[New] F16I Skin Project
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Thanks for your kind words but i aint. Please dont post such things.
Im not used to it and it makes me very uncomfortable.Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-T818A using Tapatalk
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Yarin, you clearly underestimate the people that respond to the thread.
You have people that actually know the āunder the hoodā stuff more intimately then any other person on the planet.
So āsellingā 3d terrain objective āmethodā to them is like trying to sell passion fruit candy to a baby.
He will take it at first but then he taste it and want to kill you.We are all here to learn from each other, and being so cryptic all the time was good and well 10 years ago.
You are all grown up now, so stop the BS and step up to your words.
You have worked on a nice looking skin, let people use it.
You think you invented new terrain editing method that is far superior? Send one tile to someone you trust and let him have a look. You trust Arty, send it to him. Peer review itās called.Stop waisting all of our time with your āfloor is crucked, however I am a misunderstood genius and smarter then anyoneā BS attitude you carry for the last 15 years. Itās not cute anymore, itās pathetic.
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Wolfox321 there is something that kinda triggered me hereā¦
U said whole country in 3d.
ok I hear u but Falcon wise errr sounds like a melting process.
like what? 100x100km? larger? smaller?Can you please give more details 3d and texture wise?
Also u where on a NASA super trooper computer.I mean u should have split each area and also use at least 3 lods for each also lower textures for each lod?
mission load time was what? half an hour on ssd and 1 to 2 hours on HDD?
your photos look nice but far and very small resolution. was that the resolution in 3d or you resized them?
yeap Demer made Guam ok but itās an island like 27x55km which resulted for me in a 100+gb of textures in high res sat imagery iirc, So I canāt imagine what would be your textures for a whole country and what kind of detail r we talking here like how many pixels per m?
Unity?
Cityengine?
Google?
Ms maps?
ESRI?Also from Heightmap in 3ds max what was the mess matrix detail factorā¦ like the squares used in your plane on which u applied the heightmap to create the 3d model. also for each area u should play with the valuesā¦ so that the heightmap be close to real when u import it to Falcon.
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I donāt understand this thread anymore ā¦. It started with skins ā¦ And now ā¦
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Wellā¦ It started by telling you some of our very secrets of how to make a full āflatā terrain with 60,000,000 million diffrent square meters, because you thought its only possible to use 4096 tilesā¦
Neat!
Questions:
1 - Where will you share pictures & videos of ground battle, ground objectives, cities, airbase operations ā¦ etc ā¦ (full trailer)
2 - When will you share it with community?
In 3 - 4 weeks right?
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Wolfox release a video already come on,are you a wolf or a fox?lol
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The whole 3d country we did - was 300NM X 150NM = Talking about 45,000 Diffrent Square Miles.
In KM - itās 550KM X 270KM = 148,500 diffrent square KMs = 148,500,000 Million diffrent square meters. Those numbers even sound huge to meā¦ but thatās what we did. Sometimes I canāt belive the numbers myself - but I did the caculation right now - itās ALOTā¦550KM x 270KM is ~1/7 of a full Falcon theater.
In order to get such high numbers you need to solve at least 5 MAJOR PROBLEMS and those are :
- The limitation of the Simulator it self for only 4096 tiles. that can produce at maximum area of 100km X 40km = 4,096,000 diffrent square meters - and thatās not that bad for falcon. the point is - that falcon can use 4096 diffrent tiles - but I donāt see any theater that use all of the diffrent tiles it can useā¦ because you can get 4 diffrent million square meters with the 4096 limit. which is also alot. but I know that theaters use only about 256 diffrent files out of the 4096 useable - so 250/4096 means you can still do alot to go to 4069 diffrent tilesā¦ a regular theater that uses only 250 diffrent files - is actualy using only 250,000 diffrent square meters - and thatās okā¦ but when u take 300nm X 300nm area which is 90,000,000 diffrent square meters - and u apply only 250,000 out of 90,000,000 - you get the same area repeated it self by 360 times (250,000 x 360 = 90,000,000) so thats one issue. how to get use of all the 4096 files that are possible - but not only that - need to go beyond 4096 files if you want to get a real-terrain like google earth.
https://i.ibb.co/gPHnv3S/Wolf.jpg
But you didnāt āsolvedā the limitation of 4096 tiles, you simply hacked the terrain as a big 3D model with few vertices (relatively) and possibly you assembled a couple of those to make it look like a terrain. However, if you succeeded, you still have problems with bounding boxes and collisions.
