Small - but effective idea…
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Lets wait for real F-16 drivers inputs … if it is confirmed that it is actually felt and/or heard by the pilot in the pit, I will come back to you and see how your “cluck” sounds. Then … maybe one day, it shouldn’t be so hard to implement (?)
@Red:
it’s actually not a bad idea.
i’d love to have this implemented with the jetseat as well. Would give nice feedback during AAR.Go back to sleep and dream some more
Agreed, we talked about that over in the SimShaker thread but never had a confirmation that it could be felt in the actual jet. Would be easy to do with the indexer lights in shared memory for SimShaker (but then maybe that is why the lights are there in the first place if you can’t feel it).
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My alibi is that it has been 28 years since my last AAR. But I could feel the connection most of the time.
Why? A little background. The airplane’s crew chief would periodically lube the receiver hardware (don’t recall the frequency). However it was not uncommon for the receiver hardware to fail to latch on to the boom. If that happened the boomer would send you back to pre-contact and have you cycle your IFR door. If the problem persisted, the boomer might “stab” the boom into the receptacle to get it to latch. So ISTR some boomers’ technique to smoothly stab you on their first try. I don’t think it’s my imagination that I heard a very quiet “ka-thunk” (two syllables) in the F-16 but I definitely heard and felt it in the RF-4C. I remember refueling from the backseat and knowing the boom had contact by the feel and the “ka-thunk” (couldn’t see the director lights while backseat refueling, but could see them if the guy in front was.) And as an aside, I can say with complete confidence that until I had a dozen or 30 AAR hookups in the RF-4, I was always squeezing the shit out of stick grip. Then one day a very cool WSO says, “Hey mind if I try.” WSOs were NOT permitted to refuel. I gave him the jet and he smoothly drove in, took a thousand pounds, disconnected, slid back to pre-contact, said “Thanks, your aerospace training device” all the while humming. And magically it was like ALL the self-inflicted pressure was gone, even with all the trimming while on the boom and often having to put one throttle in minimum burner and the opposite less than Mil to stay on the boom. In comparison refueling the F-16 was an absolute piece of cake.
[edit] Regarding a two syllable sound, I suppose that might have been a result of the boom making contact with the fuselage spine (RF-4) or IFR door (F-16) and then sliding into the receptacle. It was quite common to find rub marks around the IFR door where the boom had made contact. So if the boomer simply stabbed/plugged you cleanly it would just be “thunk.”
Don’t take my word for the feel and sound in the F-16, see what Fox3TwoShip says.
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Fascinating. Thanks. I found a sound and then muffled it and lowered the treble. Brought up the base a little bit. Its also quiet. I wanted to test it whilst flying so that I could see how it sounded with the jet engine noise and ambient sound clutter going on around me. Beeps and occasional radio chatter. If it was too quiet, I was going to crank it up.
I had 2 versions of the “connected” sound. One had 3 clunks. When looped it sounds like a heart beat - so I made a 2 clunk version. It was only until last night I closed my eyes and listened again that I liked the 3 clunk version once more.
By all means help yourselves to the files. Imagine the surrounding noises. By themselves, they probably sound a bit off… but see what you think.
It may get me laughed out of the room in which case Ill just quietly leave -nervously stroke my forearm with my head down in shame - blushing.
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hey,
I made a first test. I think that sounds quite good.
But listen to it yourself. I could not test that in the simulation, because the effort is quite high
(the wav file must be inserted into the falcon.tlk). The effort you can read here.
But the beginning is done. Have fun.Cheers
MadDoc
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CHIMP SQUEAL
Yeah it does doesnt it. I could imagine the sound of the jet too… I dont know if the sound is accurate though.
I’ll have to hhve a look at that link and see what its like in sim.
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watch out:
This is one of a total of 12 different boomoperator-voices.
You never know who is talking (random) so you have to replace all 12.
The filenames are:442.wav - 453.wav
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Well, it’s one of these examples that even if it wasn’t felt (which i doubt) i’d vouch to have it included anyway.
