Is Steam absolutely necessary?
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I hate Steam & don’t want to install it.
Is there any way around this requirement?
Both DCS & MSFS work beautifully on my system without Steam (I’m using Reverb G2).
If it is not possible now are there plans to remove this requirement in the future?
I was sooo disappointed to discover this limitation & am surprised there aren’t more people complaining about it.
(I can’t go back to 2-D world after getting used to VR.)
Thanks.
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Nope, not for now.
Only OpenVR for now, which is SteamVR
OpenXR maybe later ? -
OK thanks Flow
Back to DCS I go …
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@Burger Any reason you don’t want to install Steam? If you’re willing to put up with ED’s shenanigans with regards to DCS, surely installing Steam to get VR in BMS is no big deal?
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@Burger said in Is Steam absolutely necessary?:
I hate Steam & don’t want to install it.
Is there any way around this requirement?
Both DCS & MSFS work beautifully on my system without Steam (I’m using Reverb G2).
If it is not possible now are there plans to remove this requirement in the future?
I was sooo disappointed to discover this limitation & am surprised there aren’t more people complaining about it.
(I can’t go back to 2-D world after getting used to VR.)
Thanks.
The game is also available on GoG. It is possible to download and install the game without GoG Galaxy.
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@molnibalage said in Is Steam absolutely necessary?:
The game is also available on GoG. It is possible to download and install the game without GoG Galaxy.
You still need SteamVR for the VR part
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DCS used to only work with SteamVR, you could use mods to make it compatible with openXR, for flew weeks SteamVR is no longer supported by Steam VR unless the OpenXR api is used.
SteamVR on Falcon BMS has amazing performance with VR, I have a G2 too.
Each madman with his mania.
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@Burger Excuse my ignorance, but what is so hateful about Steam?
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@Burger There aren’t more people complaining about this because no one else here hates Steam such that they would refuse to use it for its VR utility alone (regardless of using it as a game library and storefront).
It’s just a tool, it can’t hurt you. There is no data which it could possibly collect about you that would compromise the safety and security of you or your PC. There are no ill effects of having Steam installed on your PC when you do not have it running, either.
Might as well say, “I can’t read any BMS manuals because I hate PDF readers. Can we get a text format only set of manuals?” (no offense intended, just making a point)
The only limitations here are those you place upon yourself, and while you refuse to allow yourself to enjoy BMS in VR right now, plenty of people are having the time of their lives at Angels 20 with the magnificent immersion of VR.
AVCS4 Voice Control Radio Menus for Falcon BMS (and other profiles for VoiceAttack): veterans-gaming.com/avcs
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@SemlerPDX @danster I would say I’m anti-Steam… although “hate” is far too strong a word – I wouldn’t let it stop me from enjoying BMS in VR if I wanted.
I would install it on a dedicated gaming rig, but I do keep it off my daily/dev machines.
The app itself is very heavy, bloated and invasive. It has anti-cheat layers running in kernel mode… it hooks into HID (input) device stack to provide its own remapping experience, and presumably also to detect banned devices.
There are reports (I can not substantiate) it even scans and transmits your DNS-cache history as part of its ML model to detect cheaters…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valve_Anti-CheatValve/Steam has historically been somewhat negligent on security… victim of several huge data breaches / hacks, and guilty of utterly trivial bugs that allow account-hijacking.
I definitely would not leave my credit card number on file with them.
In summary, there are reasons to not love Steam. I don’t think they’re “evil” or anything like that, but I definitely don’t have a strong trust-relationship with them.
