Dcs World Viper and Falcon BMS
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I understand and would agree. I haven’t flown single player in DCS yet, I’ve only flown it multiplayer with my brother (which is the only reason I even have DCS). And these flights worked quite all right. But single player would probably frustrate me as well.
To experience those bugs you just need to fly a mission, regardless of multiplayer or singleplayer. AI in SP is the same AI in MP.
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On hoggit? I am 95% percent sure it is rather new trend after 4.34 AND DCS F-16.
For sure people are moving to DCS (and from DCS as well). Hell, even I decided few months ago to give DCS another chance. But while it does look and sound veeery good and has FAPTASTIC Tomcat and cool Harrier the whole exprience is rather disappointing…
But I am very biased and spoiled - it is hard for me to enjoy any SP/MP simulator other than BMS. I like Il-2 GB and CloD, but they also… suck in terms of overall exprience due to poor AI, ATC and so on.
And…if it was up to me I would have just closed these mushrooms after the rain who’s bigger threads after ten posts.
You will not learn anything new after that.
Even from my posts.100% agree, also applicable to my posts.
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Well yesterday I decided to fly a campaign mission in 4.34. The first one in 4.34 for me. I usually fly TE’s and it’s been a while since I flew in a campaign. But had quite a few issues there as well. Some simple things like my pilot voice and AWACS talking at the same time. I asked AWACS for a picture and as soon as AWACS started talking, my pilot voice started to call out bandits making AWACS impossible to hear. This is easily fixed of course by disabling my own pilot voice. But AWACS also stopped talking halfway through transmissions sometimes. Like Viper 2-1, I have 2 groups…first group…then nothing anymore. This happened 2 or 3 times during the mission. Then when I RTB’d at the end of the mission there was an aircraft stuck on the landing runway. He was just sitting there and was still there when I was shut down on the ramp. And after shut down I noticed ATC calling out to an AI flight if there was a problem so I started to look around and noticed some AI jets pointing at each other getting stuck trying to taxi. I admit these type of problems in BMS are quite rare and was quite surprised to run into these things, but all in all the campaign mission was a bit messy this time. Not what I’m used to in BMS.
I never experienced that in maybe 3000+ hours of BMS, so you’re pretty unlucky to experience that in a single flight…
On hoggit? I am 95% percent sure it is rather new trend after 4.34 AND DCS F-16.
Yup. There was always a rant thread there and there, but in the last 6-9 months they have become increasingly frequent;
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To experience those bugs you just need to fly a mission, regardless of multiplayer or singleplayer. AI in SP is the same AI in MP.
I’m very new to DCS, we’ve only flown a few basic 2v2 intercepts and dogfights so far. Nothing fancy. So can’t really judge yet. My brother has flown DCS a bit longer and he did say that the AI is pretty poor compared to BMS.
I never experienced that in maybe 3000+ hours of BMS, so you’re pretty unlucky to experience that in a single flight…
Me neither. This was the first campaign mission I flew since I have 4.34. But I’ve flown quite a few campaign missions in the past in 4.32 and 4.33 and never had this before either.
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If no one noticed, then I’ll tell you - there is no game in the DCS … in general, from the word at all. There is a desperate desire to make money on the big names of the models Mig 21, F-14, now Falcon.
But there is no game … whoever found, please show me,maybe i was looking not there.With Mig 21 it’s a shame, they sold the model so far and haven’t solved all of its bugs and will never solve it. Sold out and bye)). Correct me if I am wrong.
To be honest . I didn’t want and don’t want to discuss DCS in this place - I left it and made a choice for many reasons.
Here is Falcon’s HOUSE, and let’s talk about the beautiful without touching any DCS …https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=4257045#post4257045
This is my last conversation with Chizh on the forum.Talk about how different Falcon and DCS are.
I hope who such Chizh is not necessary to explain.
You can translate Google translator into English.My nickname on the form was “reg_zero” -
BMS is great realism but I think it should add some of this:
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Falcon4BMS is not really made to be played in external view nor made to make air-show video footages. DCS is perfect for this (however, a bit expensive).
F4BMS is rather focused on Combat Flight Simulation.
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BMS is great realism but I think it should add some of this:
If there was a sound, you would have heard how loud I laughed))) In addition to these tricks in DCS there is nothing more to do - the circus))).
Like the circus - enjoy. -
Falcon4BMS is not really made to be played in external view nor made to make air-show video footages. DCS is perfect for this (however, a bit expensive).
F4BMS is rather focused on Combat Flight Simulation.
A real, unpredictable battle in very different conditions - this is nowhere else. Believe me, I was looking in the afternoon with a flashlight.
Thank you very much men for saved up and improved Falcon - it simply has no equal. And probably will not be. Everything else wants beautiful fur under the ass instead of a real enemy.
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Here is my desktop - there is nothing more beautiful than the morning in Kunsan. My favorite shot. And my favorite plane. And my favorite game …
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No time for another “DCS round” so I’ll just post some interesting reads on Reddit for folks that want some real insight of what it is (I said it in other words myself many times here, with different wording)
The best 1 statement sum up of DCS I’ve ever read:
DCS is fantastically well modeled aircraft and great scenery stuffed into a terrible sim
And just today I saw this interesting thread:
https://www.reddit.com/r/hoggit/comments/gbnqlg/unpopular_opinion_taking_a_break_from_dcs/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2xEnjoy.
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Hi folks!
I found a phenomenon in my flight-sim community in China: Most of people under the age of 26 are favor of DCS. Most of people above the age of 28 are more like BMS.