And BTW, what 250 tiles are you talking about? KTO and ITO currently using more than 3K tiles each, out the available 4096. POH is IIRC using all 4096 slots.
BTW2 - The 4096 isnāt some hard limit that cannot be reached, itās a limit that was set from Falcon history, it wouldnāt be that hard to extend if we wanted, but we donāt want because more tiles will eventually mean less and less performance. Although you try to render it as ā0 tilesā or some other crap like that, if itās textures then GPU need it in memory for rendering, and if you have too many tiles, in existing terrain it means more draw calls and eventually less performance.
Letās say that I have this huge terrainā¦ very bigā¦ the biggest one youāve ever seen. (Donalnd trump style āITāS HUGE!ā)ā¦ wellā¦ how do u keep FPS high? wellā¦
you only need the area that youāre flying over ā¦ right? I meanā¦ If I fly in canadaā¦ I donāt care about new-yorkā¦ right? I Meanā¦ Where ever you fly - thatās the area you need. so it should not be that bigā¦ it can even be small enough to get you through with 120 fps and as you fly from one area to another - other areas that you flew 10 minutes ago - are disappearingā¦ so you can fly a 999,999,999,999 nm X 999,999,999,999 nm area - but the video card and the CPU will only be care about the 80nm that are around youā¦ and as you move on - those 80nm always stay 80nm that around youā¦ itās the same princple as the BUBBLE in Falcon 4 bmsā¦ thatās how u get high fps - with no matter how large or big or huge or āTRUMP HUGE!ā it getsā¦ You donāt fly over new york? well - You Donāt Need New-Yorkā¦ and thatās easy to say - hard to pull offā¦
https://i.ibb.co/mDV4SHg/2019-07-13-034136.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/1dPKxx0/2019-07-18-060446.jpgListen geniusā¦ what you think that you discovered here is called in the professional language āclippingā or ācullingā. Take a small guess but Falcon does that all the time, 3D models that arenāt in scene arenāt sent to rendering even if they are 10 feet away, because the CPU will cull them before sending them to GPU to render (Read about frustum culling to get the idea).
Also, you think Falcon terrain is rendering all terrain as once?? Itās loading in 16x16 KM segments, hold in memory only the visible segments around you and swap back and forth as camera move.
Bottom line - You didnāt invented anything new here. Every real 3D engine in the world has some kind of culling, otherwise performance will be crap.
3rd Major Problem - will be alot more difficult than the other 2ā¦ You got the terrainā¦ hugeā¦ you got the 4k with 120 fps ā¦ but itās a flat terrainā¦ so you go to a 3d terrainā¦ now you get into the world of the polys, you get involved with diffrent issues of how to make a real 3d terrain - with still the same texturesā¦ because I can build a very beautiful area of mountains - with grass and tress and itāll look awesome. but its not real photo-terrainā¦ I need to get my already huge flat terrain - into a 3dā¦ I canāt build something newā¦ it wonāt be realā¦ it will be something nice but forget about the photoreal terrainā¦ so itās a whole diffrent major problemā¦ not only to build something that looks goodā¦ but it must be the Google Earth that goes 3d. and now boys - thatās a huge problemā¦
https://i.ibb.co/7bCXYnb/2019-07-20-185847.jpgI like it that you speak of FPS problems like they are some ātiny thing you can squashā
FPS problems in real engine can be real problems, the fact that you initially used some shitty Video card and now you have GTX-whatever and you can load into it 8GB of textures (Including RAM, as GPU will start to fill RAM once its on-board memory is taken), that doesnāt make it special.4th major problem in the process will be to get all the files in a better resolutionā¦ once you got through the 3 big problems - youāll be okā¦ =]
https://i.ibb.co/9ZQFWJ5/2019-07-08-141006-1.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/3WdNV89/2019-07-13-034012.jpgPsssstā¦ resolution problem? This is something that all most advanced terrain engines in the world try to solve, āTheā resolution problems
I like (again) how you wave these problem as if it is something easy to solve. Resolution is a serious problem and engines fighting all the time and inventing very sophisticated and complicated rendering and data management algorithms in order to tackle the resolution problem.
