The CBU 97/105 Effectiveness (lack there of)
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Looking at ACMI… they come in on correct azimuth and with roughly desired separation, in the air / in time… but they burst/impact at almost the exact same spot.
This pair was launched az=270, ba=1200 ft, separation=3000 ft … for scale I believe this column is about 6000 ft long.
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@airtex2019 thanks we probably need to take a look at this.
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@Seifer is it possible that cbu covarage can be modded/edited ? Or is it up to you guys to fix ?
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@SyntaxErol it is, though I am not the best person to say how. Still, editing the CBU value without proper guidance or agreement is like cheating imho.
But you are free to fly however you want. You may have problems in MP though, as I think server checks the db.
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@Seifer I meant to add – the aim-point here was directly on the “T” intersection of the two columns.
The first pig hit with desired offset from that point, but the second pig hit nearly exactly the same units – scored zero additional kills, maybe a little added splash damage to some trucks.
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@Seifer well i couldnt realy achieve the desired covarage via editing the attached cbu105 page on editor. Increased damage/blast radius to near nuclear levels but still nothing after hitting save. Maybe im doing wrong ? Maybe there is a different way to edit its performance ? Im a bit lost tbh
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@SyntaxErol as I said, it depends on the damage model of the weapon. Some of those values will be completely ignored. Probably someone from Db side can help here, not really my area.
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So my workaround for now is to just launch singles. (Which is frankly easier than trying to guesstimate the exact distance between two points on the FCR.)
I would say, they do also seem to have better effect when azimuth aligned with the target column. Avg ~3-4 kills vs 1-2 kills.
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Because ya’ll searchin’ for trouble in a wrong place. Editing db won’t help much else then change HE to AP. and hit ratio… but ‘bombdata’ may have some “impact” .
But!!!, be real, AGM154/CBU-87 is NOT anti-tank weapon… can you imagine skeet burning through armor of M1A1 or T90 ? which can sustain direct hit with 100mm HE shell …(maybe not APFSDS) … but you get the pic.
It is even questionable for MK-20D(100) … for today’s armors., old stuff like M-60 or T-64… older T-72 …probably yes…
But even new T-72/80(90’s mod)… I would need to see it to believe it can pierce/penetrate those “can’s”.Also, now, not sure is it modeled correctly, but clusters footprint is never a circle… but ellipsis. - there’s even nice pic of it in 1-1. - somehow, exactly for AGM154A .
No wonder you have to hit a column “inline” to get more hits… hints … whatever -
Tanks are still very thin from top.
And very fragile, lots of T-90’s are burning on ukraine Fields now…
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@Seifer Any insight from the code on this?
@jayb said in The CBU 97/105 Effectiveness (lack there of):
That old post brought up some interesting points. Is burst altitude stated in Sea Level or AGL ? Seems to be some mixed information in that thread and that is pretty crucial for the dispersion
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@jayb sorry, no code access this week. Remind me next week.
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@jayb said in The CBU 97/105 Effectiveness (lack there of):
@Seifer Any insight from the code on this?
@jayb said in The CBU 97/105 Effectiveness (lack there of):
That old post brought up some interesting points. Is burst altitude stated in Sea Level or AGL ? Seems to be some mixed information in that thread and that is pretty crucial for the dispersion
There’s a pretty tight limit on the MFD input (I think 2000 ft or something like that?) so I sincerely hope it’s AGL.
As always I have no idea what’s more realistic, MSL or AGL. I can think of arguments either way.
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@SyntaxErol only a few fields as shown in the editor are used. The interesting info is in the .dat files
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@haukka81 said in The CBU 97/105 Effectiveness (lack there of):
And very fragile, lots of T-90’s are burning on ukraine Fields now…
I certainly doubt that.
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@white_fang do you doubt that the T-90 has suffered losses or that they were due to top attacks of SFW skeets level munitions?
Just saying the Oryx blog has documentated over 40 T-90s lost. Most of these probably due to top attack missiles like the Javelin, which admittedly are a different class than CBU-97 skeets. EDIT: @white_fang I see that you were referring to the BLU-97/B bomblets carried by the CBU-87/AGM-154 while I believe @haukka81 was talking about the thread topic of CBU-97/105’s BLU-108.Also even if it can’t get through turret top armor, BLU-108 skeet probably can reach the engine compartment of most tanks from the top fairly easily, resulting in the worst kind of M kill. To be fair though, I’m not familiar with the T-90’s top armor levels.
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@Snake122 said in The CBU 97/105 Effectiveness (lack there of):
@white_fang do you doubt that the T-90 has suffered losses or that they were due to top attacks of SFW skeets level munitions?
Just saying the Oryx blog has documentated over 40 T-90s lost. Most of these probably due to top attack missiles like the Javelin, which admittedly are a different class than CBU-97 skeets.Also even if it can’t get through turret top armor, skeet probably can reach the engine compartment of most tanks from the top fairly easily, resulting in the worst kind of M kill. To be fair though, I’m not familiar with the T-90’s top armor levels.
Top armor on tanks are still low. The engine compartment of a t90 has hatches for maintenence which is a even lower armor value. However this is not the discussion here. Sfws fire at random heat/infrared signatures that resembles a vehicle while spinning in the air efp they fire can hit anywhere in a vehicle. Its not a guaranteed one shot kill miracle skeet (insert rambo shooting a helicopter with explosive tipped arrow)
However. The covarage of in game 97/105 is much less than reported figures. Thats obvious and you can see yourselves using tgp referances such as meterstick and frag circle.
I would be happy if the covarage would equal to reported values but some skeets miss/fail to destroy a target in killzone. This hitchance of skeets can be increased by dropping in pairs to same location. But thats not the case, while sfw destroy prettymuch everything in their smaller then reported killzone, they lack the covarage.
Im not after creating the wonder weapon, but these weapons have created to deal with extensive armored/vehicle quantity of redfor in staging phase of units but fail to do so imho.However @Kavelenko achieved success with 97. I will try to finetune bombdata with his procedures. Maybe 97s and 105s have a difference that i can not see. Or maybe lower altitude droppings of bombs with canisters still move at planes/columns axis in considerable speed yield to better longitudinal dispersion.
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@SyntaxErol just something I remembered. The higher the BA, the bigger the area will be. But it will cause less damage. I usually set BA to 1800 iirc.