No offense to anyone. if you want to be a mature Millitary-Sim fan, Please try BMS and feel her mature glamour! you have grown up, don’t be a kid anymore. :eek:
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I have a question of my own which I think this thread would be the best for. While the F-16 in BMS is recommended to be the more realistic jet the same question about other jets in the sim is no less significant. In that case we are dealing with flying other jets option Vs modules. For example, how well does the MIG-29 (with all it’s different variants) perform in BMS. Better still, the SU-25 which maneuvers better then any other fighter jet once you try to gun it! In as far as the most accurate sim, modeling the accurate performance of other jets is no less important than modeling the atmospheric ambience for the viper.
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I have a question of my own which I think this thread would be the best for. While the F-16 in BMS is recommended to be the more realistic jet the same question about other jets in the sim is no less significant. In that case we are dealing with flying other jets option Vs modules. For example, how well does the MIG-29 (with all it’s different variants) perform in BMS. Better still, the SU-25 which maneuvers better then any other fighter jet once you try to gun it! In as far as the most accurate sim, modeling the accurate performance of other jets is no less important than modeling the atmospheric ambience for the viper.
Other jets are modeled just fine as a “AI aircraft”. If you try to fly them then you will find possibly there is no dedicated 3D cockpit and of course all avionics are same as the F-16.
However, our AI is ok and working.The SU-25 is not more maneuverable than anything… if you saw it doing funny crap, then it’s a bug, don’t confuse it with features. And bugs are to be squashed, eventually.
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BMS is great realism but I think it should add some of this:
It seems these all sounded exactly the same
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BMS is great realism but I think it should add some of this:
Here you go for the BMS F-16:
https://www.benchmarksims.org/forum/showthread.php?37692-New-External-F16-Fighter-sounds
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Other jets are modeled just fine as a “AI aircraft”. If you try to fly them then you will find possibly there is no dedicated 3D cockpit and of course all avionics are same as the F-16.
However, our AI is ok and working.The SU-25 is not more maneuverable than anything… if you saw it doing funny crap, then it’s a bug, don’t confuse it with features. And bugs are to be squashed, eventually.
The ai in bms is ok and probably better than other sims, and better than dcs I understand. But the ai still needs a lot of love. I love bms and think it’s amazing what you guys have done. But Dee-Jay was talking about things that are showstoppers for him in DCS. For me seeing a lot of ai aircraft getting shot down when they go up against even basic level of air defenses is taking away a lot of realism for me. Recreating large missions as described in books like Vipers in the storm is also not possible in bms without having most of the strike package shot down. Of course this has been an issue in every sim I have flown so far. So yes, bms ai is probably better than other sims, but still not great.
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The ai in bms is ok and probably better than other sims, and better than dcs I understand. But the ai still needs a lot of love. I love bms and think it’s amazing what you guys have done. But Dee-Jay was talking about things that are showstoppers for him in DCS. For me seeing a lot of ai aircraft getting shot down when they go up against even basic level of air defenses is taking away a lot of realism for me. Recreating large missions as described in books like Vipers in the storm is also not possible in bms without having most of the strike package shot down. Of course this has been an issue in every sim I have flown so far. So yes, bms ai is probably better than other sims, but still not great.
Well depends who you want to fly the large package. AI is way difficult to apply real time tactics. As we know each mission is a unique case. So you understand that this is rather not feasible for ai. But if you want that super large package to be flawn by humans only then things get very very exciting… Don’t forget squadrons cooperation and joint missions in case one squadron can’t fill all the slots for a huge package. There are such and very very realistic and demanding. You can’t be a lone wolf or a lets go up to shoot guys vpilot or a i have a high kill ratio guy and expect to do well or even basics on such packages. There lies the essence of bms. Not all are sweet, cause the main issue here is the level of coordination and knowledge of the vpilots. But since you want simulation and realism, the good captain they say its proven on a storm, like are you up for the challenge of realism or just shoot em up? Inset coin please.
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The ai in bms is ok and probably better than other sims, and better than dcs I understand. But the ai still needs a lot of love. I love bms and think it’s amazing what you guys have done. But Dee-Jay was talking about things that are showstoppers for him in DCS. For me seeing a lot of ai aircraft getting shot down when they go up against even basic level of air defenses is taking away a lot of realism for me. Recreating large missions as described in books like Vipers in the storm is also not possible in bms without having most of the strike package shot down. Of course this has been an issue in every sim I have flown so far. So yes, bms ai is probably better than other sims, but still not great.
DC in BMS simulates full scale conflict. During first and especially second war in the Persian Gulf enemy airforce was almost completely grounded. This is not the case here in BMS. Even Vietnam war was a different thing.
While I agree there is always a room for improvement in AI department I really wish other titles have a fraction of BMS AI behaviours implemented.
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But Dee-Jay was talking about things that are showstoppers for him in DCS. For me seeing a lot of ai aircraft getting shot down when they go up against even basic level of air defenses
I got your point. As you said, nothing is perfect. But in terms of priority, what you are describing in not on the top of the list unless you do not fly a mission from A to Z. Before reaching FLOT and ENY area, AIs must be able to taxi, depart, join, push on time … etc …
and we are missing some details here …getting shot down when they go up against even basic level of air defenses
Precisely what?
AAA? … Should be have AIs immune to AAA by only jinking?
SA-2? Should be have AIs immune to SA-2?
SA-7? Should be have AIs immune to SA-7?… what should they do on each situations? Can you describe all the possible cases?
What you are describing here a complete different level of implementation than “just” making an AI able to land on an airfield without colliding with the preceding a/c, or choosing an active runway QFU depending on wind direction and strength …
AIs are robots … the most difficult with robots, is making them behaving like human and being credible. They must not be completely perfect, but not completely dumb either. The balance is the most tricky stuff in AI coding. Simply defining it before coding it is already a big deal (IFF is a good example here). What you are talking about are not basic stuff. It is way advanced programming.