"Read The Manual" replies
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I read the manual OPERATIONAL BREVITY WORDS, DEFINITIONS, AND COUNTERAIR
COMMUNICATION STANDARDS (U)
A1.1.v and searched using the search function! But I also learned alot from reading this.trying to understand the term HOUNDDOG it in not in the manual yet I hear these all the time while flying mostly my the wingman Would I be denounced if I asked what this meant?
“Request permission to engage”.
EDIT: Oh sorry, read the love-making manual twice
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…… Would I be denounced if I asked what this meant?
Of course. You and your ilk will not deny us of our fun. :rofl:
“Hound Dog” is in the legacy Falcon 4.0 manual and is not ‘proper’ steely-eyed fighter pilot lingo. In AI parlance it’s a request to engage.
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I read the manual OPERATIONAL BREVITY WORDS, DEFINITIONS, AND COUNTERAIR
COMMUNICATION STANDARDS (U)
A1.1.v and searched using the search function! But I also learned alot from reading this.trying to understand the term HOUNDDOG it is not in the manual yet I hear this all the time while flying, mostly my the wingman. Would I be denounced if I asked what this meant?
Many brevity in Falcon are wrong or outdated. This time, it is NOT the the doc wich is out to date, but the soft itself … Unfortunately, there is no way to recreate sounds frags properly for that kind of update. But if you take a look into the MCH-F16-vol3 (older than the APP7E) maybe you will find some of those old brevity (?) … Or … GOOGLE => hound dog brevity … just give a try.
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I read the manual OPERATIONAL BREVITY WORDS, DEFINITIONS, AND COUNTERAIR
COMMUNICATION STANDARDS (U)
A1.1.v and searched using the search function! But I also learned alot from reading this.trying to understand the term HOUNDDOG it is not in the manual yet I hear this all the time while flying, mostly my the wingman. Would I be denounced if I asked what this meant?
Hound Dog means “I can attack it” so your wingman responses like that when he can.
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RTFM on its own could be banned. That would deal with the off-putting
rudeness
to newcomers and if no fuller answer comes quickly then the asker is likely to be doing some reading whilst they wait on one.Original Falcon 4.0 had a Cadets or quick start guide IIRC
Being free, BMS will inevitably attract a large number who cant/wont put the effort in. I`m unsure if those asking the questions are the ones most likely to fall away or the ones that will persevere.
Only a couple of days ago a forum veteran with 1000`s of posts here to their name asked if they could install 4331 by just having the falcon exe on their pc. Its no wonder replies can be harsh.
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Let me compare this to something else –- tabletop RPG. Think D&D and the like. Player’s Handbook being something like 300+ pages, then there’s the GM’s book and the Monsters book. If I were to invite somebody to play tabletop RPG and tell him “you need this book to know how to play,” I’d wager they would pass on it. I have had a few friends who, while enthusiastic players of Neverwinter Nights and Baldur’s Gate, would pass on tabletop RPGs. However, when I told them that all they needed to play was their imagination and handed them a character sheet that “I’d explain as we go along,” I had more takers.
This was the same thing when I was flying DCS A10C. A lot of people would find the sim too complex and would resort to either the simpler game modes or just dump the sim completely. I would take people up on flights and in a 4-hour flight session (typical for me at that time), we would do takeoff, navigation, killing things with the guns and mavericks, RTB, and landing. That showed them what they could do in the sim, and while it was a “broad stroke brush,” it was way better than fumbling around by themselves. Again, this gave them a first-hand insight into the “fun bits” of the sim and gave them the internal motivation to learn more and delve into the manual.
There are people who learn by RTFM first then flying. There are people who learn by doing, then RTFM, and doing again.
There are people who can dedicate a good few hours each day to their hobby. There are people who can only have a quick hour or two. If we can cater to both, especially the second group, we stand to grow the community.
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It’s about sharing the work. I will help someone for 12 hours that put in 1 hour work. For someone who wants to do 0 seconds of work they get 0 seconds of help.
