’s coders are part of BMS. Many of FF’s data folks are working on mods and some even assist BMS devs behind closed doors. If someone can code shaders then code it and pass it to BMS. I’m sure we can make work in F4.
Leaking the BMS code would be the death of this community, and yes, if you can program in C, C++ etc you can code in BMS. Seeing the BMS code is not going to help you.
Agreed, carry on with the awesomeness.
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Hey Arty,
I don’t want to say it clear, but FF dev’s if u want there is an opening for u…
just out of curiosity, which FF dev’s are speaking about???
Cheers
Biker -
Hey BD,
Most of FF’s coders are part of BMS.
sorry to correct you but for use (at least for me) it’s a pretty important point:
We were not FF coders, we were the RV coders/team, FF was (if at all) the publisher.Cheers
Biker -
Arty… C’omon buddy! seriously?? I think you are reading too much into the words… I mean, how long you have been here? you must already know that if someone is serious and really wants to contribute, he will find the way to get positive attention from the Dev team. Maybe not everyone from Dev team is posting much in public forums, but at least some of us do read the forums and most do read the important threads. So the chances that someone with serious attentions will be missed are next to 0.
What I wanted here was a technical discussion, hence the brought-up points. Alas, they’ve been ignored, and the discussion has since turned into a political one
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Hey BD,
sorry to correct you but for use (at least for me) it’s a pretty important point:
We were not FF coders, we were the RV coders/team, FF was (if at all) the publisher.Cheers
BikerYes, you are correct.