The reason is augmented reality to overcome the fact that we don’t feel the simulated aircrfat moving in it’s environment.
Deejay and I beat this debate to deathHis view is to implement only what is felt in the real jet
My view is that all these things should be augmented because the sim lacks the physical feedback a pilot would feel in his aircraft.Some examples:
AB usage: kick in the butt we don’t get in the sim (we get sound only - some argue you can’t hear it - tactile feedback missing)
Airbrakes: pilot ear sensing the decceleration and inertia pressing body in the restraint we don’t get - we get airspeed decreasing only - tactile feedback missing)
Touchdown; AB or engine sounds of aircrfat around you on the ground, ….The opposite is true as well in the sim: for instance we hear thunder… so on one hand we argue that we wouldn’t hear some aircrfat noise, but we hear distant thunder …go figure
All that is compromises, unfortunately the compromises aren’t always consistent…Bottom line, i’d love to have it implemented even if it’s not reported felt. I feel it’s one of these case of augmented reality necessary for the sim immersion
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Thats awesome mate! Thanks.
Are these the disconnect ones too? Or just the contact ones?
Awesome.
Im sort of with red dog on the whole immersion perspective. I agree that theres only so much a similator can give you. Chairs that move - buttkickers, VR (especially) , track ir, surround sound etc - they are all great but can only offer so much.
These little additions may not be 100% accurate but give a little tick in the immersion box.
If its not implimented - thats fair enough. I dare say there will be many more that dont want it. But I suppose this thread could be for those that want to use it can… those that dont, can ignore.
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Sorry, sorry, sorry
Do NOT use the sounds! They are too big. I have to convert them.
At first I only replaced the “connct”.
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Puuuh, I changed the sample-frequency in 8000.
Now they have the correct sizehttps://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/93776797/Refuel-Sound.zip
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Have done a testflight. It sounds terrible.:-x
There is nothing to be heard of the klick-sound.
Only an undefined noise followed by “contact”
The idea, to solve your idea with the talk-file was probably not so good. -
My alibi is that it has been 28 years since my last AAR. But I could feel the connection most of the time.
Why? A little background. The airplane’s crew chief would periodically lube the receiver hardware (don’t recall the frequency). However it was not uncommon for the receiver hardware to fail to latch on to the boom. If that happened the boomer would send you back to pre-contact and have you cycle your IFR door. If the problem persisted, the boomer might “stab” the boom into the receptacle to get it to latch. So ISTR some boomers’ technique to smoothly stab you on their first try. I don’t think it’s my imagination that I heard a very quiet “ka-thunk” (two syllables) in the F-16 but I definitely heard and felt it in the RF-4C. I remember refueling from the backseat and knowing the boom had contact by the feel and the “ka-thunk” (couldn’t see the director lights while backseat refueling, but could see them if the guy in front was.) And as an aside, I can say with complete confidence that until I had a dozen or 30 AAR hookups in the RF-4, I was always squeezing the shit out of stick grip. Then one day a very cool WSO says, “Hey mind if I try.” WSOs were NOT permitted to refuel. I gave him the jet and he smoothly drove in, took a thousand pounds, disconnected, slid back to pre-contact, said “Thanks, your aerospace training device” all the while humming. And magically it was like ALL the self-inflicted pressure was gone, even with all the trimming while on the boom and often having to put one throttle in minimum burner and the opposite less than Mil to stay on the boom. In comparison refueling the F-16 was an absolute piece of cake.
[edit] Regarding a two syllable sound, I suppose that might have been a result of the boom making contact with the fuselage spine (RF-4) or IFR door (F-16) and then sliding into the receptacle. It was quite common to find rub marks around the IFR door where the boom had made contact. So if the boomer simply stabbed/plugged you cleanly it would just be “thunk.”
Don’t take my word for the feel and sound in the F-16, see what Fox3TwoShip says.