What are you trying to sell here, then?
5th major problem - is to solve the lights, and shadows, the night time, the buildings, the objects - all of these gotta work fine if you ever wanna strike an S.A.8 that fires at you ā¦ or other wise itās a useless simulator ā¦
thatās the basics I think ā¦ =]
Your tries to sound smart(er) all the time are pathetic.
Show me a working terrain with objects over it, with vehicles running on itā¦ but you canāt, because you didnāt built a terrain, you hacked a loophole in the sim which we can squash in 2 seconds by e.g limiting the size of a 3D model :mrgreen:
What I can give you credit for is that the textures do look nice, high resolution, that is nice. But itās not a terrain, sorry.
- The limitation of the Simulator it self for only 4096 tiles. that can produce at maximum area of 100km X 40km = 4,096,000 diffrent square meters - and thatās not that bad for falcon. the point is - that falcon can use 4096 diffrent tiles - but I donāt see any theater that use all of the diffrent tiles it can useā¦ because you can get 4 diffrent million square meters with the 4096 limit. which is also alot. but I know that theaters use only about 256 diffrent files out of the 4096 useable - so 250/4096 means you can still do alot to go to 4069 diffrent tilesā¦ a regular theater that uses only 250 diffrent files - is actualy using only 250,000 diffrent square meters - and thatās okā¦ but when u take 300nm X 300nm area which is 90,000,000 diffrent square meters - and u apply only 250,000 out of 90,000,000 - you get the same area repeated it self by 360 times (250,000 x 360 = 90,000,000) so thats one issue. how to get use of all the 4096 files that are possible - but not only that - need to go beyond 4096 files if you want to get a real-terrain like google earth.
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Like many here I am an old guy and been in the Falcon community for 20+ years. And have seen the generations change over time. So I just want to be clear here. So the common practice now in the Falcon community is to start trashing someoneās work instead of complimenting?? Iām just curious cause it seems to be the childish trend that is on this site lately. I get it, perhaps he is pissing people off because of his attitude or how he communicates? **** sake guys, move on and donāt communicate with him. If he produces something awesome, great. If he doesnāt who cares? Itās no loss to anyone.
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Like many here I am an old guy and been in the Falcon community for 20+ years. And have seen the generations change over time. So I just want to be clear here. So the common practice now in the Falcon community is to start trashing someoneās work instead of complimenting?? Iām just curious cause it seems to be the childish trend that is on this site lately. I get it, perhaps he is pissing people off because of his attitude or how he communicates? **** sake guys, move on and donāt communicate with him. If he produces something awesome, great. If he doesnāt who cares? Itās no loss to anyone.
+1
Even if his terrain is āfakeā empty shell, even if he broke the limits or hacked something, even if his terrain has serious performance problem, but his PC is from NASAā¦ I am OK with that. His tries does not break my BMS installation in any degree. And if one day he would share his work I probably would try it - with all caveats.
From the screens it looks impressive. From the clips also, but Iād like to see some really low flying.
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I-Hawk you donāt need to reduce the 3d object size Lod Editor does it already.
If you try to insert a super huge well not huge but extreme tris model it crashes.
So if he could import it as one object it would be in a res less than Falcon terrain to keep the tris down.
Now if he wanted more detail on the height map that pumps up the tris then he would had to cut the 3d object in to smaller pieces making itās stitching in Falcon if not impossible bit hard unless he did it like not centering the sub object to the 3dsmax scene and export from one file piece by piece, then it would stitch perfectly.Now that huge 3d object if it was one only object then the textures would load all at once I canāt see how this is flyable.
Iāve done tests with enormous tris models (like 80.000tris iirc and repeated 10-20 times in view) and low textures and with a GTX 580 with 3GB vram and 8gb ram and the system was barely flyable and those where not that huge as a country.So something doesnāt really connects the puzzle. either your cpu was 6Ghz+ and u had 64gb ram or more or you thought you disabled the GTX but falcon was still using it.
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So āsellingā 3d terrain objective āmethodā to them is like trying to sell passion fruit candy to a baby.