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Everyone.
Thanks for the interest in this topic! There are some great replies. No opinions for me this time, just an observation.
All of you are very concerned about how to help the rookies. Not a surprise to most. The rookies reading this thread are most likely getting a little motivated. I am sure learning has occurred too
Thanks again
Creature
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@Red:
I guess you will never forget how to do it from now on. If somebody just told you, then you would forget within a week
that’s the interest of doing it straight with the hard way and go look for it yourself rather than relying on somebody else to simplify it for you.This was said in response to me when explaining it took me some time to drop my first bomb going through the manuals. I have to say Red Dog is plain right with this. Whatever I have learned by going through the manuals, took me an effort that would have been easier if someone told me ‘the easy way’, and that effort paying attention to learn the topic has paid.
Still, I agree with some ideas in this thread, such as a FAQ created by simmers not in Falcon for some years, and a forum targeted for newcommers where no question is dumb, for real.
Again in defense of the “read the manual” thing, I also have to say that I have seen no answer of this kind without a reference to the manual, and that is something to be really appreciated.Personally, I don’t ask much in the forum because I don’t have the patience to wait for an answer, and I end up in the manual. By the time I get an answer, I have found it. That’s probably because my questions are still quite basic.
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R’g TFM is part of what this simulation is about.
To those who put in the huge effort to create the documentation, and those who take the time to answer questions - thank you.
If someone asks a question that, to you, seems obvious or easily researched, then why bother spending electrons towards implicating their apparent “shortcomings” - what does this say about you?
I find this question related to one I have internally, when I see the “Zero post” warnings; my first thought is, “ya know, when I have a question I try to find the answer on my own - thus reducing my contribution to the ‘noise’ that is the internet”. Resulting in a low ‘post count’ on my part.
And yes, I’m boring at parties. And not likely to have my own reality series on TV.
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And yes, I’m boring at parties. And not likely to have my own reality series on TV.
Well there are those guys and the other guys… and the other other guys…
So we want a community with discrimination? asking r u that kind of guy? then come in.
Lot’s of guts to auto label your self and ease the conversation. But putting labels ain’t the best or proper way.
Let me make it more brutal… are u a geek come in. You r not get lost and rtfm. Sounds right?
But on the other hand geeks are welcomed here… many cause of geek and glasses couldn’t join the airforce, and with this SIM they get their chunk of the Tom Cruise or Iron Eagle or Real pilots feeling.
but this whole thing goes to a different direction and the discussion will end to utopia.
The dev’s that create the manuals are right and rtfm solves many issues specially with the current release (4.33 and above) but still the rtfm is not that polite… and depends on the culture everyone is carrying. He just asks something, he is not sending an armed missile locked on you. Yes he will get angry if you ignore him and become cocky and all others… we should then be punishing babies for dropping on their first steps, and not offer a helping hand.
On the other hand the one responding rtfm is not also sending a missile just points to the right direction, but come on, Christmas you just got your new automobile electric track… you are going to rtfm first? Daaaaad how are they connected? Dad cars are not running… Daaadddd come race with me…So it’s inevitable… he’s hot, locked, uncaged , with super tone, creating his rtfm thread.
DUNC made the fabulous use the search thread post… since then thousands times I’ve seen the rtfm and let me google it for you…
For me what I see for some like reference to manual chapter xx or pages xxx to xxx is more tiring, go search, spot, reply back,… you do all the work, the newb has.
maybe dev’s should get some distance from this public forum (I’m talking about the rtfm cases here, not in general) if they are that tired of the rtfm repetitiveness (which is normal, nothing bad with it) and let the community handle it. I believe the balance will be found somewhere in the middle.
Oh Mav’JP your FM ain’t real man… in 4.32 it was ok but now it’s broken… :rofl: How many times??? :lol: and still there are some case and there will be.