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@SemlerPDX said in Is Steam absolutely necessary?:
There aren’t more people complaining about this because no one else here hates Steam such that they would refuse to use it for its VR utility alone
I’m not so sure…I think many are just resigned to accept the online vulnerabilities they are exposed to for the trade-off in benefits or are simply ignorant of them. I know that there was a version of Steam that was built for enterprises which could be obtained through a registration process that enabled full offline installation and execution because Steam couldn’t pass hardened network security protocols in enterprise organizations. Why they restricted it from open download is really curious for me…they are certainly interested in data collection at a minimum (like everyone else). Caveat Emptor, I’m not a steam user as I don’t currently have a VR setup, but my boys do and I’ve seen it operate. It is certainly an open security hole in it’s requirement for online connections and you basically have to just ‘Trust Steam’ or give up. I personally would really be interested in the offline enterprise version in the future as I do anticipate trying VR but I understand it may be obsolete and on its way out. If the offline version lost some features, I personally would be fine as I don’t really have any need for online game mangement etc. I pretty much only do Falcon BMS and don’t have much time or drive for other gaming, so no loss for me. Independent, secure, standalone VR would be nice without having to piggyback on software you just have to trust, and I would be happy to see BMS run on an alternative platform. I’m no personal fan of Steam myself; It’s just that there doesn’t really seem to be any close market competition for it on that front. BMS chosing to adopt it seems the right way to go just to be able to offer the best VR that would reach to largest user base. Perhaps the future really depends on the widespread adoption of VR such that Steam won’t nececessarily be the dominat VR engine king it is today.
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@Burger Enjoy your ride in DCS Burger.
I suppouse the people that hate steam because the posible security explained in this post… they buy a legal copy of Windows… right? -
@airtex2019 Why would it be about trust? Or is it just me being paranoid by nature? I don’t trust most things and so try to keep my online footprint to a minimum. If my info is leaked out there, sure, the platform is to blame, but so am I for providing my info willingly, whether that be Steam or Facebook or Instagram or whatever. I think in the current world where some sort of online presence is unavoidable, there are just some risks we have to accept.
If I were to go on holiday and brag about it on social media for months beforehand, then take pictures of myself in the airport, then in the hotel, then on the beach, is it Facebook’s/Instagram’s fault if I come home and find my house burgled? On the other hand, do I print out all my holiday pictures and send it to loved ones using snail mail? No. I take pictures of my holiday and put in on my social media page, but do so after I’ve taken the holiday. I also make sure I control who can see my page as much as I can. I also make sure my home security stuff works before I leave for the holiday. I don’t brag publicly about any holidays and length of time I won’t be home. And so on…
So with Steam or any other online store (Origin, Epic, etc.), I don’t tie my Facebook page with those, nor do I connect them to my personal email. And so on…
Having said all of the above, if these were the concerns of the OP, then I’m not sure how he bought his DCS modules as even on the ED store, you are required to provide your detail, billing address, and credit card info in order to buy modules. Does he really trust the ED devs more than Steam devs?
As for bloatware, the guy is running DCS in VR… surely his PC can handle a bit of bloatware?
End of the day, Steam isn’t perfect, but neither is ED. If OP is willing to pass on BMS VR because of Steam, then OP is missing out, but that’s his choice.
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@Atlas lol great point … definitely don’t have a trust-relationship with DCS.
I guess I mean a few different things when I say “trust”.
With any PC software, one needs to have some level of trust before installing / running it. I don’t actually believe Steam is recording every keystroke I type or sending my DNS-query traffic to the NSA, or darkweb hackers, or ad-targeting services or whatever. BUT everyone should at least be aware that any software you download and run, could do that – Windows doesn’t even throw a UAC (admin) prompt, when activating a low-level keyboard hook.
![😕](https://forum.falcon-bms.com/assets/plugins/nodebb-plugin-emoji/emoji/android/1f615.png?v=f97edddc82e ":\")
But putting all that aspect of “trust” aside (and also ignoring the hacks / data-breaches)… as a developer, I simply find Steam too invasive on my system. My wife has Steam on her gaming rig, and experiences a lot of weird behavior and instability, that seem to go away when she kills/exists Steam.
I spend a certain amount of time each week, debugging input-device problems with software (sometimes Alt Launcher
… I don’t like having stuff in the input-driver stack that I don’t know, “trust” and understand.Indeed, right now I find myself wondering … some of the weird input-related glitches people have reported that we’ve never resolved or repro’d… I wonder if they have Steam running? hmm…
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@airtex2019 Interesting. I’ve never had a problem with Steam or BMS acting up and as I fly mostly on VR nowadays, Steam is always on.
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@Burger said in Is Steam absolutely necessary?:
OK thanks Flow
Back to DCS I go …
Please close the door on your way out…
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