He will take it at first but then he taste it and want to kill you.Iām wiping tears of laughter from my eyes as I type thisā¦ thanks, I needed that. Great visual picture Iāve never tried passion fruit, only saw them on the trees on Crete in late Summer. Are they really that bad?
All the best, Uwe
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Iām wiping tears of laughter from my eyes as I type thisā¦ thanks, I needed that. Great visual picture Iāve never tried passion fruit, only saw them on the trees on Crete in late Summer. Are they really that bad?
All the best, Uwe
Maracuja? I only know yoghurts with maracuja and they are awesome!
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Like many here I am an old guy and been in the Falcon community for 20+ years. And have seen the generations change over time. So I just want to be clear here. So the common practice now in the Falcon community is to start trashing someoneās work instead of complimenting?? Iām just curious cause it seems to be the childish trend that is on this site lately. I get it, perhaps he is pissing people off because of his attitude or how he communicates? **** sake guys, move on and donāt communicate with him. If he produces something awesome, great. If he doesnāt who cares? Itās no loss to anyone.
You seem to be missing the point. If you look at the pictures and watch the videos, Wolfox is giving the impression here he can offer photorealistic terrain on a worldwide scale to Falcon4 which is clearly not the case. I-Hawk, quite rightly, is setting him straight. Trash deserves trashing. This revolutionary new terrain W has created is not going to revolutionise F4. It is eye-candy from altitude, nothing more.
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errr I donāt think the vids are from this but from stock ITO theater, those must be the ones showing the new F-16 skin.
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Like many here I am an old guy and been in the Falcon community for 20+ years. And have seen the generations change over time. So I just want to be clear here. So the common practice now in the Falcon community is to start trashing someoneās work instead of complimenting?? Iām just curious cause it seems to be the childish trend that is on this site lately. I get it, perhaps he is pissing people off because of his attitude or how he communicates? **** sake guys, move on and donāt communicate with him. If he produces something awesome, great. If he doesnāt who cares? Itās no loss to anyone.
Of course you have some good points here ā¦ but spreading false/inaccurate informations on the forum is not good as it could drives some other 3rd party Dev in the wrong direction making them potentially wasting lot of time and realize it too late in the process.
Some ppl complains about BMS Devs not communicating and not helping enough. But sometimes some of them do not like when our voices goes against their ābelieves/expectation.ā (Tomcatzās initial Ostsee theatre is a good example of partial āfailā because of bad decisions on initial process ā¦ too bad because it was really promising!). Fortunately some other ppl (AFAIK) were able to successfully straightening the project.
As you probably know, what we see on the screen and what happens in the core of the soft are two different things. Some people rely exclusively on what they see.
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errr I donāt think the vids are from this but from stock ITO theater, those must be the ones showing the new F-16 skin.
The terrain portrayed in his three videos are clearly not from any functioning F4 ITO Theater (unless Iāve missed an update somewhere?), but any which way, my point remains - he is trying to give the impression he has devised a revolutionary new terrain method for F4, which clearly he has not.
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I-Hawk you donāt need to reduce the 3d object size Lod Editor does it already.
If you try to insert a super huge well not huge but extreme tris model it crashes.
So if he could import it as one object it would be in a res less than Falcon terrain to keep the tris down.
Now if he wanted more detail on the height map that pumps up the tris then he would had to cut the 3d object in to smaller pieces making itās stitching in Falcon if not impossible bit hard unless he did it like not centering the sub object to the 3dsmax scene and export from one file piece by piece, then it would stitch perfectly.Now that huge 3d object if it was one only object then the textures would load all at once I canāt see how this is flyable.
Iāve done tests with enormous tris models (like 80.000tris iirc and repeated 10-20 times in view) and low textures and with a GTX 580 with 3GB vram and 8gb ram and the system was barely flyable and those where not that huge as a country.So something doesnāt really connects the puzzle. either your cpu was 6Ghz+ and u had 64gb ram or more or you thought you disabled the GTX but falcon was still using it.
Itās all a matter of how much you go with details and how much you can hold at once.
80x80 KM is hardly 1/160 of a full Falcon theater. Using sane resolution of say 4m/pixel, and you wonāt need more than 5x5 4096 textures = ~270MB ā> Not such a big deal.However, the mesh seem indeed very not detailed, possibly even worse than the 1KM Falcon terrain resolution.
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