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This was said in response to me when explaining it took me some time to drop my first bomb going through the manuals. I have to say Red Dog is plain right with this. Whatever I have learned by going through the manuals, took me an effort that would have been easier if someone told me ‘the easy way’, and that effort paying attention to learn the topic has paid.
Still, I agree with some ideas in this thread, such as a FAQ created by simmers not in Falcon for some years, and a forum targeted for newcommers where no question is dumb, for real.
Again in defense of the “read the manual” thing, I also have to say that I have seen no answer of this kind without a reference to the manual, and that is something to be really appreciated.Personally, I don’t ask much in the forum because I don’t have the patience to wait for an answer, and I end up in the manual. By the time I get an answer, I have found it. That’s probably because my questions are still quite basic.
Very good for you and I’m happy you stuck with it. However, how many people do you think have encountered an “obstacle” and instead of jumping into pages and pages of virtual paper, they put the sim away instead and go back to the games they already know how to play? The thing here is the level of motivation. If you really want to, you’ll find the answer yourself. But others would feel they’d rather spend their time doing something more rewarding/less frustrating. If we can lessen this frustration, then we can grow the community.
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Very good for you and I’m happy you stuck with it. However, how many people do you think have encountered an “obstacle” and instead of jumping into pages and pages of virtual paper, they put the sim away instead and go back to the games they already know how to play? The thing here is the level of motivation. If you really want to, you’ll find the answer yourself. But others would feel they’d rather spend their time doing something more rewarding/less frustrating. If we can lessen this frustration, then we can grow the community.
But with what sort of people? People too unintelligent or too lazy to read and learn and expect to be spoon fed? I think not, sir. The beauty of this sim is that it is “self-vetting”.
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But with what sort of people? People too unintelligent or too lazy to read and learn and expect to be spoon fed? I think not, sir. The beauty of this sim is that it is “self-vetting”.
Wow, I can’t believe you’ve got that attitude, Mower. I would’ve thought you’d be better than that.
Besides, I wasn’t talking about spoon-feeding them from start to finish, but rather helping them past that initial hump of “I don’t have a clue of what I’m doing!!” to “Hang on a minute, that didn’t work as I expected, let me find out why.”
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helping them past that initial hump of “I don’t have a clue of what I’m doing!!” to “Hang on a minute, that didn’t work as I expected, let me find out why.”
Agreed. You are reading too much into my remark.
Don’t make me come over there…
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:wfish:
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Wow, I can’t believe you’ve got that attitude, Mower.
This has precedent in the landmark case of Teach a Man to Fish v. Give a Man a Fish.
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This has precedent in the landmark case of Teach a Man to Fish v. Give a Man a Fish.
Affirm.
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This has precedent in the landmark case of Teach a Man to Fish v. Give a Man a Fish.
Yes, and when you Teach hime to fish you Teach him how to fish not just say R.T.F.M and walk away… A little guidance is best especially if you have Read the manual and are all knowing. it is best to direct them, to the correct section or video to watch I always thought was a best solution…
I guess with a teaching position some are cut out for it while others well just fly the damn plane… I have never spoon fed someone unl;ess nessacary but after a while I am sure it gets old but remember the noob asking the question that has been asked a thousand times don’t know it has been asked a thousand times…
Like I am sure it is just as east to type the answer or on which page the relevant info is in then go on a tagent and just off theperson… Somepeople learn in Different ways… I know I have asked a million questions even after I read the manual…
So if you are unable to be a cool headed teacher I say just leave your negative comments out… I have never not answered a question telling people how to enable NWS…
After all they are noobs so I don’t know why people think instantly they have not read the manual a little nudge to the proper page could prove more useful then go fend for yourself attitude…
Heck I may not be the best teacher or most knowledgable as I am always learning new stuff and making some stupid mistakes time after time but it is all good… If I can teach a noob some cool stuff and get 1 more into the flight sim genre that is great… we are a dying breed…
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We are not a dying breed. We remain a relatively small group among the “me” easily amused and lazy younger generation.