RhoBee shacked it. I sent DeeJay a PM regarding it. That’s the best way to explain it as a “ka-thunk” and a small thud as the boom connects. Here’s what I sent DeeJay:
The clunk can be heard and felt if you’re paying attention to those cues. It’s not super loud but it’s definitely there. Some other things to improve tankers in BMS would be in the real world KC-135 have real dim (most of the time you cannot see them during the day) director lights and there is a lot of turbulence which makes it harder to stay on the boom. On the KC-10 the lights are much easier to see and the boom is powerful enough to actually move the F-16 where they want it so it makes it easier for new guys.
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@Red:
Well, it’s one of these examples that even if it wasn’t felt (which i doubt) i’d vouch to have it included anyway.
The reason is augmented reality to overcome the fact that we don’t feel the simulated aircrfat moving in it’s environment.
Deejay and I beat this debate to deathHis view is to implement only what is felt in the real jet
My view is that all these things should be augmented because the sim lacks the physical feedback a pilot would feel in his aircraft.Some examples:
AB usage: kick in the butt we don’t get in the sim (we get sound only - some argue you can’t hear it - tactile feedback missing)
Airbrakes: pilot ear sensing the decceleration and inertia pressing body in the restraint we don’t get - we get airspeed decreasing only - tactile feedback missing)
Touchdown; AB or engine sounds of aircrfat around you on the ground, ….The opposite is true as well in the sim: for instance we hear thunder… so on one hand we argue that we wouldn’t hear some aircrfat noise, but we hear distant thunder …go figure
All that is compromises, unfortunately the compromises aren’t always consistent…Bottom line, i’d love to have it implemented even if it’s not reported felt. I feel it’s one of these case of augmented reality necessary for the sim immersion
Yep … To death … But since we are still alive … lets continue
Airbrakes : yes … Your can feel it … But only in low level at high speed. We have the feedback and I am fine with this.
After burner : same … But at low speed.
Touchdown : Fully agree.Again … I am not against audio feedbacks for physical lacking sensations.
But if for some ppl immersion is a laser beam sound when lasing the target … Sorry, this is too much and will be immesive only for the people who watched too much Iron Eagle.
Immersion YES of course. But something consistent and not a fake immersion based on what ppl think the reality is in their own imagination.So lets just wait for a sing from Fox3TwoShip … And if it is confirmed, I will be happy to add it into the sound table
Edit: about the thunder, take a look in your 4.34 … It should be no more audible when canopy is closed and engine running. (By using standard sound slider settings)
Re edit: just recived F3’s PM and see that he just answered above … Taking a look to his reply and I come back after
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RhoBee shacked it. I sent DeeJay a PM regarding it. That’s the best way to explain it as a “ka-thunk” and a small thud as the boom connects. Here’s what I sent DeeJay:
The clunk can be heard and felt if you’re paying attention to those cues. It’s not super loud but it’s definitely there. Some other things to improve tankers in BMS would be in the real world KC-135 have real dim (most of the time you cannot see them during the day) director lights and there is a lot of turbulence which makes it harder to stay on the boom. On the KC-10 the lights are much easier to see and the boom is powerful enough to actually move the F-16 where they want it so it makes it easier for new guys.
Thank you very much for your post!
I will try to find some vid in YT and see If I can hear how it sounds and mimic it. If not … Will come back to you with some samples and you will tell us what is the best. (but I will have to wait until I am back home in one or two weeks to be able to do this) -
…But if for some ppl want a laser beam sound when lasing the target …
:rofl: Yeah, I want this beam sound :rofl:
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Maybe MadDoc nailed it already
Sorry, I did not. If you like, you can test it yourself:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/93776797/falcon.tlk
Don’t forget to save your original falcon.tlk
BTW: It’s the falcon.tlk from Korea…
I have combined the original sound with the “klick-sound”
Unfortunately ingame does not sound like the wav file -
Sorry, I did not. If you like, you can test it yourself:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/93776797/falcon.tlk
Don’t forget to save your original falcon.tlk
BTW: It’s the falcon.tlk from Korea…
I have combined the original sound with the “klick-sound”
Can’t do. No BMS here. Need a .wav or an .mp3 to be able to listen it on my iPad.
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No BMS on your iPad…tsss:D
You can download this example from my dropbox.
Here the sound ingame: